>> WELL, I'M SO HONORED TO HAVE YOU HERE.
>> I'M EXCITED TO BE HERE I LOVE IT.
>> I -- WELL, I'M -- WE WERE TALKING OFF CAMERA AND I
WAS SAYING HOW I'M JUST SUCH A HUGE BELIEVER IN
EVERYTHING THAT YOU'RE DOING.
AND I THINK THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE PEOPLE IN THE
SPACE WHO CAN BRIDGE, LIKE THE SCIENCE AND THE
PSYCHOLOGY WITH THE WORD.
BECAUSE OUR MENTAL HEALTH
AND OUR EMOTIONAL WELL-BEING IS SO IMPORTANT.
AND I JUST THINK A LOT OF TIMES IN THE CHURCH,
THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT ASPECT.
AND YOU HAVE YOUR DOCTORATE,
YOU'RE A PSYCHOLOGIST, SO YOU KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING
ABOUT, BUT YOU'RE ALSO A BORN-AGAIN BELIEVER.
SO, YOU KNOW, THERE'S NOT MANY PEOPLE THAT ARE
BRIDGING THESE WORLDS.
BUT IT'S SO IMPORTANT FOR BELIEVERS.
>> ABSOLUTELY.
AND I ACTUALLY, WHEN I WAS IN GRAD SCHOOL,
I WENT TO A CHRISTIAN UNIVERSITY FOR MY PHD,
AND THEY TALK ABOUT CHRISTIAN INTEGRATION,
ABOUT INTEGRATING THE DIFFERENT FIELDS.
AND I ACTUALLY DON'T PREFER THAT WORD.
I LIKE TO SAY I DO TRANSLATION.
>> I LIKE THAT.
>> HOW DOES WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS TRANSLATE TO THIS
QUESTION OR THIS ISSUE?
BECAUSE WHEN YOU JUST TRY AND BRING THEM TOGETHER,
SOMETIMES THAT'S STILL VERY CHALLENGING,
ESPECIALLY FOR PEOPLE IN THE AREAS OF THE BODY OF
CHRIST THAT I GREW UP IN, WHICH IS LIKE HARDCORE
PENTECOSTAL, SPIRITUAL GIFT.
AND SO EVERYTHING NEEDED TO BE EXPLAINED THROUGH
THE LENS OF SCRIPTURE.
AND SO I LEARNED TO START THERE.
I SOMETIMES SAY BIBLE WAS MY FIRST LANGUAGE BECAUSE
I'M A PASTOR'S KID.
I'M A PASTOR'S GRANDKID.
MY MOM AND DAD BOTH PREACH,
AND SO EVERYTHING WAS AROUND.
WHAT DOES THE BIBLE SAY ABOUT THAT?
AND NOT JUST IN BEHAVIOR LIKE,
ARE YOU ALLOWED TO DO THIS OR THAT?
BUT HOW DOES THE BIBLE CAUSE US TO UNDERSTAND THIS?
HOW DOES IT TEACH US TO THINK ABOUT IT?
AND SO I WAS REALLY GIVEN THE BIBLE AS AN
EXPLANATORY FRAMEWORK AS A KID.
AND SO EVERYTHING FOR ME COMES BACK TO BIBLE.
CAN I TELL YOU A STORY REAL QUICK TO EXPLAIN THAT?
SO WHEN I WAS IN PROBABLY MIDDLE SCHOOL,
THE FIRST TIME I LEARNED THE FORMULA E EQUALS MC SQUARED,
THAT MEANS ENERGY EQUALS MASS MOVED AT THE
SPEED OF LIGHT SQUARED.
IF YOU MOVE SOMETHING SUPER FAST, IT DISAPPEARS.
AND WHEN I LEARNED THAT, MY FIRST THOUGHT WAS, OH,
THAT MUST BE HOW THE RAPTURE IS GOING TO HAPPEN.
IT SAYS THAT WE'LL BE CHANGED IN A TWINKLING
OF AN EYE.
AND SO THAT'S HOW MY MIND HAS ALWAYS WORKED.
IF I LEARN SOMETHING IN SCIENCE, IN THE SPACE,
IMMEDIATELY IT STARTS TO TRANSLATE TO WHAT I KNOW
FROM SCRIPTURE AND BACK.
AND I KNOW THAT'S NOT NORMAL,
BUT THAT'S HOW GOD HAS ALWAYS HAD MY BRAIN.
SO I'VE BEEN LOOKING AT SCIENCE AND BIOLOGY AND
PHYSICS AND CHEMISTRY THROUGH THE LENS OF
SCRIPTURE PRETTY MUCH MY ENTIRE LIFE.
>> THAT'S SO FASCINATING.
THAT'S HOW GOD, THAT'S A GIFT YOU HAVE.
IT'S HOW GOD'S WIRED YOU.
BUT WHAT'S SO INTERESTING IS WITH YOUR NEW BOOK,
THE GARDEN WITHIN , THERE'S THIS FOUNDATIONAL CONCEPT
OF THE TREE OF LIFE AND THAT BEING WITHIN US.
CAN YOU UNPACK THAT?
>> YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.
SO I WANTED TO WRITE A BOOK THAT DEFINED WHAT IT
MEANS TO BE WELL.
THIS ISN'T A BOOK ABOUT MENTAL
ILLNESS OR SICKNESS.
IT'S ABOUT WHAT THE BIBLE TELLS US WELL-BEING LOOKS
LIKE SPIRITUALLY, EMOTIONALLY, MENTALLY,
PHYSICALLY, RELATIONALLY.
HOW DO WE DEFINE WELLNESS?
BECAUSE WHEN YOU START TALKING ABOUT ILLNESS
WITHOUT A DEFINITION OF WELLNESS,
HOW DO YOU KNOW WHAT YOUR GOAL IS?
PEOPLE ARE IN THESE HEALING JOURNEYS,
BUT WHERE DO THEY END?
>> THAT'S SO GOOD.
>> DO THEY END JUST WHEN YOU'RE NOT
IN PAIN ANYMORE?
OR DO THEY END AT A DEFINITION OF WELLNESS?
AND SO I WANTED TO SEE WHAT SCRIPTURE HAD
TO SAY ABOUT WELLNESS.
SO WHEN I WAS IN MY PHD PROGRAM,
THE FIRST NEUROSCIENCE CLASS THAT I TOOK,
I SAW A PICTURE OF A NEURON,
AND I WAS STRUCK BY IT BECAUSE IT LOOKED
LIKE A SEEDLING.
AND I'M LIKE, THIS NEURON LOOKS LIKE A PLANT.
NOW, IF I BELIEVE IN THE GOD OF MY SUNDAY SCHOOL
BOOK, THAT HE CREATED THE HEAVENS AND THE EARTH,
AND HE MADE PLANTS ON DAY THREE AND US ON DAY SIX,
THEN THERE MUST HAVE BEEN INTENTION BEHIND HAVING
OUR NEURONS LOOK LIKE PLANTS.
AND THEN IMMEDIATELY, I STARTED THINKING
OF ALL THESE SCRIPTURES.
WE ARE LIKE TREES PLANTED BY RIVERS OF WATER,
AND HE WILL PLANT THEM IN THEIR OWN LAND.
I MEAN, IT'S CONSTANTLY THE ANALOGIES OF GARDEN
ARE USED IN SCRIPTURE.
AND SO I JUST STARTED SEEING IT WAS LIKE ALL
THESE LIGHTS STARTED COMING ON BOTANY,
BIOLOGY, SCRIPTURE.
AND EVERY TIME I SAW A MATCH,
I STARTED TO DIVE DEEPER INTO THAT.
AND SO WHAT WE FIND IS THAT THE BIBLE GIVES
GARDENS AS A DEFINITION OF WELL-BEING.
IN ISAIAH 58:11 IT SAYS THAT I WILL,
MAY THE LORD GUIDE YOU CONTINUALLY,
AND THAT HE WILL MAKE YOU AS A WELL-WATERED GARDEN
WHO SPRINGS OF WATER FAIL NOT.
AND SO THE GARDEN IS ACTUALLY OUR DEFINITION
OF WELL-BEING.
THEN YOU JUMP TO MATTHEW CHAPTER 13,
THE PARABLE OF THE SOWER,
AND JESUS GIVES US THE PIECES.
HE SAYS, SEEDS ARE WORDS, AND THAT THE SOIL
IS THE HEART.
THAT'S OUR EMOTION SPACE.
AND THEN THE PLANT SPRINGS UP.
WELL, IT ALREADY LOOKS LIKE A NEURON.
SO THERE'S OUR THOUGHTS.
AND THEN HE SAYS, THE FRUIT IS WHAT WE DO.
SEED, SOIL, PLANT, FRUIT, BELIEFS, EMOTIONS,
THOUGHTS, BEHAVIOR.
AND NOW WE HAVE A VIEW OF HUMAN BEHAVIOR
DIRECTLY FROM SCRIPTURE.
AND THAT VIEW ACTUALLY CONTRADICTED SOME OF
PSYCHOLOGY'S MAIN ASSESSMENTS AT THE TIME,
WHICH IS THAT OUR THOUGHTS CREATE OUR FEELINGS.
BUT PLANTS DON'T MAKE SOIL.
SOIL GROWS PLANTS
>> SPEAK, OKAY,
SO SPEAK TO THAT.
>> YEAH.
THE, THE DOMINATING THOUGHT IN PSYCHOLOGY AND HUMAN
BEHAVIOR FOREVER WAS THAT THE MIND IS MORE POWERFUL
THAN THE HEART, THAT EMOTIONS NEEDED TO BE
SUBJUGATED BY THE MIND IN ORDER FOR US
TO BE IN CONTROL.
I'D LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT THAT WAS THE ORIGINAL SIN,
WASN'T IT?
THAT WE WANTED TO KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN GOOD
AND EVIL, RIGHT?
OUR PURSUIT OF THE MIND MESSED US UP IN THE FIRST
PLACE, AND THAT HAS CONTINUED TO BE
A THEME IN HUMAN SOCIETY.
AND UNFORTUNATELY IN THE CHURCH,
THAT THE MIND, RENEW YOUR MIND, CAPTURE THOUGHTS.
BUT WHEN YOU REALLY STUDY SCRIPTURE HOLISTICALLY,
YOU'LL SEE THAT THE HEART IS MENTIONED LIKE A
THOUSAND TIMES, AND THE MIND'S MENTIONED
LIKE A HUNDRED TIMES.
AND SO WHEN JESUS CLARIFIES THAT THE SOIL IS
THE HEART AND HE EVEN USES EMOTION LANGUAGE, IT SAYS,
FOR INSTANCE, OF THE STONY GROUND,
THE SEED WAS RECEIVED WITH JOY.
BUT THEN WHEN THE SUN CAME OUT,
THERE WAS OFFENSE AND THE THORNS ARE ANXIETY.
SO HE'S DEFINING THE SOIL IN EMOTION TERMS.
THIS IS NOT A FIGURE OF SPEECH.
IF THE SOIL WHERE I AM EMOTIONALLY IS THE
DETERMINATION ON WHETHER THE SEED FINDS A FERTILE
SPACE, AND THEN THE PLANT IS THE MIND THAT GROWS
FROM THE SOIL OF MY HEART,
IT SOUNDS LIKE I NEED TO BE GIVING MUCH MORE
ATTENTION TO THE SOIL THAN THE PLANT.
I MEAN, A PLANT IS DEFINED BY WHERE IT'S PLANTED.
IT'S CALLED A PLANT, LIKE IT'S DEFINED
BY THE SOIL THAT IT'S IN.
AND SO ONCE I REALIZED THAT, OH MY GOSH,
EMOTION IS ACTUALLY PRECEDING, THINKING.
IF YOU GO TO YOUR KING JAMES VERSION SO THAT YOU
CAN GET CLOSER TO THE ORIGINAL TRANSCRIPTS,
ANY SCRIPTURE THAT YOU LOOK AT THAT HAS THE WORD
HEART AND MIND IN IT,
HEART ALWAYS COMES FIRST.
>> WOW.
>> EVERY SINGLE TIME THE WORD TRANSLATE IS HEART COMES
BEFORE THE WORD TRANSLATE IS MIND.
IF YOU LOOK AT EVERY SCRIPTURE THAT HAS HEART
AND SPIRIT IN IT, HEART COMES FIRST,
SPIRIT COMES SECOND.
AND SO THE ORDERING IS THERE CONSTANTLY.
>> AND THAT'S ON PURPOSE.
>> IT'S ON --
IT'S GOD.
IT'S OUR BIBLE, RIGHT?
BUT WE SPEND SO MUCH TIME THINKING ABOUT THE CULTURE
IN WHICH THE BIBLE WAS WRITTEN,
BUT WE FORGET TO CHECK ON THE CULTURAL MOMENT IN
WHICH IT'S BEING READ.
HOW ARE MY WORLDVIEW LENSES CAUSING ME TO MISS
THINGS IN THIS WORD?
