WEBVTT





00:00:09.700 --> 00:00:11.900
JONATHAN WEISS: SO WHEN DID,


00:00:12.000 --> 00:00:12.834
WHAT WERE WE
TALKING ABOUT?

00:00:12.934 --> 00:00:13.834
MIKE: ISRAEL.


00:00:13.934 --> 00:00:15.767
REBECCA LAMB WEISS: THEIR LIFE
IN ISRAEL.

00:00:15.867 --> 00:00:17.034
JONATHAN: WHEN DID
YOU GET THAT?

00:00:17.134 --> 00:00:18.167
AND HOW DID YOU GET THAT?


00:00:18.267 --> 00:00:19.267
MIKE: WELL, MY PASTOR, HIS
NAME IS DUANE VAN DER

00:00:19.367 --> 00:00:19.900
KLOK.


00:00:20.000 --> 00:00:21.501
INCREDIBLE MAN OF GOD.


00:00:21.601 --> 00:00:23.133
AND HE LOVES ISRAEL.


00:00:23.233 --> 00:00:25.333
AND SO HE SAID, HEY, I'M
GOING TO BE TAKING A TRIP

00:00:25.433 --> 00:00:27.734
TO ISRAEL, AND I'M
GATHERING A LOT OF PEOPLE.

00:00:27.834 --> 00:00:29.367
WOULD YOU BE ONE
OF THE SPEAKERS?

00:00:29.467 --> 00:00:31.000
AND I SAID, WELL, I'VE
NEVER BEEN TO ISRAEL.

00:00:31.100 --> 00:00:32.567
AND HE WAS LIKE, WELL,
YOU'VE READ THE BIBLE,

00:00:32.667 --> 00:00:33.167
HAVEN'T YOU?


00:00:33.267 --> 00:00:34.233
YOU'RE A PASTOR.


00:00:34.333 --> 00:00:35.300
AND I SAID, YEAH.


00:00:35.400 --> 00:00:36.467
AND HE WAS LIKE, WELL, I
WANT YOU TO TEACH FROM

00:00:36.567 --> 00:00:39.934
THOSE LOCATIONS AND GOING
TO ISRAEL WITH HIM FOR THE

00:00:40.034 --> 00:00:40.801
VERY FIRST TIME.


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IT CHANGED MY LIFE.


00:00:42.200 --> 00:00:43.434
JONATHAN: WHAT YEAR IS THAT?


00:00:43.534 --> 00:00:45.367
MIKE: I MEAN, IT WAS PROBABLY
ABOUT A DECADE AGO NOW.

00:00:45.467 --> 00:00:45.867
JONATHAN: OKAY.


00:00:45.967 --> 00:00:46.701
MIKE: YEAH, YEAH.


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JONATHAN: THAT'S AMAZING.


00:00:47.600 --> 00:00:48.733
AND DID YOU GO WITH HIM?


00:00:48.833 --> 00:00:52.233
JULIE: I DID NOT, BUT IT WAS I
ACTUALLY DURING THAT TIME.

00:00:52.333 --> 00:00:53.000
LET ME SEE.


00:00:53.100 --> 00:00:57.267
IT WAS IN 2000, 2016.


00:00:57.367 --> 00:00:58.467
MIKE: SOMETHING LIKE THAT.


00:00:58.567 --> 00:01:00.133
JULIE: 2018 IS WHEN YOU WENT
AND IT CAME AT A REALLY

00:01:00.233 --> 00:01:03.167
GOOD TIME IN OUR LIFE,
BECAUSE IT REALLY MARKED

00:01:03.267 --> 00:01:05.333
OUR FAMILY.


00:01:05.433 --> 00:01:07.500
WHEN I COULDN'T GO, I
WAS STRUGGLING WITH SOME

00:01:07.600 --> 00:01:08.967
CHRONIC ILLNESS AT
THE TIME, PART OF MY

00:01:09.067 --> 00:01:10.767
TESTIMONY, BUT
I'M HEALED NOW.

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THANK YOU, JESUS.


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REBECCA: OH THAT'S AWESOME.


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JULIE: BUT DURING THAT TIME, I
PHYSICALLY COULDN'T DO THE

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TRIP.


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IT WAS A LOT OF WALKING,
A LOT OF, YOU KNOW, AND I

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DIDN'T GO.