AND WHEN I GREW UP IN A SPACE THAT SAYS MIND OVER
MATTER AND YOUR THINKING MATTERS,
AND I GO INTO MY BIBLE BIASED FOR THAT.
BUT WHEN I PULLED BACK THE LENS AND STARTED FOLLOWING
THE GARDEN, I FOUND OUT WE WERE WRONG ABOUT THAT.
AND IT WAS SHOCKING TO ME BECAUSE, LISTEN,
I'M, I'M A BRAINY CHICK, RIGHT?
I WANT TO DO THE THINKING, BUT IT TURNS OUT THAT THE
HEART IS EVERYTHING.
WITH THE HEART, WE BELIEVE UNTO SALVATION.
NOBODY EVER GAVE THEIR LIFE TO JESUS STOICALLY.
WHO GAVE THEIR LIFE TO JESUS,
LIKE, OH, SURE.
YOU WANT TO BELIEVE ON JESUS?
SURE, I'LL BELIEVE ON THAT
A GUY ROSE FROM THE DEAD AND CHANGED MY WHOLE LIFE.
WHY NOT?
EVERY ONE OF US WAS CRYING.
WE WERE MOVED EMOTIONALLY TO FOLLOW JESUS,
LIKE OUR HEARTS MATTER.
AND SO MY BOOK I'M SHOWING THAT FIRST WE NEED TO GET
THE RIGHT VIEW OF WHAT IT MEANS TO BE WELL,
AND THEN WE CAN START REPAIRING WHAT'S BROKEN
AND UNDERSTANDING WHERE WE ARE EMOTIONALLY,
AND HOW THAT'S MADE CENTRAL TO HOW WE WERE CREATED,
THEN WE WORK FROM THERE.
>> IT'S SO INTERESTING BECAUSE I REMEMBER WHEN I
WAS LISTENING TO WHOLE BRAIN CHILD,
THE PSYCHOLOGIST, AND THAT HE TRIED TO COME UP WITH
THE DEFINITION OF MENTAL WELLNESS BECAUSE HE SAID
IN THE FIELD THERE WAS JUST WHAT'S WRONG?
AND WE HAVE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT'S RIGHT,
BECAUSE LIKE YOU SAID, YOU HAVE TO HAVE THAT GOAL...
>> YEAH.
>> THAT YOU AIM TOWARDS.
AND SO FROM THERE, BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND
WHERE YOU'RE GOING.
AND THAT'S WHY I THINK OF A GARDEN,
BECAUSE A GARDEN IS A PLACE THAT'S CULTIVATED.
>> YES.
>> SO WE HAVE TO CULTIVATE THE SPACE.
AND SO YOU TALK ABOUT TRAUMA AND THESE DIFFERENT
THINGS THAT CAN THINGS THAT CAN CAUSE PROBLEMS
WITHIN OUR GARDEN, BUT HOW WE CAN RECEIVE HEALING.
>> YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.
I COMPARE TRAUMAS TO EARTHQUAKES.
SO WE UNDERSTAND A GARDEN, RIGHT.
AND WHEN SOMETHING SHAKES THE GROUND SO MUCH,
THINGS ARE UPROOTED.
THERE CAN BE FLOODS, THERE CAN --
WE CAN BE OVERWHELMED.
IN FACT, WE OFTEN TALK ABOUT EMOTIONAL FLOODING
AS SOMEONE, WHEN THEY'RE OVERWHELMED.
WE USE THE WORD FLOODING, WHICH IS, WHICH IS ACTUALLY
VERY CONGRUENT WITH THE BIBLE,
THE WATER IN THE GARDEN.
AND SO EARTHQUAKES COME, THEY SHAKE THINGS UP,
AND THEN WE HAVE TO RECOVER FROM WHAT IS
BROKEN FROM THAT.
AND SO TRAUMA DOES CHANGE US.
IT CHANGES US BIOLOGICALLY.
AND EMOTION IS A BODILY EXPERIENCE.
AND SO WHEN MY NERVOUS SYSTEM CHANGES,
MY EMOTIONAL EXPERIENCES CHANGE.
AND I REALLY WANT OUR LISTENERS TO HEAR THAT
BECAUSE SO MANY OF YOUR LISTENERS ARE JESUS
FOLLOWERS, WE HAVE TO RECOGNIZE THAT EMOTIONS
ARE BODILY EXPERIENCES, NOT THOUGHT PRODUCTS.
AND WE KNOW THAT BECAUSE WE'LL SAY, WELL,
I GOT TO THINK DIFFERENT.
YOU KNOW, MY STINKING THINKING IS CAUSING
THESE PAINFUL EMOTIONS.
THE BIBLE DOESN'T SHOW ME THAT.
HEBREWS 4:15 SAYS, WE HAVE NOT A HIGH PRIEST WHO
CANNOT BE TOUCHED BY THE FEELINGS OF OUR
INFIRMITIES, OUR HUMAN WEAKNESSES.
HE WAS TEMPTED IN EVERY WAY, YET WITHOUT SIN.
SO FIRST OF ALL, IF HE FELT EVERYTHING WE FEEL
AND HE NEVER SINNED, NO EMOTION CAN BE A SIN.
>> THAT'S TRUE.
>> THAT'S HUMONGOUSLY IMPORTANT.
>> YEAH.
>> IT'S HUMONGOUSLY IMPORTANT.
JESUS FELT EVERY EMOTION WE FEEL AND HE NEVER SINNED.
AND SO OUR EMOTIONS ARE THERE.
THE ONLY REASON JESUS COULD FEEL EVERY EMOTION
WE FEEL IS BECAUSE HE PUT ON A HUMAN BODY.
THAT'S IT.
OTHERWISE, JESUS HAD STINKING THINKING WHEN HE
WAS CRYING IN GETHSEMANE.
IF OUR MINDS CREATE OUR PAINFUL EMOTIONS,
THEN THAT MEANS JESUS WAS THINKING BADLY WHEN HE
CRIED OUTSIDE LAZARUS'S TOMB OR WHEN HE FLIPPED
TABLES IN ANGER.
AND WE KNOW THE BIBLE SAYS,
LET THIS MIND BE IN YOU, WHICH WAS ALSO IN CHRIST
JESUS, WHICH MEANS HIS MIND WAS PERFECT.
AND SO, YEAH, WE NEED TO STOP TRYING
TO OUTTHINK OUR EMOTIONS.
THEY ARE BODILY EXPERIENCES,
AND EVERY TIME JESUS EXPRESSED PHYSICALLY,
EMOTIONALLY TEARS, EVERY TIME HE EXPRESSED A
PAINFUL EMOTION, SOMETHING MIRACULOUS HAPPENED.
EVERY TIME HE HAD A BREAKDOWN,
SOMETHING BROKE THROUGH.
>> THAT'S SO TRUE.
>> EVERY TIME.
BUT WE TRY SO HARD NOT TO BREAK DOWN THAT WE'RE
OFTEN MISSING OUR BREAKTHROUGH.
>> AND THAT'S NOT GOOD.
>> NOT GOOD.
>> THAT'S ACTUALLY CAUSES A LOT OF PROBLEMS IF WE
STORE OUR EMOTIONS UP.
SO MY QUESTION TO YOU IS WHAT --
SO ARE THE EMOTIONS,
YOU'RE SAYING THEY COME FROM THE HEART.
>> THEY ARE, YES.
ACTUALLY, WE KNOW NOW THAT OUR BIOLOGICAL HEART IS
INVOLVED IN IT, 100%.
BUT ALSO OUR, OUR METAPHORICAL HEART.
OUR EMOTIONS ARE BODILY EXPERIENCES,
OUR AUTONOMIC NERVOUS SYSTEM,
THE SAME PART OF OUR NERVOUS SYSTEM THAT MAKES
US BREATHE WITHOUT THINKING,
MAKES OUR HEART BEAT, WITHOUT OUR VOLITION.
ANYONE WANT TO TRY RIGHT NOW,
CLOSE YOUR EYES AND BE LIKE,
TRY TO MAKE YOUR HEART STOP BEATING.
NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.
>> YEAH.
>> YOU'RE NOT POWERFUL ENOUGH.
WE GIVE OUR MINDS TOO MUCH POWER.
I CANNOT THINK MY HEART OUT OF BEATING, RIGHT?
>> NO.
>> AND SO OUR AUTONOMIC NERVOUS SYSTEM,
WHICH MAKES MY HEART BEAT, WHICH MAKES MY LUNGS
INFLATE, ALSO RESPONDS WHEN I HAVE EXTERNAL
EXPERIENCES AND I HAVE A BODILY RESPONSE TO THEM.
THOSE ARE OUR EMOTIONS.
SO WHEN I AM THREATENED, I HAVE A BODILY RESPONSE
THAT WE CALL FEAR.
WHEN I LOSE SOMETHING VALUABLE TO ME,
I HAVE A BODILY RESPONSE CALLED SADNESS.
MY CHEST FEELS HEAVY, MY STOMACH GETS TIGHT,
MY EYES WANT TO CRY.
THOSE ARE BODILY RESPONSES TO THE EXPERIENCES
THAT I HAVE.
>> SO THEY'RE ALSO PHYSICAL, OUR EMOTIONS?
>> THEY AREN'T ALSO PHYSICAL,
THEY ARE PHYSICAL.
>> THEY ARE PHYSICAL.
DEAD MEN DON'T CRY.
>> YEAH, SURE.
[ LAUGHTER ]
>> WELL, NO ONE'S EVER FRAMED IT THAT WAY.
SO I FEEL LIKE I'M JUST, LIKE,
LITTLE MIND BLOWN OVER HERE.
>> THEY'RE ABSOLUTELY PHYSICAL.
HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT YOU'RE SAD?
>> WELL, I KNOW, YOU FEEL IT.
>> WHERE?
>> YOU FEEL IT.
>> WHERE?
>> LIKE --
WELL, IF YOU,
IF YOU'RE CRYING.
BUT LIKE, A LOT OF TIMES I'LL FEEL THINGS LIKE
RIGHT IN MY GUT.
>> YEAH.
HOW DO YOU KNOW YOU'RE MAD?
JAW STARTS GETTING TIGHT.
YOU FEEL A LITTLE HOT.
>> OR IF YOU'RE ANXIOUS, YOU CAN GET,
YOUR HEART STARTS GOING CRAZY, SWEATING.
>> YOU FEEL YOUR INTESTINES DOING A THING.
YOUR MOUTH GETS DRY.
>> YES.
>> THAT'S HOW YOU KNOW HOW YOU FEEL.
THIS IS NOT AN ABSTRACT CONCEPT.
>> SO THE BIG MISTAKE RIGHT NOW IS PEOPLE ARE
SWITCHING THE TWO.
SO THEN WHAT WOULD YOU SAY THE PURPOSE OF OUR --
WHAT ARE THE PURPOSE OF OUR EMOTIONS.
AND THEN WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO SOMEONE,
BECAUSE WE'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE LED BY OUR EMOTIONS,
CORRECT?
LIKE WHAT,
WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THAT?
>> I BELIEVE THERE'S A LOT MORE CENTRAL ROLE,
A MUCH MORE CENTRAL ROLE THAN WE WOULD LIKE.
SO WE WILL DO ANYTHING WE CAN TO TRY AND GET AWAY
FROM OUR EMOTIONS, ESPECIALLY OUR PAINFUL ONES.
OKAY, WE'RE USED TO NOT BE ALLOWED TO HAVE THEM, RIGHT?
YOU JUST HAD TO PUT THEM ASIDE.
FAITH OVER FEELINGS.
DON'T LET YOUR FEELINGS DISRUPT YOUR FAITH.
THEN PEOPLE STARTED REALIZING,
DEFINITELY DURING THE PANDEMIC,
PEOPLE WERE SO EMOTIONALLY OVERWHELMED THEY WERE
LIKE, OKAY, MAYBE WE NEED TO RETHINK THIS.
YOU CAN FEEL IT, BUT DON'T LET THEM BE IN CHARGE.
LIKE WE'RE STILL ALWAYS GUARDING AGAINST THEM
WHEN OUR EMOTIONS ARE ACTUALLY GIVING US
REALLY IMPORTANT INFORMATION.
SO IT'S JUST LIKE BEING HUNGRY.
IF WE DON'T EAT ALL DAY LONG,
WE HAVE HUNGER PANGS, RIGHT?
AND THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH HAVING A HUNGER PANG.
BUT WHEN I GO TO THE GROCERY STORE AT 5:00,
IF I HAVEN'T EATEN ALL DAY,
THE CHANCES OF ME GETTING THE FRIED CHICKEN FROM THE
DELI IS HIGHER THAN ME GOING TO BUY THE HEALTHY
PIECE OF FISH AND GOING HOME AND GRILLING IT.
WHY?
BECAUSE I'VE LET MY NEED GET SO BIG THAT NOW I'M
ACTUALLY NOT MAKING THE DECISION I MIGHT HAVE MADE
WHEN I ATE IF I ATE BREAKFAST.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?
>> YEAH.
THAT MAKES SENSE.
>> AND SO THINK OF PAINFUL EMOTIONS: SADNESS, ANGER,
FEAR AS HUNGER PANGS
FOR SOMETHING WE NEED.
HUMANS NEED FOOD, WATER, SHELTER TO SURVIVE.
BUT WE ALSO NEED CONNECTION,
WE NEED A SENSE OF VALUE,
AND WE NEED SAFETY, WHICH IS PROVIDED BY LOVE.
WHEN I AM HUNGRY FOR THOSE THINGS,
WHEN I'M HUNGRY FOR CONNECTION, I FEEL SAD.
SADNESS IS THE EMOTION THAT I FEEL WHEN I'VE BEEN
SEPARATED FROM PEOPLE, PLACES AND THINGS THAT I LOVE.
SO SOMEONE DIES, I FEEL GRIEF,
I'M HUNGRY FOR THAT CONNECTION,
AND WHEN I AM DEVALUED, ANGER IS A HUNGER PANG
FOR VALUE.
IF SOMEONE DEVALUES SOMETHING VALUABLE,
I GET MAD.
THEY BULLY MY KID.
THEY WALK ACROSS MY WHITE CARPET IN MUDDY SHOES.
YOU KNOW, I'M ANGRY.
THAT WAS VALUABLE
AND YOU TREAT IT AS LESS THAN VALUABLE.
THAT'S A HUNGER PANG FOR VALUE.
FEAR IS A HUNGER PANG FOR SAFETY,
AND WE FEEL SAFE WHEN WE'RE IN THE PRESENCE OF
PEOPLE WHO LOVE US WELL.
AND SO IF I DON'T MEET THOSE NEEDS, EVENTUALLY,
JUST LIKE NOT EATING ALL DAY,
I MAY MAKE A POOR DECISION TO GET THE NEED MET.
BUT THAT DOESN'T MAKE HUNGER BAD.
IT MEANS I NEED TO MEET MY NEEDS.
SO I'M A SINGLE WOMAN.
CONNECTION IS NATURAL.
IF I DON'T NOURISH CONNECTION AND MY
FRIENDSHIPS AND MY FAITH COMMUNITY AND I JUST LET
LONELINESS RUN, RUN, RUN, I MAY MAKE A BAD
CONNECTION DECISION WHEN I'M STARVING.
>> WOW.
>> NOT BECAUSE THE DESIRE TO CONNECT IS BAD,
NOT BECAUSE SADNESS IS BAD,
BUT I LET MYSELF GET SO HUNGRY.
BUT WE'VE BEEN TAUGHT TO IGNORE OUR HUNGER PANGS.
AND SO THEN, WHEN WE FINALLY MAYBE MAKE A BAD
DECISION, THEN WE GO, OH, YOU LET
YOUR FEELINGS TAKE OVER.
THAT'S LIKE SAYING WHEN YOU FINALLY ATE,
YOU LET YOUR HUNGER TAKE OVER.
I NEED FOOD AND I WANT PEOPLE TO THINK ABOUT
THEIR EMOTIONAL PAIN THE EXACT SAME WAY.
AND SO WHEN YOU SAY CAN'T BE LED BY YOUR EMOTIONS,
THAT'S LIKE SAYING, I CAN'T BE LED BY HUNGER TO EAT.
>> YEAH.
>> DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?
>> NO --
>> IT'S LIKE TOTALLY DIFFERENT.
>> YEAH.
YOU'RE BLOWING MY WORLD IN A GOOD WAY.
MY MIND'S LIKE, WHOA!
>> YEAH.
>> I LOVE IT, THOUGH.
SO IT'S NOT THAT THE EMOTIONS ARE THE ISSUE.
IT WAS THE MISMANAGEMENT OF STEWARDING THEM.
>> IT'S ME NOT RECOGNIZING.
>> THAT LEADS TO POOR DECISION.
>> THAT THIS IS SOMETHING I NEED.
WHAT IS IT THAT I NEED RIGHT NOW?
AND WHAT IS MY BODY,
BECAUSE I'M A HUMAN BODY,
ASKING ME FOR?
IS ASKING FOR CONNECTION, FOR VALUE,
FOR SAFETY.
AND WHEN I DON'T FEED THAT,
I'M EITHER GOING TO BE SICK, MALNOURISHED.
IT'S GOING TO BE HARDER FOR ME TO ENDURE HARDSHIP.
IT'S LIKE RUNNING A MARATHON WITHOUT FOOD.
IF I'M GOING THROUGH A HARDSHIP OVER TIME,
A TRIAL OR TRIBULATION, AND I'M NOT FINDING WAYS
TO HAVE CONNECTION IN THAT SPACE OR SAFETY OR LOVE IN
THAT SPACE, IT'S GOING TO BE A LOT HARDER FOR ME TO
RUN THAT LONG RACE.
>> YEAH.
>> AND SO I THINK I NEED PEOPLE TO COMPLETELY
CHANGE THE WAY THEY SEE EMOTION SO THAT WE AREN'T
MAKING QUICK MOVES TO SAY, WELL, DON'T BE LED BY IT,
BECAUSE WHAT HAPPENS IS YOU PUSH IT ASIDE AND YOU
TRY TO POWER THROUGH ANYWAY,
BUT EVENTUALLY IT'S GOING TO COME BACK AROUND.
>> IT IS, AND IT'S GOING TO NOT BE GOOD.
>> IT'S NOT GOING TO BE GOOD BECAUSE YOUR EMOTIONS
WON'T LAST FOREVER, BUT THEY WILL WAIT FOREVER.
>> IS THAT STORED UP EMOTION?
>> YES.
>> AND THEN WHEN IT SHOWS UP AS A PANIC ATTACK THAT
YOU CAN'T CONTROL, IT'S LIKE SOMETHING'S OVERFLOWING.
IT'S LIKE I LEFT THE TUB RUNNING, WATER RUNNING.
AND THEN WHEN IT STARTS FLOODING THE BATHROOM,
NO ONE'S SHOCKED.
I FORGOT TO TURN IT OFF.
I DIDN'T HAVE THE THE PLUG OPEN TO DRAIN IT.
YEAH, YOU'RE GOING TO BE FLOODED WITH A LOT OF PAIN
BECAUSE YOU'VE BEEN SAVING IT UP,
THINKING THAT YOU WERE BEING STRONG OR THAT YOU
WERE HAVING FAITH.
AND NO, YOU'RE BEING A HUMAN BEING.
>> AND SO EMOTIONS ARE GOD'S GIFT TO US TO
UNDERSTAND WHAT'S GOING ON.
>> 100%.
>> TO UNDERSTAND LIKE YOUR NEEDS.
>> 100% TO UNDERSTAND OUR NEEDS.
WE WERE CREATED THAT WAY.
NOW WHAT HAPPENS WITH THE FALL, MAN,
A LOT OF THINGS GOT OUT OF WHACK AFTER THE FALL, RIGHT?
WE WERE CREATED IN THIS PERFECT BALANCE
MADE FROM THE SOIL.
SO REMEMBER, WE WERE MADE FROM THE SOIL IN GENESIS 1.
IN GENESIS 3, WHEN THE FALL HAPPENS,
NOT ONLY IS THE SERPENT PUNISHED,
NOT ONLY IS THE WOMAN PUNISHED,
NOT ONLY IS THE MAN PUNISHED,
BUT SOMETHING HAPPENS TO THE GROUND.
IT SAYS THE GROUND WILL YIELD THORNS AND THISTLES.
SO THE GROUND DIDN'T DO ANYTHING.
THE GROUND WASN'T INVOLVED,
BUT THE GROUND CHANGED AND SO DID OUR BODIES.
SAME REPRESENTATION.
AND SO NOW WE'RE BORN WITH PREDISPOSITIONS TO DEVELOP
A MENTAL ILLNESS OR PREDISPOSITION TO
DIABETES, OR A PERSONALITY THAT'S PREDISPOSED TO BE
MORE ANGRY OR MORE SCARED.
EVERYTHING GOES OUT OF BALANCE WHEN THE FALL HAPPENS.
AND SO WE ARE WORKING ON BEING CONFORMED TO THE
IMAGE OF HIS SON.
BUT LET'S NOT FORGET HOW EMOTIONALLY
EXPRESSIVE JESUS WAS.
>> SO AND YOU WOULD SAY ALSO,
THE EMOTIONS ARE CONNECTED TO OUR NERVOUS SYSTEM.
>> THEY ARE,
OUR NERVOUS SYSTEM PRODUCES THEM.
EVERY SINGLE THING THAT HAPPENS TO US IS BODILY.
NOTHING THAT WE EXPERIENCE HAPPENS OUTSIDE OF OUR BODY.
LIKE I SAID, DEAD FOLKS AREN'T
HAVING THESE EXPERIENCES.
EVERYTHING IS BODILY.
AND SO THIS IS FOR ME, AS A PROFESSIONAL,
NOW I PUT MY THERAPIST HAT ON WHICH ALL THE HATS
ARE ALWAYS ON.
BUT MENTAL ILLNESS AND PHYSICAL ILLNESS,
WE HAVE THESE TWO CATEGORIES.
THE ONLY DIFFERENCE MEDICALLY IS IN THE SYMPTOMS.
SO IF AN ILLNESS PRIMARILY MANIFESTS IN OUR EMOTIONS,
OUR THOUGHTS OR OUR BEHAVIORS,
WE CALL THAT A MENTAL ILLNESS.
IF IT MANIFESTS IN OUR BODY SYSTEMS LIKE MY BLOOD
PRESSURE OR MY KIDNEYS, WE CALL THAT
A PHYSICAL ILLNESS.
SO IT'S NOT THE SOURCE OF THE ILLNESS
THAT WE DIFFERENTIATE.
EVERYTHING'S HAPPENING IN OUR BODIES.
IT'S THE SYMPTOM.
SO IN MY BOOK, THE DIAGNOSTIC, DIAGNOSTIC
STATISTICAL MANUAL OF MENTAL DISORDERS,
WHICH IS THE BOOK THAT HAS ALL THE RECOGNIZED MENTAL
ILLNESSES THAT WE USE FOR INSURANCE AND CODE,
SCHIZOPHRENIA IS IN THAT BOOK.
SO IS DEMENTIA.
DEMENTIA IS A MENTAL ILLNESS.
PEOPLE NEVER THINK ABOUT IT THAT WAY.
WHEN SOMEONE HAS DEMENTIA, WE'RE NOT LIKE, OH,
THEY HAVE A MENTAL ILLNESS AND THROW ALL THE SAME
STIGMA THAT WE THROW AT DEPRESSION.
BUT GUESS WHAT?
THEY'RE IN THE SAME BOOK BECAUSE THEY
COME FROM THE BODY.
EVERYTHING HAPPENS IN THE BODY.
>> SO CAN YOU EXPLAIN MORE ABOUT THE NERVOUS SYSTEM
AND WHY, HOW SOMEONE KNOWS IF THEIR NERVOUS
SYSTEM IS DYSREGULATED?
>> YES.
AND SO WE HAVE OUR NERVOUS SYSTEM HAS MANY DIVISIONS
OR NOT MANY, IT'S THREE.
BUT WE HAVE ONE DIVISION WE CALL THE
AUTONOMIC NERVOUS SYSTEM.
AND THAT WORD AUTONOMIC MEANS WHAT IT
SOUNDS LIKE AUTOMATIC.
AND THAT NERVOUS SYSTEM HAS TWO DIVISIONS,
THE SYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM
AND THE PARASYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM.
>> YES.
>> YES, THE SYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM IS THE ONE
THAT ACTIVATES WHEN WE NEED TO, LIKE,
DO SOMETHING HARD.
WE NEED TO PHYSICALLY MOVE.
SO IT'S GOING TO ACTIVATE WHEN I'M STANDING ON HOME
BASE WAITING TO SWING A BAT.
THAT'S SYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM.
I'M NOT GOING TO BE RELAXED AT THAT MOMENT, RIGHT?
I'M READY TO LIKE, GO INTO ACTION.
BUT IT ALSO ACTIVATES WHEN WE'RE UNDER THREAT.
AND SO WHEN WE RESPOND TO THREAT,
PEOPLE KNOW THE TERMS FIGHT, FLIGHT, FREEZE.
>> YEP.
>> THAT'S THAT SYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM.
>> FAWN.
>> AND WHETHER WE FIGHT, FLIGHT, FREEZE OR FAWN IS
VERY MUCH LINKED TO OUR OWN PERSONALITIES.
SO PEOPLE TEND TO LEAN INTO ONE OR THE OTHER, RIGHT?
AND SO, YEAH.
>> SO THERE'S REST AND DIGEST.
>> THAT'S THE PARASYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM.
>> AND YOU WANT TO SPEND
MORE TIME THERE, CORRECT?
>> THAT'S WHERE YOU WANT YOUR BASELINE TO BE, RIGHT?
>> THAT'S WHERE YOU HEAL, RIGHT?
>> THAT'S WHERE YOU HEAL.
THAT'S WHERE YOUR BODY IS CALM.
>> OR RECOVER.
>> YOU HAVE A SENSE OF PEACE.