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BUT I REMEMBER WHEN HE
CAME BACK, WE STARTED

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GIVING TO ISRAEL EVERY
MONTH AS A FAMILY.

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AND AND NOW IT'S LIKE IT
JUST REALLY MARKED OUR

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THAT TRIP, MARKED OUR
FAMILY, MARKED OUR CHURCH.

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IT WAS VERY
IMPORTANT LIKE TIME.

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JONATHAN: AND SO HAVE YOU
BEEN AT ALL SINCE?

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JULIE: I HAVEN'T.


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I HAVEN'T, BUT MY
DAUGHTER JUST WENT.

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JONATHAN: OH, REALLY?


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REBECCA: REALLY?


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JONATHAN: HOW DID SHE GO?


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MIKE: SO WE'RE DOING THIS
SERIES CALLED JOURNEY WITH

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JESUS.


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AND ACTUALLY THE ONE WHO
HASN'T BEEN TO ISRAEL YET,

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BECAUSE EVERY TIME I'VE
GONE, SHE HASN'T GONE OR

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BEEN ABLE TO GO.


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SHE WAS LIKE, WHAT IF YOU
ACTUALLY WENT TO ISRAEL

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AND YOU TAUGHT ON LOCATION
AND THEN SIMULCASTED IT

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INTO OUR CHURCH BECAUSE WE
HAVE THE ALL THE CAMPUSES?

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REBECCA: THAT'S SO COOL.


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MIKE: AND SO WE WENT OUT THERE
AND FILMED AND IT WAS

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AMAZING.


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YEAH.


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MY, MY 19 YEAR OLD
DAUGHTER GOT TO GO.

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REBECCA: THAT'S SO AMAZING.


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WE'RE JUST SO PASSIONATE
ABOUT THAT BECAUSE AND

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IT'S LIKE, I WOULD HAVE
NEVER EXPECTED THE

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ANTISEMITISM
THAT'S GOING ON.

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AND IT'S HAPPENING NOW
LIKE IN THE CHURCH.

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AND THERE'S SO MUCH LIKE
REPLACEMENT THEOLOGY.

00:02:12.567 --> 00:02:14.133
AND SO WE'VE BEEN
TALKING ABOUT IT A LOT.

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AND SO I THINK FOR ME,
BECAUSE IT WAS LIKE A

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HOLY SPIRIT DOWNLOAD AND
LIKE SEEING IT ALSO IN HIS

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WORD.


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I THINK IF PEOPLE COULD
HAVE THAT OR HAVE THAT

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KIND OF EXPERIENCE WHERE
THEY GO TO THE LAND AND

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THEY RECEIVE THAT, NO
PERSON CAN ARGUE THAT THE

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THINGS THAT GOD
SHOWS YOU OUT OF YOU.

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YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?


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BUT IT'S HARD TO FIND
PEOPLE WHO WILL STAND

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FIRM ON IT BECAUSE
THERE IS SO MUCH HATE.

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JONATHAN: AND CONFUSION TOO.


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THERE ARE JUST PEOPLE THAT DON'T
UNDERSTAND THE ACTUAL

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RIGHT THAT THE JEWISH
PEOPLE HAVE TO THAT LAND,

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NOT JUST THROUGH THE BIBLE
IN GOD'S BLESSING AND

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GIVING IT TO THEM, BUT
THEN HISTORICALLY AS WELL.

00:02:48.967 --> 00:02:50.200
SO IT'S A LOT OF
CONFUSION, A LOT TO

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UNPACK.


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MIKE: WELL, IT'S LIKE YOU
HAVE A WHOLE GENERATION, I

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CALL IT A YOUTUBE DEGREE.


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YOU KNOW, BECAUSE IT'S
LIKE THEY'VE ONLY SEEN

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SOCIAL MEDIA CONTENT.


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THEY'VE NEVER BEEN THERE
PHYSICALLY AND THEY'VE

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NEVER ACTUALLY READ A
BOOK OR ANYTHING THAT'S

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SUBSTANTIAL, LIKE FROM
A SCHOLARLY STANDPOINT.

00:03:05.534 --> 00:03:08.033
AND SO THERE'S A LOT OF
MISINFORMATION, BUT WE'VE

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BEEN LIKE REALLY PUTTING
TOGETHER CONTENT.

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I'VE BEEN
INTERVIEWING PEOPLE.

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I HAVE THE RABBI OF
THE BIGGEST MANHATTAN

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CONGREGATION COMING TO
OUR CHURCH TO SPEAK, AND --

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JONATHAN: THAT'S AMAZING.


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MIKE: IT'S GOING TO BE,


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YEAH.


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JONATHAN: HOW DID YOU
GUYS GET CONNECTED?

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MIKE: ACTUALLY, I GOT ASKED
TO GO TO WASHINGTON, D.C.

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AND TO SPEAK WITH CONGRESS
SENATORS AND TO TO

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BASICALLY ADVOCATE
FOR ISRAEL.

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AND, YOU KNOW, THIS LIKE
KIND OF THE ANTI-SEMITIC

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KIND OF THE THINGS THAT
ARE HAPPENING ON COLLEGE

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CAMPUSES AND ALL THAT.


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AND SO I HAVE OVER
A MILLION YOUTUBE

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SUBSCRIBERS.


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AND MY MY BASE OF
PEOPLE IS VERY DIVERSE.

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SO THEY'RE LIKE, WE WANT
YOU TO SPEAK ON BEHALF OF

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ALL OF YOUR FOLLOWERS,
LIKE YOU HAVE THE

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HEARTBEAT OF THE NATION
IN TERMS OF AND IN OUR

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CHURCHES, MULTI-SITE
IN CITIES.

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SO THEY'RE LIKE, WHAT
IS ALL THESE PEOPLE ARE

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LISTENING TO YOU ONLINE,


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WHAT DO YOU THINK?


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WHAT DO YOU FEEL?


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AND I'M TELLING YOU,
I HAD SOME INCREDIBLE

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CONVERSATIONS.


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AND SO IT WAS ME.


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RABBIS, ENTREPRENEURS ALL
TOGETHER JUST WALKING THE

00:04:06.533 --> 00:04:07.567
HALLS OF CONGRESS.


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JONATHAN: AMAZING.


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IT WAS IT WAS AWESOME.


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JONATHAN: NOW YOU HAVE A RABBI
COMING TO YOUR CHURCH.

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THAT'S GOING TO
BE REALLY COOL.

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MIKE: YEAH.


00:04:14.033 --> 00:04:16.067
WELL, BEFORE MAMDANI GOT
ELECTED, WE JOINED FORCES

00:04:16.167 --> 00:04:17.667
AND WE WERE GOING ONLINE.


00:04:17.767 --> 00:04:19.033
AND JUST, LIKE, FIGHTING
THE MISINFORMATION.

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AND WE REALLY GREW OUR
FRIENDSHIP IN THAT TIME.

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AND SO IT'S CRAZY TO THINK
ABOUT HIM AS A RABBI

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COMING INTO A
CHRISTIAN CHURCH.

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BUT IT'S GOING
TO BE POWERFUL.

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JONATHAN: SO WHAT CITIES ARE
ALL OF YOUR CAMPUSES

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SO PEOPLE CAN GO
CHECK THEM OUT?

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MIKE: YEAH.


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SO WE HAVE A CAMPUS ON
LONG ISLAND, WHICH WE

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BOUGHT A SOCCER STADIUM
AND CONVERTED IT INTO A

00:04:39.400 --> 00:04:40.767
CHURCH, WHICH IS CRAZY.


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REBECCA: THAT'S CRAZY.


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MIKE: YEAH, THAT DOESN'T
HAPPEN OUT THERE.

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AND THEN WE HAVE BROOKLYN
AND IN WILLIAMSBURG, WHERE

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THE HIPSTERS ARE.


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JONATHAN: YEAH, WE WENT THERE.


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REBECCA: YEAH.


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WE DID.


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MIKE: OKAY.


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OH, YEAH.


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SEE?


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YEAH.
[ LAUGHING ]

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IT'S COOL.


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AND THEN WE HAVE MANHATTAN
IN CHELSEA, RIGHT ACROSS

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THE STREET FROM CHELSEA
MARKET, IF ANYBODY'S

00:04:57.767 --> 00:04:58.800
HEARD.


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AND THEN WE HAVE A NEW
JERSEY CAMPUS, AND THEN WE

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HAVE A MIAMI CAMPUS AND
ONE IN NORTHWEST INDIANA.