YOU HAVE A SENSE OF OPENNESS, CONNECTION.
WHEN MY SYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM IS
ACTIVATED, I AM POSSIBLY BEING VERY VIGILANT.
I CAN BE SCARED.
IT CAN BE HARDER FOR ME TO THINK CREATIVELY.
IT CAN BE HARDER FOR ME TO RELAX INTO RELATIONSHIP.
AND SO WHEN WE HAVE BEEN TRAUMATIZED, ESPECIALLY,
WE CAN BECOME SYMPATHETIC, DOMINANT,
WHERE WE SPEND A LOT OF TIME ACTIVATED.
EVEN WHEN WE DON'T FEEL SUPER ACTIVATED,
WE'RE ALSO NOT SUPER CALM, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?
>> SO IS THAT LIKE WHEN SOMEONE COMES,
LIKE COMES IN AND YOU DON'T EXPECT THEM
AND YOU LIKE JUMP.
>> WHEN THEY COME IN?
>> YES, YES.
THAT HYPERVIGILANCE WE CALL IT, RIGHT?
>> YEAH.
IT WAS FIRST OBSERVED IN BABIES WHO WERE ABUSED.
AND I STARTED OUT AS A SOCIAL WORKER IN FOSTER CARE.
AND THIS WAS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I LEARNED THAT
IF YOU COME TO VISIT A HOUSE WHERE THERE'S LIKE
SUSPECTED CHILD ABUSE, ONE OF THE THINGS YOU LOOK FOR
IN A BABY IS THAT THEIR EYES FOLLOW.
THEY DART EVERYWHERE
THERE'S MOVEMENT, AND THAT'S ONE --
>> 'CAUSE THEY'RE ON EDGE.
>> THEY'RE ON EDGE.
>> BECAUSE IT'S ROOTED IN TRYING TO SURVIVE, RIGHT?
>> AND TO FEEL SAFE.
>> OH.
>> THE SENSE OF SAFETY THAT WE NEED.
AND SO YOU CAN SEE HOW THE BABIES TENSE AND TENSION
IN THEIR BODY, BUT THEIR EYES DARTING AROUND IN A
WAY THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS BABY'S NOT SAFE.
AND SO WE CAN GROW UP WITH A SENSE OF SAFETY MISSING
AND DON'T EVEN REALIZE THAT WE ARE ACTIVATED IN
THAT WAY ALL THE TIME.
WE'RE JUST A LITTLE VIGILANT FOR THE NEXT
REJECTION, THE NEXT THE SHOE TO DROP,
AND THAT SENSE OF ANXIETY.
>> YES, WAITING FOR THE OTHER SHOE TO DROP.
>> WAITING FOR THE OTHER SHOE TO DROP.
SO THAT'S THAT SYMPATHETIC ACTIVATION,
THE PARASYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM TURNS THAT
SYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM OFF.
BECAUSE THE SYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM HAS AN ON SWITCH,
BUT IT DOESN'T HAVE AN OFF SWITCH.
THE PARASYMPATHETIC HAS TO COME ON AND SWITCH IT OFF.
AND SO THAT REST AND DIGEST SYSTEM,
I CALL IT THE TREE OF LIFE IN THE CENTER
OF OUR GARDEN.
>> INTERESTING.
>> IF YOU LOOK AT THE VAGUS NERVE,
WHICH IS THE NERVE THAT INNERVATES THE
PARASYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM,
IT LITERALLY LOOKS LIKE A TREE IN THE MIDDLE OF OUR BODY.
IF THE SEED WAS PLANTED IN THE HEART,
THE ROOTS FROM THAT TREE GO DOWN INTO OUR
INTESTINES, AND THEN IT GROWS UP INTO OUR HEAD AND
THERE'S THE BRAIN ON TOP LIKE A BIG FRUIT.
THE BRAIN IS JUST A BIG FRUIT.
>> WOW.
>> AND IF YOU THINK ABOUT WHAT THE BRAIN LOOKS LIKE,
IT'S A BIG FRUIT.
YOU POP IT IN HALF.
ALL THE NUCLEI ARE IN THE MIDDLE.
THAT WORD NUCLEI IS ACTUALLY LATIN FOR SEED.
THERE'S SEEDS IN THE MIDDLE.
>> WHAT ARE THE SEEDS AGAIN?
>> THE NUCLEI IN YOUR BRAIN,
THEY'RE JUST LIKE THE LITTLE CONTROL CENTERS IN
YOUR BRAIN THAT TELL LIKE SEND OUT INFORMATION AND
TELL THINGS WHAT TO DO.
SO YOUR BRAIN IS ACTUALLY A BIG FRUIT.
>> YEAH.
>> IT'S A FRUIT AT THE TOP OF YOUR HEAD.
AND SO IN MY BOOK THERE'S AN ILLUSTRATION OF THIS NERVE.
THERE'S AN ILLUSTRATION OF OUR HEART.
SO IN GENESIS CHAPTER TWO, THERE'S A DESCRIPTION OF
THE GARDEN OF EDEN.
AND IT SAYS THAT THE GARDEN WAS PLANTED
EASTWARD IN EDEN.
SO IF YOU OPEN YOUR ARMS LIKE THIS, TRY IT.
OPEN THEM UP.
NOW IMAGINE YOU'RE FALLING BACK ONTO A MAP OF THE
UNITED STATES.
>> OKAY.
>> NEW JERSEY IS OVER HERE, RIGHT?
AND CALIFORNIA IS OVER THERE.
SO THIS IS YOUR EAST SIDE.
THAT'S YOUR LEFT HAND.
BUT WHERE'S YOUR HEART LEAN?
>> TO YOUR LEFT.
>> AND HE PLANTED A GARDEN EASTWARD IN EDEN.
>> WOW.
>> AND A RIVER WENT INTO THE GARDEN TO WATER IT.
AND WHEN THE RIVER DEPARTED, IT SAID,
THE BIBLE SAYS THAT THE RIVER DIVIDES INTO FOUR HEADS.
WHEN YOUR AORTA, WHICH IS THE LARGEST BLOOD VESSEL
YOU HAVE, COMES UP OUT OF THE HEART,
IT SPLITS OFF INTO FOUR SPACES AND FLOWS AROUND
THE REST OF YOUR BODY.
THIS IS LITERALLY THE GARDEN OF EDEN.
IT'S WHERE GOD WALKS.
IT'S WHERE HE MEETS YOU.
IT'S WHERE HIS VOICE IS HEARD.
IT'S WHERE YOU BELIEVE.
AND SO OUR BODY, THERE'S A MAP, A BIOLOGICAL MAP.
SO I BELIEVE THAT EDEN WAS LITERAL.
I'M NOT SAYING THE BIBLE'S NOT LITERAL.
AND ALSO THERE'S A MAP OF OUR BIOLOGY IN THERE.
SO NOT ONLY DO THOSE NEURONS LOOK LIKE PLANTS,
THAT'S JUST THE BEGINNING OF THE GARDEN.
THE RIVERS ARE FLOWING OUT.
EVERYTHING IS IN THERE.
AND OUR BODIES ARE SO PHENOMENAL.
AND SO IF A SEED WAS PLANTED IN THAT GARDEN,
THAT VAGUS NERVE ACTUALLY THEN LOOKS LIKE A TREE.
IT'S A TREE OF LIFE.
AND WHEN THAT THING IS ACTIVE,
OUR BODIES ARE HEALTHIER, OUR EMOTIONS ARE MORE
BALANCED, OUR MINDS ARE CLEARER.
IT'S LIFE.
THERE IS EVEN RESEARCH SHOWING THAT PEOPLE WHO
STRUGGLE WITH TREATMENT-RESISTANT DEPRESSION,
ACCOMPANIED BY PERSISTENT-SUICIDAL IDEATION,
THAT ELECTORAL, ELECTRICAL STIMULATION OF THAT TREE
OF LIFE CAN HELP RESOLVE SUICIDAL THOUGHTS.
SO WHEN THAT TREE OF LIFE, THAT VAGUS NERVE IS
OFFLINE, SUICIDAL THOUGHTS PROLIFERATE DEATH.
BUT WHEN THAT TREE OF LIFE IS ACTIVE,
THOUGHTS OF DEATH DECREASE.
OUR BODIES ARE MIRACLES.
AND SO THAT'S WHY I SAID EARLIER IT'S NOT ABOUT
INTEGRATING, IT'S ABOUT TRANSLATING.
SO ONCE I FIND THIS BIOLOGY IN SCRIPTURE,
THEN THAT SENDS ME INTO THE SCIENCE.
TEACH ME MORE ABOUT WHAT YOU HAVE LEARNED ABOUT
THIS TREE OF LIFE.
BUT NOW I KNOW WHAT IT IS.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?
>> YEAH.
>> AND SO WHEN WE TALK ABOUT REGULATION,
ALL THAT TO GET BACK TO THIS BECAUSE WE GOT TO UNDERSTAND
WELLNESS BEFORE WE GO ILLNESS.
>> YEAH.
>> WELLNESS IS THE, THE EVEN FLOW OF THE GARDEN.
WATER RUSHES, WATER SLOWS DOWN, THINGS FLOURISH.
AND THEN THERE ARE SEASONS OF QUIET.
WE'RE NOT POPPING FRUIT 24/7 IN EVERY AREA
OF OUR LIFE, RIGHT?
SO THERE'S SYSTEMS AND REGULATION.
WHEN I AM REGULATED, THAT DOESN'T MEAN I'M CALM.
IT MEANS THAT I CAN RIDE THE WAVES OF LIFE.
I CAN HANDLE GETTING UPSET,
AND IT DOESN'T TAKE ME FOUR DAYS TO CALM DOWN.
>> WOW.
>> THAT'S WHAT WE MEAN BY REGULATION.
IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU'RE NOT GOING TO GET SAD.
IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU'RE NOT GOING TO GET MAD.
IT MEANS THAT I WON'T GET STUCK.
>> WOW.
AND I THINK THE THING THAT STICKS OUT SO POWERFULLY
TO ME IS THAT IF THIS IS WHERE JESUS WANTS TO
COMMUNE WITH US, IS IN THE HEART.
SO WE HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF THE HEART AND CULTIVATE.
>> AND WE HAVE TO BE EMOTIONALLY AVAILABLE
AND CULTIVATE THAT SPACE.
IN THE BOOK OF LUKE, THE PARABLE OF THE SOWERS ALSO
TOLD MATTHEW AND LUKE.
IN THE BOOK OF LUKE,
IT ACTUALLY SAYS THAT WHEN THE SEEDS FALL INTO THE
GOOD GROUND, THAT THAT PERSON BELIEVED.
AND SO WE DON'T EVEN BELIEVE WITHOUT OUR
EMOTIONAL LIFE BEING CONGRUENT WITH THE WORD
THAT'S SPOKEN.
THAT'S WHY SOMEONE CAN SAY SOMETHING TO YOU AND YOU
DON'T BELIEVE IT.
YOU DON'T NEED TO CHECK THE FACTS.
>> YEAH.
>> YOU JUST DON'T,
I'M SORRY.
THERE'S NOTHING IN ME THAT ALLOWS ME TO BELIEVE THAT.
EMOTIONALLY, YOU'RE NOT AVAILABLE
TO THE INFORMATION.
IT DOESN'T EVEN MEAN THE INFORMATION IS WRONG.
IT MEANS YOU'RE NOT AVAILABLE TO IT IN ANY WAY.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?
>> YEAH.
SO BREAK DOWN THE METAPHOR.
SO WHAT IS THE SOIL?
WHAT IS THE SEEDS FOR THE GARDEN ANALOGY?
>> SEED, SOIL, PLANT, FRUIT.
>> OKAY.
WORDS, EMOTIONS, THOUGHTS, BEHAVIOR.
THE WORD HAS TO FALL INTO THE SOIL.
THERE HAS TO BE A SEED SOIL MATCH FOR A PLANT TO
START TO GROW.
THERE HAS TO BE A WORD HEART MATCH FOR A BELIEF
TO COME TO LIFE.
>> YEAH.
THAT'S TRUE.
>> SO I'M --
>> THAT'S WHY YOU CAN HEAR SOMETHING ALL DAY LONG,
BUT YOU DON'T BELIEVE IT.
THAT'S WHAT YOU WERE REFERRING TO EARLIER.
>> RIGHT, EXACTLY.
SO I ALWAYS USE THIS EXAMPLE.
LIKE WHEN MY KIDS WERE SMALL,
I WAS SCARED I'D BE A BAD MOTHER.
AND IF ANYONE HAD SAID TO ME,
I THINK YOU'RE A BAD MOTHER,
THAT SEED WOULD HAVE TAKEN ROOT AND GROWN
BECAUSE I WAS --
>> YOU ALREADY BELIEVED.
>> EMOTIONALLY AFRAID.
SO FEAR WOULD HAVE MET THAT WORD,
NO PROBLEM.
BUT I TURNED OUT TO BE A REALLY GOOD MOM.
I'M EXCELLENT.
I'M NOT PERFECT.
I'VE NOT,
I'VE MADE MISTAKES.