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REBECCA: WHICH ONE'S
THE MOST NEW?

00:05:06.001 --> 00:05:07.034
IS IT THE MIAMI?


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MIKE: NO, I THINK
IT'S NEW JERSEY.

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JULIE: NEW JERSEY
IS OUR NEWEST CAMPUS.

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REBECCA: HOW DID MIAMI GET
PUT IN THAT EQUATION?

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BECAUSE IT'S LIKE ALL KIND
OF LIKE NEW YORK CITY

00:05:13.033 --> 00:05:13.767
AREA.


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AND THEN Y'ALL
ARE FROM INDIANA.

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HOW DID HOW DID
MIAMI HAPPEN?

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MIKE: DO YOU WANT TO
TELL THEM MIAMI?

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JULIE: YEAH.


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SO OUR CHURCH WE HAVE
A VERY LARGE ONLINE

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VIEWERSHIP.


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AND SO DURING THE
PANDEMIC, I ENCOURAGED

00:05:26.967 --> 00:05:30.333
MIKE TO LIKE GO ONLINE
AND JUST START TALKING TO

00:05:30.433 --> 00:05:31.867
PEOPLE BECAUSE HE WAS ON
THE PHONE ALL DAY DURING

00:05:31.967 --> 00:05:32.867
THE PANDEMIC.


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WE COULDN'T HAVE SERVICES
IN NEW YORK CITY.

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REBECCA: Y'LL WERE
SHUT DOWN.

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JULIE: WE WERE SHUT DOWN, SHUT
DOWN, AND HAVING CHURCH

00:05:37.900 --> 00:05:40.134
WAS NOT EVEN AN OPTION.


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MIKE: WELL, WE DIDN'T EVEN
OWN OUR BULIDING.

00:05:41.733 --> 00:05:42.367
JULIE: YES.


00:05:42.467 --> 00:05:43.533
YEAH, WE WE RENTED VENUES.


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WE WERE LOAD IN AND LOAD OUT
AND SO EVERYTHING SHUT

00:05:45.400 --> 00:05:46.201
DOWN.


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SO WE HAD TO GET
REALLY CREATIVE.

00:05:47.434 --> 00:05:48.834
SO I HEARD HIM ON THE
PHONE ALL DAY STRATEGIZING

00:05:48.934 --> 00:05:49.967
AND I'M LIKE,
YOU KNOW WHAT?

00:05:50.067 --> 00:05:52.767
YOU SHOULD JUST LIKE GO
ONLINE AND JUST TALK TO

00:05:52.867 --> 00:05:55.567
PEOPLE LIKE, YEAH, BECAUSE
YOU'RE DOING THIS ALL DAY.

00:05:55.667 --> 00:05:58.267
AND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS
SO ENCOURAGING AND IT'S

00:05:58.367 --> 00:06:00.167
AND IT'S STRATEGY AND
IT'S PRAYER AND IT'S

00:06:00.267 --> 00:06:01.800
INTERCESSION AND IT'S
ALL THESE THINGS.

00:06:01.900 --> 00:06:04.800
AND SO WE STARTED
DOING THAT.

00:06:04.900 --> 00:06:08.767
AND SO OUR MINISTRY KIND
OF EXPLODED ONLINE.

00:06:08.867 --> 00:06:10.933
AND THEN OUT OF THAT,
PEOPLE STARTED GATHERING

00:06:11.033 --> 00:06:13.900
IN HOMES AND
WATCHING OUR CHURCH.

00:06:14.000 --> 00:06:17.234
AND SO OUR MIAMI CAMPUS
WAS ACTUALLY BIRTHED FROM

00:06:17.334 --> 00:06:20.033
A COUPLE WHO STARTED
INVITING PEOPLE TO THEIR

00:06:20.133 --> 00:06:21.101
HOME.


00:06:21.201 --> 00:06:22.567
AND IT JUST KIND OF
EVOLVED, AND WE DISCIPLED

00:06:22.667 --> 00:06:25.100
THEM AND JUST WENT ON
A JOURNEY WITH THEM.

00:06:25.200 --> 00:06:28.667
AND THAT GROUP EVOLVED
INTO A CHURCH.

00:06:28.767 --> 00:06:29.300
JONATHAN: THAT'S AMAZING.