BUT I APOLOGIZE WHEN I DO.
AND THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THAT MAKES ME GOOD.
SO I'M A GREAT MOM.
IF SOMEONE CAME TO ME NOW IS LIKE,
I THINK YOU'RE A BAD MOM.
I'D BE LIKE, WHO ARE YOU TALKING TO?
>> YEAH.
>> YOU'RE TALKING TO ME?
BECAUSE THERE'S NOTHING IN
MY HEART SOIL THAT'S FERTILE GROUND FOR THAT WORD.
THERE HAS TO BE A SEED SOIL MATCH.
AND SO THE WORDS FALL IN THE HEART.
IF THEY BECOME A BELIEF, THEN THOUGHTS SPRING FROM THAT
AND THEN DECISIONS BECOME THE FRUIT.
SEED, SOIL, PLANT, FRUIT.
WORDS, EMOTIONS, THOUGHTS, BEHAVIOR.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?
IT'S SUPER SIMPLE.
AND THE BOOK LAYS IT OUT REALLY SIMPLY.
WE'VE BEEN TAUGHT TO THINK ABOUT ALL THESE HARD THINGS.
JUST CHECK YOURSELF WITH THE GARDEN.
IF YOU GO BACK TO, OH, I FEEL THIS WAY
BECAUSE OF MY THOUGHTS.
PLANTS DON'T MAKE SOIL.
>> YEAH.
IS THE WORD WHAT PEOPLE ARE SPEAKING TO YOU OR ARE
YOU THINKING LIKE THE WORD OF GOD?
>> ALL WORDS.
>> ALL THE WORDS.
>> ALL WORDS ARE SEEDS.
SO THE WORD OF GOD
IS A SEED.
>> SO THESE ARE LIKE THE EXPERIENCES.
>> THE WORDS WE SPEAK TO OURSELVES.
SO I CAN THINK OF PAINFUL CHILDHOOD EXPERIENCES.
I SURVIVED A LOT OF TRAUMA IN MY LIFE.
AND AS A RESULT OF ONE TRAUMA THAT I EXPERIENCED,
I CAME TO THE CONCLUSION AS A CHILD,
PEOPLE ONLY LOVE YOU WHEN YOU'RE GOOD.
>> YEAH.
>> I CAME TO THAT CONCLUSION.
SO I WAS, IT WAS A LEGITIMATE CONCLUSION FOR
A KID WHO HAD THE EXPERIENCES THAT I HAD.
BUT THOSE WERE SEEDS FROM MY, MY CONCLUSION,
THOSE WORDS, I TOOK ROOT, AND IT TOOK ME A LONG TIME
AS AN ADULT TO UPROOT THAT, RIGHT?
SO THAT'S PART OF HOW WE HAVE TO WORK ON HEALING TRAUMA.
BECAUSE TRAUMA CHANGES NOT ONLY
OUR EMOTIONAL RESPONSES,
TRAUMA CHANGES HOW OUR NERVOUS SYSTEM WORKS.
>> YEAH.
>> BUT ONE OF THE EASIEST WAYS TO KNOW IF
SOMETHING TRAUMATIZED YOU IS THAT TRAUMA CHANGES
WHAT WE BELIEVE ABOUT OURSELVES, OTHER PEOPLE,
GOD OR THE WORLD FOR THE WORSE, FOR GOOD.
SO IF YOU HAVE A,
EVER SINCE THEN I DIDN'T BELIEVE IN X,
OR EVER SINCE THEN I'VE BEEN AFRAID OF.
OR WHEN I GROW UP, I'LL NEVER LET THIS HAPPEN TO
ME BECAUSE THAT'S A BAD PERSON.
YOU MIGHT HAVE A TRAUMA RIGHT THERE.
>> YEAH.
>> IT CHANGES THE WAY WE BELIEVE ABOUT
OURSELVES, GOD, THE WORLD OR OTHER PEOPLE FOR THE
WORSE, FOR GOOD.
AND PART OF THE HEALING PROCESS IS HEALING
WHAT WE BELIEVE.
>> SO THAT'S ALMOST LIKE A WEED.
>> YES.
>> SO THAT'S WHAT WE GOT TO PULL OUT.
SO WHAT, WHAT IS YOUR ADVICE ON DEALING WITH TRAUMA?
>> YEAH.
SO TRAUMA HEALING FIRST BEGINS WITH ACKNOWLEDGING
THAT SOMETHING HAPPENED.
AND A LOT OF TIMES WE DON'T WANT TO REALLY LOOK
SQUARELY AT THE DAMAGE THAT WE EXPERIENCED
BECAUSE WE DON'T --
>> IT'S A HARD PILL TO SWALLOW.
IT'S LIKE, WELL, I DON'T WANT TO BE A VICTIM.
WELL, NOT EVERYTHING IS ABOUT THAT.
ANYTHING WE CAN DO TO PROTECT OURSELVES FROM
COMING INTO CONTACT WITH THE FRAGILITY THAT IS PART
OF BEING A HUMAN.
BECAUSE IF I ADMIT I WAS BROKEN,
I HAVE TO ADMIT I'M BREAKABLE.
AND THAT MAKES ME FEEL A LITTLE LESS SAFE FOR
A WHILE, RIGHT?
BUT WE ARE BREAKABLE.
AND SO I'M HEALING FROM TRAUMA
STARTS WITH ACKNOWLEDGING THAT SOMETHING HAPPENED TO ME.
SOMETHING HAPPENED THAT CHANGED MY SHAPE.
I WOULD SAY TRAUMA DOESN'T MAKE YOU,
BUT IT CAN SHAPE YOU.
AND SO I'M NATURALLY INTROVERTED,
BUT SOME OF MY TRAUMATIC EXPERIENCES MADE MY
INTROVERSION GET WAY OUT OF BALANCE.
IT TOOK ME OUT OF BALANCE, RIGHT?
AND SO ACKNOWLEDGING WHAT HAPPENED,
TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU KNOW AND UNDERSTAND IT,
IS REALLY YOUR FIRST STEP.
AND THEN YOU NEED SAFE SPACE TO HEAL.
AND A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVEN'T ESTABLISHED
SAFE SPACES TO HEAL.
YOU KNOW, YOU CAN'T HEAL YOUR BROKEN LEG BY GOING
ON A RUN EVERY DAY.
YOU'RE GOING TO NEED TO GET SOME SAFETY.
AND SOMETIMES THAT MEANS STEPPING OUT OF
RELATIONSHIPS THAT ARE RE-INJURING YOU.
AND SO IT'S DIFFICULT TO HEAL WHILE YOU'RE BEING
BROKEN OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
>> YEAH.
>> SO YOU MAY NEED TO GET SOME BOUNDARIES AND SPACE
FROM PLACES, PEOPLE, PLACES AND THINGS THAT
RE-INJURE YOU.
SOME PEOPLE HAVE BEEN INJURED IN CHURCH.
>> OH YEAH.
>> RIGHT?
SO WHAT DO PEOPLE DO?
YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES PEOPLE MIGHT NEED TO GO TO CHURCH
ONLINE FOR A LITTLE WHILE, OR MAYBE THEY GO TO A
DIFFERENT CHURCH WHERE THEIR BODY'S NOT BEING
TRIGGERED BY EVERY SINGLE THING IN THE SPACE.
IT COULD BE A RELATIONSHIP SAFETY,
IT COULD BE A NEIGHBORHOOD,
BUT GET SOME SAFETY.
AND THEN THE NEXT STEP IS TO START TALKING ABOUT IT,
TO START TALKING ABOUT IT.
AND WHETHER THAT'S WITH A
GOOD FRIEND WHO YOU AREN'T AFRAID OF,
A THERAPIST WHOSE JOB IT IS TO LISTEN,
AND WE'RE DYING TO LISTEN AND HELP YOU.
IT COULD BE STARTING TO JOURNAL.
SOMETIMES PEOPLE HAVE NEVER SHARED IT OUTSIDE OF THEMSELVES,
BUT WE HAVE TO START SPEAKING,
AND PREFERABLY EVENTUALLY, A THERAPIST WHO CAN KIND
OF HELP YOU FROM THERE.
BUT THOSE ARE THOSE EARLY STEPS:
ACKNOWLEDGMENT, SAFETY, VOICE.
>> AND SO REALLY, YOU SHOULD NOT BE TRYING TO
DIG INTO HEALING
IF YOU'RE NOT IN A SAFE PLACE.
>> IT WILL BE DIFFICULT.
>> BECAUSE YOU'RE JUST GOING TO GET RE-TRIGGERED.
>> UM, YOU'RE GOING TO EXPERIENCE TRIGGERS IN THE
COURSE OF YOUR HEALING, BUT IT WILL REQUIRE SOME
SAFE SPACE IN ORDER FOR YOU TO ULTIMATELY MAKE IT THERE.
YEAH, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE
A LITTLE SAFE SPACE.
HEALING IS NOT LIKE THANKSGIVING DINNER.
I'M JUST GOING TO PILE MORE FOOD ON TOP OF MORE
FOOD ON TOP OF MORE FOOD.
I NEED SOME SPACE ON THIS PLATE,
YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?
AND THAT COULD MEAN, I DON'T KNOW,
VOLUNTEERING FOR ONE LESS THING AND KEEPING TWO
HOURS TO YOURSELF A WEEK.
>> YEAH.
>> YOU KNOW, AND SOMETIMES IT'S JUST ABOUT LIMITING
THE DAMAGE UNTIL YOU HAVE MORE TIME
TO WORK ON HEALING.
BUT GETTING A LITTLE SAFE SPACE, EVEN A LITTLE,
CAN BE A REALLY IMPORTANT START.
>> WHAT IF SOMEONE HAS A SITUATION WHERE THEY'RE
BEING HURT, BUT THERE'S NOTHING THAT THEY CAN DO
TO CHANGE THE PERSON THAT'S INFLICTING THE PAIN?
>> YEAH.
>> BECAUSE WE CAN'T CHANGE PEOPLE.
>> NO, THIS ISN'T ABOUT CHANGING PEOPLE.
>> YEAH.
>> THIS IS ABOUT HEALING YOURSELF.
>> YEAH.
>> AND I WOULD ENCOURAGE THAT PERSON, PLEASE,
PLEASE GET TO A THERAPIST BECAUSE SOMETIMES IT
REALLY IS TRUE,
I AM NOT ABLE TO GET OUT OF A SPACE WITH SOMEONE
WHO'S WOUNDING ME.
SOMETIMES THAT'S TRUE,
BUT IT'S A LOT MORE RARE THAN WE THINK.
A LOT OF TIMES WE STAY IN RELATIONSHIPS THAT ARE
UNHEALTHY BECAUSE WE'RE AFRAID TO LEAVE.
WE FEEL OBLIGATED, OR WE FEEL GUILTY.
AND FEAR, OBLIGATION AND GUILT ARE NOT GOOD REASONS
TO BE IN A RELATIONSHIP.
BUT UNFORTUNATELY, AND ESPECIALLY IN CHRISTIAN
SPACES, SOMETIMES THOSE THINGS MASQUERADE AS LOVE,
OBEDIENCE, AND FORGIVENESS.
>> YEAH.
>> AND THEY'RE NOT THE SAME.
THEY'RE NOT THE SAME.
AND SO, YEAH, TALK TO A THERAPIST.
SOMETIMES THEY'LL BE ABLE TO HELP YOU PEEL THAT
APART AND START TO FIND CERTAIN BOUNDARIES THAT
YOU CAN SET.
MAYBE YOU CAN'T GET AWAY FROM A PARTICULAR FAMILY
MEMBER, BUT YOU CAN LEARN TO SAY,
WHEN YOU SPEAK TO ME THAT WAY, I WILL LEAVE THE ROOM.
>> YEAH.
>> I CAN'T STOP YOU FROM BEING VERBALLY ABUSIVE IF
YOU WANT TO MAKE THAT CHOICE,
BUT I CAN STOP MYSELF FROM BEING ABUSED.
SO WHEN YOU IF YOU CONTINUE TO INSIST ON
SPEAKING TO ME THAT WAY WHEN IT STARTS,
I'M JUST GOING TO STAND UP AND WALK OUT OF THE ROOM.
AND THEN THE NEXT TIME THEY DO IT,
STAND UP AND WALK OUT OF THE ROOM.
AND I THINK THAT'S WHERE PEOPLE FEEL CHALLENGED.
BECAUSE THEY MAY SAY, HEY, PLEASE DON'T SPEAK TO ME
LIKE THAT.
BUT THAT'S NOT SETTING A BOUNDARY,
THAT'S EXPRESSING A PREFERENCE.
I WOULD PREFER YOU DON'T SPEAK TO ME THAT WAY.
A BOUNDARY IS ACTIONABLE.
I'VE ASKED YOU NOT TO SPEAK TO ME THAT WAY.
IF YOU CONTINUE TO SPEAK TO ME THAT WAY,
I WILL LEAVE RATHER THAN BE SPOKEN TO THAT WAY.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?
>> YEAH.
>> AND WHAT ARE WHAT WERE SOME, SOME TIPS FOR
REGULATING YOUR NERVOUS SYSTEM?
>> SO REGULATING YOUR NERVOUS SYSTEM IS ABOUT
HEALING THAT DYSREGULATION.
AND IT HAPPENS OVER TIME.
>> OKAY.
>> OKAY, SO THAT'S ONE
OF THE THINGS I THINK A LITTLE
BIT OF POP PSYCHOLOGY HAS GOTTEN A HOLD OF THAT.
ALL YOU GOT TO DO IS REGULATE.
TAKE FIVE DEEP BREATHS AND YOU'LL BE FINE
AND PEOPLE ARE HYPERVENTILATING INSTEAD.
AND SO WHEN IT COMES TO REGULATION,
IT'S HEALING OVER TIME.
JUST LIKE BREAKING A LEG,
IT TAKES TIME TO HEAL YOUR NERVOUS SYSTEM.
HERE ARE SOME EARLY THINGS YOU CAN DO.
FIRST OF ALL, TAKE BETTER CARE OF YOUR BODY.
I USE THE ACRONYM BED, B-E-D GO TO BED.
B LITERALLY GO TO BED.
>> YEAH.
>> WHEN YOU AREN'T GETTING ENOUGH REST,
YOU WILL HAVE A DIFFICULT TIME
HEALING YOUR NERVOUS SYSTEM.
EVERYBODY KNOWS WE LOSE OUR TEMPER MORE QUICKLY
WHEN WE'RE TIRED.
I MEAN, YOU KNOW IT, RIGHT?
SO, BUT IT'S SUCH A BASIC THING.
BUT SO MANY PEOPLE ARE CUTTING ON SLEEP TO GET
OTHER THINGS DONE.
FOR 30 DAYS,
I CHALLENGE ANYONE TO PRIORITIZE THEIR SLEEP,
BECOME A MANIAC ABOUT IT.
I'M GOING TO BED.
I'M GOING TO GET SIX HOURS, SEVEN HOURS,
EIGHT HOURS.
SOME PEOPLE ARE LIVING ON FOUR, SO GO TO BED.
WE NEED SLEEP.
THE E STANDS FOR EAT.
I NEED YOU TO EAT BECAUSE EMOTIONS ARE ROOTED
IN OUR BODIES,
WHEN WE DON'T TAKE IN THE NUTRITION WE NEED FOR OUR
BODIES TO MAKE THE NEUROTRANSMITTERS THAT
THEY NEED, IT'S HARDER FOR YOUR BODY TO REGULATE.
SO EVERYONE KNOWS WHEN YOU'RE STARVING YOU CAN
BARELY THINK RIGHT.
AND SO EAT WELL.
MAKE SURE, TAKE A VITAMIN, EAT SOME HEALTHY FOOD.
I'M NOT SAYING BE A VEGAN, BUT JUST DO BETTER,
YOU KNOW?
>> YEAH.
>> AND THEN D STANDS FOR DRINK WATER.
IF YOU'LL DO 30 DAYS ON GETTING GOOD SLEEP,
EATING BETTER AND DRINKING ENOUGH WATER,
YOUR BODY WILL HAVE WHAT IT NEEDS TO START TO BE
ABLE TO HANDLE EMOTIONAL RESPONSES BETTER.
SO BASIC BODY,
A SECOND THING PEOPLE CAN DO IS GET SOME QUIET TIME.
OUR NERVOUS SYSTEM HEALS IN STILLNESS.
THERE'S SOME RESEARCH THAT SAYS THAT PEOPLE WHO WERE
TRAUMATIZED AS CHILDREN NEED AS MUCH AS TWO HOURS
OF QUIET TIME A DAY.
NOW, I KNOW PEOPLE ARE LIKE MOMS AND EVERYONE OUT
HERE ARE LIKE, YEAH, OKAY, LISTEN,
STAY IN THE BATHROOM A LITTLE LONGER.
>> YEAH.
[ LAUGHTER ]
>> LET THAT -- STAY IN THE BATHROOM A LITTLE LONGER,
YOU KNOW, ORDER THE PIZZA, GIVE THEM
THE DINO NUGGETS.
IT AIN'T GOING TO KILL THEM.
IF YOU CAN GET 30 EXTRA MINUTES BY YOURSELF,
DO IT.
BECAUSE WE NEED SOME STILLNESS TO LET OUR BODIES HEAL.
AND IF WE CAN GET IT IN NATURE, EVEN BETTER.
>> YEAH.
>> THE COLOR GREEN IN NATURE ACTUALLY HAS A
HEALING EFFECT ON OUR NERVOUS SYSTEM.
THE SOUND OF THE OCEAN HAS A HEALING EFFECT
ON OUR NERVOUS SYSTEM.
HERE IN TEXAS,
YOU GET, YOU KNOW, LISTEN TO IT.
GET, PUT OCEAN SOUNDS ON YOUR, ON YOUR PHONE.
>> THAT'S AS CLOSE AS I'LL GET TO IT.
>> YEAH, ANYTIME WE CAN GET CONNECTED TO CREATION,
SURPRISE, SURPRISE, OUR NERVOUS SYSTEM STARTS TO HEAL.
SO GO TO BED, SLEEP, EAT GOOD, DRINK WATER,
GET SOME SILENCE AND SOME STILLNESS.
RECONNECT WITH NATURE.
IF YOU COMMIT TO DOING JUST THAT OVER THE COURSE
OF EVEN SIX MONTHS, I THINK PEOPLE WILL START TO
FIND OUT THAT THEY'RE FEELING BETTER.
YOUR NERVOUS SYSTEM NEEDS THAT TIME AND THAT
NURTURANCE TO START TO HEAL ITSELF.
YES, THERE ARE THINGS YOU CAN DO IN THE MOMENT TO
TRY TO FEEL BETTER, BUT I WANTED TO SHARE THAT
BIGGER PICTURE BECAUSE IT'S NOT ABOUT HACKING IT.
HERE'S A QUICK BREATHING TECHNIQUE YOU CAN DO.
HERE'S A QUICK, YOU KNOW, THOSE THINGS ARE HELPFUL.
ONE OF THOSE IS TAKE A DEEP BREATH AND THEN
EXHALE FOR TWICE AS LONG AS YOU INHALED.
SO INHALE FOR THREE,
BLOW OUT FOR SIX.
A LONG EXHALE ACTIVATES
THE PARASYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM.
IT WAKES UP THE TREE OF LIFE.
THAT'S ONE OF THE WAYS WE CAN ACTIVATE IT.
COLD WATER.
SO TURN THE SHOWER COLD FOR LIKE THE LAST 30 SECONDS OF
YOUR SHOWER, ACTIVATES YOUR PARASYMPATHETIC NERVOUS SYSTEM,
CAN BRING YOU INTO THAT REST AND DIGEST STATE.
MOVEMENT, NATURAL LIGHT AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE
WHEN YOU WAKE UP.
INSTEAD OF LOOKING FIRST AT YOUR PHONE,
GO TO YOUR WINDOW AND LET THE SUN HIT YOU
FOR TEN MINUTES.
GO OUT ON YOUR BALCONY.
NATURAL LIGHT DOES THAT.
SO THERE ARE THINGS LIKE THAT THAT YOU CAN DO THAT
PEOPLE ARE HEARING ABOUT TO HELP SHIFT YOU INTO
THAT PARASYMPATHETIC STATE.
BUT IF YOU'RE LIVING UNDER CHRONIC STRESS
OR UNHEALED TRAUMA,
THAT'S GOING TO MAYBE BE A HACK IN THE MOMENT.
BUT OVERALL, IT'S NOT GOING TO CHANGE...
>> YOU GOT TO ADDRESS.
>> YOUR EXPERIENCE.
YOU GOT TO LET THE LARGER HEALING HAPPEN,
AND YOU HAVE TO BE WILLING TO RELEASE PAINFUL EMOTIONS.
SOMETIMES YOU NEED CRYING TEARS MORE THAN YOU NEED
A DEEP BREATH.
>> YEAH, THAT'S TRUE.
>> IF YOU'RE TRYING TO DO SOMETHING TO AVOID
EMOTIONAL PAIN, STOP IT AND LET YOURSELF FEEL
THE HUNGER.
THAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT.
THIS ISN'T ABOUT AVOIDING THE PAIN BECAUSE IT WILL
BUILD UP IN YOUR BODY, AND IT WILL,
YOUR EMOTIONAL PAIN WILL BUILD UP IN YOUR BODY IN
WAYS THAT SHOW UP PHYSICALLY.
MIGRAINE HEADACHES, LOWER BACK PAIN.
MANY AUTOIMMUNE DISEASES ARE STATISTICALLY LINKED
TO REPRESSED ANGER.
LADIES, WOMEN, MY SISTERS, WHO HAVE
A DISPROPORTIONATE DIAGNOSIS OF AUTOIMMUNE DISEASES.
WOMEN HAVE MORE, HAVE, ARE DIAGNOSED WITH AUTOIMMUNE
DISEASES MORE OFTEN THAN MEN,
AND REPRESSED ANGER IS LIKELY ONE OF THE CULPRITS
FOR THAT.
>> WHAT IS A HEALTHY WAY TO RELEASE ANGER?
BECAUSE I'M THINKING EVEN ABOUT MY KIDS.
BECAUSE I'M LIKE,
I DON'T EVEN KNOW THE HEALTHY WAY TO DO IT MYSELF.
AND I'M TRYING TO TEACH THEM.
>> YEAH.
SO ANGER IS A, IS A DIFFICULT EMOTION.
THE BIBLE SAYS BE ANGRY AND SIN NOT
FOR A REASON.
>> YEAH.
>> BECAUSE WITH OTHER PAINFUL EMOTIONS LIKE
SADNESS AND FEAR, WE RETREAT.
WE SHUT DOWN.
ANGER IS AN APPROACH EMOTION, RIGHT?
AND SO USUALLY WE ONLY APPROACH GOOD, POSITIVE,
PLEASURABLE THINGS.
BUT ANGER SAYS THIS HURTS AND GOES AFTER IT, RIGHT?
>> TOTALLY.
>> AND SO THAT'S THE SIN NOT PART.
AND SO WE IT DOES PUSH AN ENERGY INTO OUR BODY THAT
HAS TO BE RELEASED.
>> IT TOTALLY DOES.
>> AND YOU GOT TO LET IT OUT.
AND THAT COULD BE GOING...
[ YELLING ]
>> YEAH.
>> SOUND IS A GREAT THING TO DO.
SOMETIMES I TELL PEOPLE, MAKE A SOUND THAT SOUNDS
LIKE HOW YOU FEEL.
BEFORE YOU TRY TO PUT IT IN
WORDS, PUT IT IN SOUND.
AND SO WHAT DOES YOUR ANGER SOUND LIKE?
LET'S GIVE IT TO ME.
YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES IT'S OLD,
GOOD OLD PUNCH A PILLOW.
THEY HAVE SMASH ROOMS NOW.
I AM SO HERE FOR THE SMASH ROOMS.
HAVE YOU HEARD OF THAT?
>> YEAH, I HAVE.
>> I AM SO HERE FOR SMASH ROOMS.
SOMETIMES I'VE MADE MY OWN SMASH ROOM.
THAT RECYCLE BIN WITH THE GLASS BOTTLES IN IT,
I'M NOT GONNA LIE.
I'VE BROKEN A COUPLE HERE AND THERE.
>> YEAH, BUT BETTER TO DO THAT --
>> SWEEP IT UP AND PUT IT AWAY.
OH, I DO, I DO, I'D SAY PROBABLY ONCE OR TWICE A YEAR,
I'LL HIT A LEVEL WHERE I'M LIKE,
BE RIGHT BACK AND I'M THROWING LIKE A GLASS BOTTLE.
SO FORCE OUT OF THE BODY, RIGHT?
>> TO GET THAT ENERGY OUT.
>> YOU HAVE TO LET THAT ENERGY OUT.
>> SO WHEN PEOPLE ARE LIKE SAYING, CALM DOWN,
JUST FORGIVE.
>> AND THAT WORKED FOR NO ONE EVER.
WHO HAS EVER BEEN FURIOUS
AND YOU'RE LIKE, CALM DOWN.
YOU'RE LIKE, OH, THANKS.
>> I KNOW, RIGHT.
>> NOW I'M CALM.
[ LAUGHTER ]
>> YEAH.
>> THAT IS YOUR DISCOMFORT WITH MY PAIN TELLING ME
TO CALM DOWN.
DON'T YOU WORRY ABOUT MY PAIN.
I'M GOING TO BE WITH MY PAIN.
AND SO YOU HAVE TO DISCHARGE THAT FROM YOUR BODY.
AND THEN AFTER YOU'VE DISCHARGED IT FROM YOUR
BODY, WHAT WAS DEVALUED?
BECAUSE ANGER IS THE PROPER RESPONSE TO
WHEN SOMETHING VALUABLE, BEING TREATED AS LESS THAN VALUABLE.