00:06:29.400 --> 00:06:30.334
REBECCA: THAT'S SO COOL.


00:06:30.434 --> 00:06:31.500
JULIE: SO THAT'S HOW
THAT CAMPUS WAS BORN.

00:06:31.600 --> 00:06:32.801
MIKE: AND NOW THEY'RE
THRIVING DOWN THERE.

00:06:32.901 --> 00:06:34.201
THEY HAVE THEIR
OWN BUILDING.

00:06:34.301 --> 00:06:36.233
LIKE IT'S CRAZY.


00:06:36.333 --> 00:06:37.567
REBECCA: WHAT?
THAT'S SO COOL.

00:06:37.667 --> 00:06:38.301
JONATHAN: SO WHEN YOU PREACH ON
SUNDAYS, DO YOU STREAM

00:06:38.401 --> 00:06:39.500
INTO THAT BUILDING?


00:06:39.600 --> 00:06:40.467
MIKE: YEAH.


00:06:40.567 --> 00:06:42.267
SO HERE'S WHAT'S
DIFFERENT.

00:06:42.367 --> 00:06:43.700
EVERYONE'S ALWAYS LIKE,
WHAT'S YOUR MAIN CAMPUS?

00:06:43.800 --> 00:06:46.234
AND I TELL THEM WE DON'T
HAVE A MAIN CAMPUS.

00:06:46.334 --> 00:06:47.533
REBECCA: REALLY?


00:06:47.633 --> 00:06:48.767
MIKE: SO YEAH, BECAUSE I HAVE A
WHOLE BUNCH OF LIKE, VIDEO

00:06:48.867 --> 00:06:52.767
GAME NERDS, YOU KNOW, LIKE
YOUNG MILLENNIALS, GEN Z.

00:06:52.867 --> 00:06:55.133
AND WHEN I, WHEN I TRIED
TO HAVE A MAIN CAMPUS,

00:06:55.233 --> 00:06:57.100
THEY WERE ALL LIKE, WELL,
THE OTHER CAMPUSES WOULD

00:06:57.200 --> 00:06:58.367
SAY, WELL, LIKE WHAT?


00:06:58.467 --> 00:07:01.100
WE'RE NOT, LIKE
GOOD ENOUGH.

00:07:01.200 --> 00:07:02.167
YEAH.


00:07:02.267 --> 00:07:03.167
AND I SAID, WELL, IF YOU
GUYS CAN ACHIEVE THESE

00:07:03.267 --> 00:07:05.400
LEVELS, YOU COULD
BE A MAIN CAMPUS.

00:07:05.500 --> 00:07:06.967
AND IT STARTED
AS LIKE A JOKE.

00:07:07.067 --> 00:07:09.834
AND THEN ALL THE CAMPUSES
STARTED BASICALLY LEVELING

00:07:09.934 --> 00:07:10.834
UP.


00:07:10.934 --> 00:07:13.133
SO NOW I GO TO THE
DIFFERENT ONES AND I CAN

00:07:13.233 --> 00:07:15.367
STREAM OUT OF ANY ONE TO ALL.


00:07:15.467 --> 00:07:16.534
JONATHAN: OH THAT'S SMART.


00:07:16.634 --> 00:07:17.400
MIKE: WHICH IS KIND OF COOL.


00:07:17.500 --> 00:07:18.601
YEAH.


00:07:18.701 --> 00:07:19.700
REBECCA: I'VE NEVER HEARD
OF ANYONE DOING IT THAT WAY.

00:07:19.800 --> 00:07:20.533
JONATHAN: SO YOU JUST
ROTATE THROUGH.

00:07:20.633 --> 00:07:21.100
MIKE: YEAH.


00:07:21.200 --> 00:07:22.700
I ROTATE THROUGH.


00:07:22.800 --> 00:07:23.901
YEAH.


00:07:24.001 --> 00:07:24.867
SO LIKE I MIGHT BE ON LONG
ISLAND AND THEN I'LL BE IN

00:07:24.967 --> 00:07:26.633
MANHATTAN, SO.


00:07:26.733 --> 00:07:27.567
YEAH.


00:07:27.667 --> 00:07:28.800
JONATHAN: AND WHICH
IS THE LARGEST?

00:07:28.900 --> 00:07:30.633
MIKE: PROBABLY LONG ISLAND.