WHAT WAS DEVALUED AND WHAT BOUNDARY
IS NEEDED TO REESTABLISH THAT?
DO I NEED TO GO TO SOMEONE AND SAY, HEY,
I LENT YOU 20 BUCKS AND YOU NEVER PAID ME BACK AND
I NEEDED IT BACK.
AND THAT REALLY MADE ME ANGRY.
I FEEL LIKE YOU DEVALUED NOT ONLY MY 20 BUCKS,
BUT MY TRUST, AND THAT MADE ME ANGRY.
AND THEY CAN HAVE THE CHANCE TO APOLOGIZE.
AND ALSO, IF YOU LEND THEM $20 AGAIN AND THEY DON'T
PAY YOU BACK AGAIN, MAYBE YOU MAKE A BOUNDARY ON
LENDING THIS PERSON MONEY.
THAT DOESN'T MEAN YOU DIDN'T FORGIVE THEM.
BUT ALSO, THIS IS NOT A SAFE PLACE FOR THIS THING
TO BE VALUED IN THE WAY IT'S VALUED TO ME.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?
>> YEAH.
>> AND SO WE NEED TO RESPOND WHEN ANGER IS IN RESPONSE
TO SOMETHING BEING DEVALUED.
HOW DO WE GET THAT VALUE RE-ESTABLISHED?
NOW SOMETIMES ANGER SHOWS UP AS WHAT WE CALL
A SECONDARY EMOTION.
>> YEAH.
>> AND THAT'S TO PROTECT ME WHEN I'M SCARED OR WHEN
I'M SAD.
IN ORDER TO WORK THROUGH THAT,
I DISCHARGE THE ANGER.
AND THEN I NEED TO BE HONEST,
I WASN'T REALLY MAD, I WAS SCARED,
AND I NEED TO BE WILLING TO WORK THROUGH THE FEAR.
I WASN'T REALLY MAD,
I WAS ACTUALLY SAD.
I GOT REJECTED, GRR, AND I RESPONDED IT WITH FIGHT.
BUT ACTUALLY IT WAS JUST THE SADNESS OF,
OF REJECTION.
OR MAYBE I TRIED TO PREVENT REJECTION BY
ARGUING WITH SOMEBODY OR YELLING AT THEM.
SO I WAS ACTUALLY USING MY ANGER TO COVER MY FEAR.
>> YEAH.
>> SO THEN I LET THAT GO.
NOW I GOT TO BE WILLING TO PROCESS THE FEAR,
THE SADNESS.
AND THAT'S SOMETIMES,
NOT SOMETIMES, ALMOST ALL THE TIME,
WE'D RATHER BE MAD THAN SAD OR SCARED.
>> YEAH.
>> BECAUSE ANGER MAKES ME FEEL POWERFUL.
AND SADNESS AND FEAR MAKES ME FEEL POWERLESS.
AND SO WHERE DID THE ANGER COME FROM?
WAS IT ABOUT VALUATION?
YOU HAVE YOUR INSTRUCTIONS.
IF YOU FIND THAT IT'S COVERING SADNESS OR FEAR,
YOU GOT TO BE WILLING TO DEAL WITH THE SADNESS AND
THE FEAR IN ORDER TO NOT HAVE THE ANGER KEEP
SHOWING UP AS A SHIELD.
>> YEAH.
>> SO IF YOU'RE FEELING THAT FIGHT OR FLIGHT WHEN
SOMETHING'S HAPPENING TO YOU,
WHAT IS YOUR BODY TRYING TO COMMUNICATE TO YOU?
>> YES.
IT'S TELLING YOU THAT YOU NEED SOMETHING.
PAINFUL EMOTION IS SAYING, THERE'S SOMETHING THAT I NEED.
IT'S A HUNGER PANG,
LIKE I SAID BEFORE.
>> EVEN FIGHT OR FLIGHT?
>> YEAH, IT DEPENDS IF I'M,
IF I'M SCARED IT MIGHT BE FLIGHT OR I MIGHT HAVE A
FIGHT RESPONSE TO FEAR, WHICH IS ANGER SHOWING UP
TO PROTECT ME FROM MY FEAR.
WHATEVER IT IS, IT'S TELLING YOU THAT
YOU NEED SOMETHING.
WHAT'S HAPPENING?
I NEED TO FEEL SAFE, AND I'M NOT SAFE.
AND DO I NEED TO --
HOW DO I GET SAFE?
WHAT DO I NEED TO DO?
DO I MOVE AWAY FROM THIS SPACE?
AND SO HERE'S WHERE THE FORGIVENESS THING
GETS STICKY, RIGHT?
BECAUSE AS CHRISTIANS, WE'RE SUPPOSED TO FORGIVE.
AND ABSOLUTELY WE ARE SUPPOSED TO FORGIVE.
AND WE -- AND WE DO FORGIVE.
>> BUT WE DON'T NECESSARILY RECONCILE.
>> FORGIVENESS IS NOT ALWAYS RECONCILIATION.
>> I FEEL LIKE THAT'S SO IMPORTANT...
>> IS THIS...
>> TO CLARIFY.
>> A SAFE PLACE?
YES.
NOW --
>> OH, WOW.
SO YOUR BODY COULD BE TELLING YOU
THAT THIS IS NOT SAFE PERSON.
>> THIS IS NOT SAFE.
THIS IS NOT SAFE.
AND ONE OF THE WAYS THAT WE CAN INCREASE
OUR WELL-BEING,
AND A LOT OF TIMES THIS CAN HAPPEN IN THERAPY,
I CAN INCREASE MY CAPACITY TO MAKE MYSELF SAFE,
NO MATTER WHAT.
SO I CAN WORK TO NOT FEAR REJECTION,
THAT MAKES ME SAFER.
BECAUSE I'M NOT FEARING REJECTION IN THE SAME WAY.
WHICH MEANS I CAN MOVE MORE FREELY.
BECAUSE IF SOMEONE REJECTS ME, I'M NOT --
>> YOU'RE FINE.
>> I'M GOING TO BE OKAY.
>> YEAH.
>> AND SO THEN I FIND MYSELF SAFER IN MORE PLACES.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?
SO IT'S NOT --
>> YEAH.
>> I CAN BECOME LESS AFRAID OF SOMETHING.
I CAN INCREASE MY OWN SAFETY.
BUT IF MY SAFETY IS COMPLETELY DEPENDENT ON
YOU NOT DOING SOMETHING TO ME, THAT'S A LOT TOUGHER, RIGHT?
SO THERE'S WAYS THAT WE CAN WORK ON SAFETY
THAT INVOLVE US.
AND SOME OF IT IS JUST NOT BEING AFRAID OF --
BEING AFRAID OF LESS THINGS.
YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?
WHEN I STARTED OUT AS A THERAPIST,
FOR THE FIRST FOUR YEARS, I WORKED ALMOST
EXCLUSIVELY WITH SURVIVORS OF CHILD SEXUAL ABUSE.
>> OH MY GOSH.
>> AND MOST HONORED WORK TO THIS DAY I'VE EVER DONE
TO BE INVITED INTO THOSE HARD PLACES WITH PEOPLE.
BUT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I WOULD WORK WITH WOMEN ON
IS AND MEN ARE ALSO SEXUALLY ABUSED.
I WAS ONLY WORKING WITH WOMEN AT THE TIME,
WAS THEY WOULDN'T WANT ANYONE TO KNOW, IT WAS A SECRET.
>> YEAH.
>> AND THEN THEY WOULD TELL ONE PERSON,
BUT IT'D STILL BE A SECRET.
AND SO A SECRET IS NOT JUST SOMETHING YOU TELL
ONE PERSON AT A TIME, YOU KNOW, IT'S LIKE,
HOW ARE YOU ACTUALLY GOING TO GET TO THE PLACE WHERE
YOU ARE NOT AFRAID FOR SOMEONE TO KNOW?
BECAUSE THAT'S WHEN IT STOPS BEING A SECRET.
AND SO ONE OF THE GOALS OF MY WORK WITH, WITH THE,
WITH THE WOMEN WOULD BE THAT THEY WOULD BE WILLING
TO WALK DOWN THE STREET WITH A T-SHIRT ON
THAT SAID, I WAS SEXUALLY ABUSED AND NOT BE AFRAID
OF WHAT PEOPLE WOULD THINK ABOUT THAT.
I WANTED THEM TO BE SO HEALED THAT IF SOMEONE
WALKED UP TO THEM AND SAY, I HEARD YOU WERE SEXUALLY
ABUSED, THEY WOULDN'T GO
WHO TOLD YOU THAT?
>> THEY WOULDN'T FEEL LIKE THAT SHAME.
>> THEY WOULD SAY I WAS.
WERE YOU?
CAN I HELP YOU?
>> WOW.
>> THAT'S FREEDOM.
>> YEAH.
THAT'S POWERFUL.
>> THAT'S POWERFUL FREEDOM.
BECAUSE I AM NO LONGER AFRAID OF WHAT THAT MIGHT
MEAN TO YOU.
I'M SO AT PEACE WITH WHERE I'M AT THAT I'M GOING TO
LIGHT UP BECAUSE I'M THINKING MAYBE YOU NEED MY HELP.
>> YEAH.
YOU'RE NOT FEELING THE GUILT OR SHAME OR FEELING
THE NEED TO HIDE.
>> RIGHT.
THAT'S THE HEALING THAT WE'RE AFTER.
AND SO THERE'S WAYS THAT WE CAN INCREASE OUR OWN
SAFETY IN THE WORLD BY DECREASING OUR SHAME
AND OUR FEAR.
IT'S POSSIBLE TO BE LESS AFRAID.
RIGHT?
AND SO FORGIVENESS IS IMPORTANT.
AND ALSO KEEPING OURSELVES SAFE.
I CAN FORGIVE YOU, BUT IF I KNOW, IF I'M IN A
MARRIAGE WHERE I'M BEING PHYSICALLY BEATEN,
I CAN FORGIVE.
BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT IT'S SAFE TO STAY HERE.
AND I'M NOT DISHONORING GOD BY NOT STAYING IN A
PLACE WHERE I COULD BE KILLED.
THAT'S NOT DISHONORING GOD.
>> NO.
>> JESUS SAID ON THE CROSS, FATHER,
FORGIVE THEM, FOR THEY KNOW NOT WHAT THEY DO.
HE FORGAVE EVEN WHILE HE WAS STILL BEING MURDERED.
WHICH IS THE HIGHEST BAR OUT THERE, RIGHT?
THIS IS A HIGH BAR.
BUT DR. O'BRIEN, ANOTHER ANOTHER CHRISTIAN
THERAPIST, SHE SAID THIS AND SHE SAID,
BUT WHEN JESUS WAS RESURRECTED,
HE DID NOT VISIT A SINGLE ROMAN SOLDIER.
HE DIDN'T GO SEE PILATE.
HE WENT TO SEE THOSE WHO HAD BEEN IN RELATIONSHIP WITH.
PETER WAS THERE.
SO THERE'S FORGIVENESS.
>> YEP.
>> BUT WE KNOW THAT PETER'S HEART WAS ALSO
BROKEN BY HIS BEHAVIOR.
AND WE KNOW THAT PETER CAME BACK AROUND
TO THE RIGHT HEART.
AND SO JESUS WAS THERE WITH SOMEONE
WHO HAD BETRAYED HIM.
AND THERE WAS FORGIVENESS, AND HE WAS THERE.
HE WASN'T,
HE DID NOT GO TO THE ROMAN SOLDIERS HOUSE WHO STABBED
HIM IN THE, IN THE SIDE.
SO FORGIVENESS IS NOT ALWAYS A RETURN TO
AN UNSAFE PLACE.
SO I THINK THAT'S THE BEST --
THAT'S THE BEST EXAMPLE WE CAN GIVE OF HOW THAT GOES.
WE DON'T SEE JESUS BEING LIKE PILATE, COME ON,
LET'S HAVE THAT DINNER.
YOU KNOW, HE WENT TO HIS DISCIPLES AND EVEN THOUGH
THERE WAS SOMEONE THERE WHO HAD DONE SOMETHING
WRONG, THERE WAS FORGIVENESS THERE BECAUSE
THERE WAS ALSO REPENTANCE.
>> YES.
GENUINE REPENTANCE...
>> GENUINE REPENTANCE.
>> IS ESSENTIAL FOR RECONCILIATION.
>> FOR RECONCILIATION.
IT'S NOT ESSENTIAL FOR FORGIVENESS.
JESUS SAID, FORGIVE THEM.
THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY DO,
BUT IT IS ESSENTIAL FOR SAFE RECONCILIATION.
>> YEAH.
>> I KNOW WE'RE ALMOST OUT OF TIME.
I DO WANT TO ASK, AS A PARENT,
WHAT WOULD YOU SAY IS SOME OF THE MOST IMPORTANT
THINGS THAT WE CAN DO FOR OUR CHILDREN?
>> TWO THINGS, LET THEM FEEL, OKAY?
AND DO NOT TEACH
THEM THAT THEIR EMOTIONS ARE IN SOME TYPE OF
OPPOSITION TO GOD.
HEY, WHAT DO WE DO WHEN WE'RE AFRAID?
THE BIBLE SAYS HE HASN'T GIVEN US A SPIRIT OF FEAR.
YOU HEAR THAT?
JUST LIKE THAT.
IT'S, IT CAN BECOME A FORM OF SPIRITUAL ABUSE TO
SUGGEST THAT MY PAINFUL EMOTIONS ARE
IN OPPOSITION TO GOD.
HEY, I'M SCARED, MOM.
YOU KNOW WHO ELSE WAS SCARED ONCE?
JESUS.
HERE HE IS IN GETHSEMANE, EXPERIENCING
THE EMOTION OF FEAR.
SOMEBODY LISTENING RIGHT NOW,
JUST LIKE I WAS WITH HER TILL SHE SAID JESUS WAS SCARED.
WELL, WHY WOULD JESUS BE BEGGING NOT
TO BE CRUCIFIED?
>> OH, YEAH, HE WAS SCARED.
>> RIGHT.
>> HE SWEATED BLOOD.
>> HE SWEATED BLOOD BECAUSE --
AND THAT'S ANOTHER REASON WHY WE KNOW EMOTION IS
A BODILY EXPERIENCE.
BECAUSE FEAR DOES NOT EXIST IN THE HEAVENLIES.
HE HAD TO PUT ON A BODY TO EXPERIENCE FEAR.
AND SO TAKE YOUR CHILD TO WHERE THEIR PAIN IS IN
SCRIPTURE AND THERE JESUS CRIED.
SO IT'S OKAY.
I CRY TOO SOMETIMES.
LET'S CRY TOGETHER AND THEN HOLD THEM AND BE WITH
THEM IN THE MOMENT.
SO ALLOW YOUR CHILDREN TO HAVE THEIR FEELINGS AND DO
NOT SUGGEST THAT THE BIBLE OPPOSES THEM,
OR THAT GOD IS A QUICK FIX TO THEM AND DOESN'T WANT
THEM TO HAVE EMOTIONAL PAIN.
LET THEM FEEL HOW THEY FEEL.
AND THEN ONCE THEY FINISH FEELING AND SAY,
NOW THAT YOU FEEL A LITTLE BETTER,
WHAT DO YOU THINK WE SHOULD DO?
INSTEAD OF OKAY, YOU FEAR THAT, BUT DON'T DO THAT.
YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?
JUST TAKE YOUR TIME.
BUT IN ORDER TO DO THAT, MOM AND DAD,
YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO CHANGE YOUR RELATIONSHIP
WITH YOUR OWN EMOTIONS.
AND SO THAT'S THE MOST IMPORTANT THING
I THINK WE CAN DO.
THE SECOND THING IS PARENTS THAT I THINK WE
CAN DO THAT IS SO CRITICAL IS TO APOLOGIZE TO OUR
CHILDREN WHEN WE'RE WRONG.
I THINK IT'S SO POWERFUL.
OUR CHILDREN NEED TO KNOW WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE TO
RECOGNIZE A FAILURE AND TO APOLOGIZE
AND REMAIN IN RELATIONSHIP.
YOU KNOW WHAT?
WHAT YOU DID WAS WRONG.
YOU HIT YOUR BROTHER.
>> YEAH.
>> BUT MOMMY'S RESPONSE WAS ALSO WRONG.
I, THE WAY I YELLED AT YOU, THAT WASN'T OKAY.
SO I'M REALLY SORRY FOR YELLING THE WAY THAT I DID.
IF IT'S TRUE, IT'S OKAY TO YELL A LITTLE,
BUT IF YOU LOST IT, COME BACK.
YOU KNOW WHAT?
BUT MOMMY'S RESPONSE WAS ALSO WRONG.
SO I WANT TO APOLOGIZE TO YOU FOR THAT.
AND I ALSO NEED YOU TO APOLOGIZE
TO YOUR BROTHER FOR THAT.
>> SO IT'S OKAY TO HAVE THEM TO SAY
YOU NEED TO APOLOGIZE.
>> ABSOLUTELY.
>> OKAY.
>> ABSOLUTELY, PEOPLE,
WE SHOULD LEARN TO OWN THAT.
>> OUR STUFF.
>> YOU DID SOMETHING WRONG,
YOU SHOULD APOLOGIZE.
ABSOLUTELY.
I THINK WE HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ON TRYING TO FORCE...
>> LIKE RELATIONSHIPS?
>> FORGIVENESS.
>> YEAH.
>> YEAH, I THINK IT GOES TOO FAR WHEN IT'S LIKE,
APOLOGIZE TO YOUR BROTHER.
NOW, YOU TELL YOUR BROTHER THAT YOU ACCEPT THEIR
APOLOGY AND GIVE THEM A HUG.
THAT'S WRONG.
>> OKAY, I'M GLAD.
>> THAT'S WRONG.
THAT'S WRONG.
BUT I THINK --
>> BECAUSE YOU CAN'T FORCE THAT.
>> YOU CANNOT FORCE THAT AND FORGIVENESS --
PEOPLE ARE GOING TO GET ME ON THIS ONE TOO.
BUT I DECLARE IT.
FORGIVENESS IS NOT ALWAYS THE FIRST STEP IN HEALING.
>> I AGREE WITH THAT.
>> IT'S NOT ALWAYS THE FIRST STEP.
>> BECAUSE I DON'T THINK YOU'RE ALWAYS
READY TO FORGIVE.
AND YOU NEED TO FORGIVE.
>> YES, YES, WE WILL GET THERE.
>> BUT IT ALMOST IS LIKE A,
IT'S LIKE SAME AS LIKE
THE LITTLE KID THING.
IT'S LIKE YOU'RE FORCING.
>> YES.
>> AND IT'S JUST NOT...
>> YES.
>> NATURAL.
>> SOMETIMES PEOPLE NEED SPACE FOR THEIR ANGER.
>> TOTALLY.
>> RIGHT.
YOU WANT ME TO FORGIVE BEFORE I EVEN SAID,
HEY, I'M ANGRY ABOUT THAT.
AND HOW IS FORGIVENESS ACTUALLY HAPPENING IF THE
OFFENSE HAS NOT BEEN ARTICULATED,
WHAT ARE YOU ASKING FOR FORGIVENESS FOR?
WHAT AM I FORGIVING YOU FOR?
MAYBE THEY DO THIS IN 12 STEP.
AND THIS IS ONE OF THE THINGS I LIKE TO CORRECT
IN THIS AREA, THAT YOU SHOULD GO TO SOMEONE AND
MAKE AMENDS FOR WHAT YOU DID WRONG, RIGHT?
AND SO WHEN MY SISTER WAS ADDICTED TO DRUGS,
SHE STOLE SOMETHING FROM ME ONCE.
IF SHE GETS, SHE GOT CLEAN AT THE END OF HER LIFE.
BUT TO COME TO ME AND SAY, HEY,
I WANT TO MAKE AMENDS FOR THAT TIME
I STOLE YOUR JEANS.
I DON'T CARE ABOUT MY JEANS.
I LOST MY SISTER FOR YEARS.
ASK ME WHAT THE PAIN WAS.
HEY, WHAT DID IT COST YOU?
HOW DID MY ACTIONS, HOW DID YOU EXPERIENCE THEM?
LET ME SAY WHAT IT WAS.
AND THEN IF YOU WANT TO APOLOGIZE.
APOLOGIZE FOR WHAT ACTUALLY HURT ME.
SO WHEN WE DON'T HEAR THE PERSON THAT WE'VE WOUNDED,
SOMETIMES WE APOLOGIZE IN A WAY
THAT ALMOST PROTECTS OURSELVES.
BUT LET ME TELL --
LET ME BE WILLING TO HEAR FROM YOU THE PAIN THAT I
INFLICTED ON YOU.
>> YEAH.
>> A LOT OF TIMES THAT'S VERY HEALING
FOR THAT PERSON.
AND THEN LET THEM ARTICULATE WHAT IT WAS.
AND ALSO, IF I'M FORGIVING SOMEONE,
I WANT TO BE REAL ABOUT IT.
YOU KNOW, LIKE, THIS WAS REALLY BAD AND I'M
FORGIVING FOR IT VERSUS JUST GLOSSING OVER, OH,
I FORGIVE YOU, I FORGIVE YOU, I FORGIVE YOU.
YOU DIDN'T BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T REALLY LEAN INTO
WHAT THE DAMAGE WAS.
YOU GOT TO LABEL THE DAMAGE BEFORE
YOU FORGIVE THE DAMAGE.
>> WHAT IF IT'S A PERSON THAT'S NOT A SAFE PERSON,
AND THEY'RE NOT WANTING TO HAVE THAT CONVERSATION TO
ADMIT THAT THEY'RE WRONG?
>> YEAH.
SO YOU DON'T HAVE --
THEY DON'T HAVE TO ADMIT THAT THEY WERE WRONG FOR
YOU TO FORGIVE THEM.
>> YEAH.
>> BUT IT'S ALSO OKAY FOR YOU TO ARTICULATE THE PAIN.
IT'S OKAY BECAUSE MANY TIMES WE NEED THAT.
ONE OF THE REASONS THAT WE --
FORGIVENESS SOMETIMES COMES TOO FAST.
BEFORE I HAD A CHANCE TO PROCESS THE ANGER CAN MAKE
THE FORGIVENESS LESS REAL, BECAUSE I HAVEN'T --
WHEN THERE'S A TORNADO IN A HOUSE,
A HOUSE GOES DOWN, BEFORE YOU CAN GET THE INSURANCE
MONEY TO REBUILD,
THEY HAVE TO ASSESS THE DAMAGE.
I GOT TO BE HONEST ABOUT THE DAMAGE BEFORE WE TRY
TO REBUILD THIS, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?
AND SO IF YOU JUST SAY I FORGIVE YOU,
AND ALL YOU REALLY ARE DOING IS TRYING TO AVOID
THE PAIN OF THE MOTION OF THE PROBLEM VERSUS
ACTUALLY ASSESSING THE DAMAGE AND LOOKING AT IT
THAT FORGIVENESS IS LESS THAN AUTHENTIC.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?
>> YEAH.
>> AND SO PROCESSING THE ANGER,
BEING HONEST ABOUT IT, THAT GETS YOU TO ANOTHER
PLACE TO BE WILLING TO, TO BE ABLE TO TRULY FORGIVE.
ANOTHER REASON WHY FORGIVENESS ISN'T ALWAYS
THE FIRST STEP IS BECAUSE THE POWER DIFFERENTIAL
SOMETIMES WE GOT TO GET BACK TO --
SO THIS IS WHY I DON'T TAKE A FIVE-YEAR-OLD WHO
WAS ABUSED BY AN ADULT.
I DON'T WALK THAT CHILD TO THE ADULT AND SAY,
FORGIVE THEM.
YOU NEVER DO THAT.
WE DON'T RESCUE A WOMAN WHO'S BEEN CHAINED IN A
HOUSE BEING SEX TRAFFICKED,
PULL HER OUT OF THERE, WRAP A BLANKET AROUND HER
AND GO, HEY, BEFORE WE GO, I NEED YOU TO
FORGIVE YOUR TRAFFICKERS.
NOBODY WOULD DO THAT.
AND WE DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY WE WOULDN'T DO IT.
BUT WE KNOW WE WOULDN'T DO IT.
IT'S BECAUSE THE POWER DIFFERENTIAL.
THIS PERSON HAS BEEN POWERLESS.
GIVE THEM A MOMENT.
LET THEM GET TO A PLACE WHERE THEY'RE SAFE
AND THAT BRINGS THEM BACK TO AN EMPOWERED PLACE.
LET THEM DO SOME HEALING,
THEN THEY HAVE THE CAPACITY TO OFFER REAL FORGIVENESS.
SO WE GOT TO JUST NOT BE ABUSIVE WITH THE CHRISTIAN
CONCEPT OF FORGIVENESS.
OR WE END UP ASKING FOR SOMETHING THAT'S NOT REAL.
>> WOW.
>> YEAH.
>> WELL, THIS HAS BEEN SUCH AN INCREDIBLE CONVERSATION.
>> OH MAN, I LOVE IT.
WE COVERED SO MUCH.
>> I KNOW.
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE AND FOR ANYONE
THAT WANTS TO GET THE BOOK,
WHERE CAN THEY GET IT?
>> ANYWHERE BOOKS ARE SOLD.
THE GARDEN WITHIN: WHERE THE WAR WITH YOUR EMOTIONS
ENDS AND YOUR MOST POWERFUL LIFE BEGINS.
IT HAS BEEN ONE OF MY GREATEST PRIVILEGES IN
LIFE TO BRING YOU THIS WORD FROM THE LORD.
AND THAT'S WHAT THE BOOK REALLY IS.
A HARD, HARD ONE.
>> YEAH.
AND SO IT'S REALLY FROM MY HEART TO, TO EVERY HEART.
IT MEANS A LOT TO ME TO SHARE THIS.
>> WELL, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR EVERYTHING.
>> THANK YOU.