00:07:30.733 --> 00:07:31.367
YEAH.


00:07:31.467 --> 00:07:32.167
REBECCA: AND IT'S BEEN TEN,


00:07:32.267 --> 00:07:33.101
HOW MANY YEARS?


00:07:33.201 --> 00:07:33.933
MIKE: ABOUT THAT, YEAH,
TOTAL TIME.

00:07:34.033 --> 00:07:36.200
JULIE: WE PLANTED THE CHURCH.


00:07:36.300 --> 00:07:38.467
WE STARTED HAVING
MONTHLY SERVICES IN 20 IN

00:07:38.567 --> 00:07:39.667
2016.


00:07:39.767 --> 00:07:41.667
SO WE'VE BEEN HAVING
SERVICES FOR TEN YEARS.

00:07:41.767 --> 00:07:44.400
WE WENT WEEKLY IN 2017.


00:07:44.500 --> 00:07:46.967
REBECCA: THAT'S A LOT OF GROWTH
IN A SMALL AMOUNT OF TIME.

00:07:47.067 --> 00:07:48.100
THAT'S HARD.


00:07:48.200 --> 00:07:49.333
JONATHAN: YOU STARTED HAVING
SERVICES IN NEW YORK

00:07:49.433 --> 00:07:49.934
ORIGINALLY.


00:07:50.034 --> 00:07:51.133
MIKE: OH YEAH.


00:07:51.233 --> 00:07:54.367
JONATHAN: WHAT BROUGHT YOU FROM
INDIANA TO NEW YORK?

00:07:54.467 --> 00:07:56.833
MIKE: SO I'M IN MY GARAGE.


00:07:56.933 --> 00:07:59.001
REBECCA: I LIKE THAT
Y'ALL LAUGH.

00:07:59.101 --> 00:08:00.733
MIKE: THIS WHOLE
THING IS ABSURD.

00:08:00.833 --> 00:08:01.967
YOU KNOW, ANYBODY
LISTENING RIGHT NOW IS

00:08:02.067 --> 00:08:03.967
STILL TRYING TO FIGURE OUT
WHAT IS HE TALKING ABOUT?

00:08:04.067 --> 00:08:05.434
BECAUSE IT IS CRAZY.


00:08:05.534 --> 00:08:06.967
REBECCA: Y'ALL WERE JUST
FOLLOWING THE LORD LIKE

00:08:07.067 --> 00:08:08.300
YOU WEREN'T LIKE,
WE'RE GONNA DO THIS.

00:08:08.400 --> 00:08:09.967
IT'S JUST LIKE YOU WERE
FOLLOWING HIS LEADING.

00:08:10.067 --> 00:08:12.067
MIKE: WELL, I HAD A GUY WHO
WAS LIKE, A BIG SEMINARY

00:08:12.167 --> 00:08:15.300
GUY, AND HE WAS AT MY
STUDIO DOING A PODCAST,

00:08:15.400 --> 00:08:17.267
AND I WAS KIND OF LIKE,
DOWNPLAYING EVERYTHING

00:08:17.367 --> 00:08:18.467
WE'VE DONE.


00:08:18.567 --> 00:08:20.200
AND HE JUST, LIKE, KIND OF
REBUKED ME IN FRONT OF OUR

00:08:20.300 --> 00:08:21.267
TEAM.


00:08:21.367 --> 00:08:22.467
AND HE WAS LIKE, CAN I
JUST EXPLAIN TO YOU GUYS

00:08:22.567 --> 00:08:26.234
LIKE, TO OUR KNOWLEDGE, IN
THE SEMINARY WORLD, NO ONE

00:08:26.334 --> 00:08:28.534
HAS EVER LAUNCHED CAMPUSES
FROM LONG ISLAND ALL THE

00:08:28.634 --> 00:08:31.267
WAY TO NEW JERSEY THAT
HAVE SUSTAINED AND

00:08:31.367 --> 00:08:32.633
SIMULCAST INTO THEM.


00:08:32.733 --> 00:08:34.701
LIKE, YOU GUYS ARE
ACTUALLY DOING THESE

00:08:34.801 --> 00:08:35.867
HISTORIC THINGS.


00:08:35.967 --> 00:08:37.700
YOU DON'T EVEN REALIZE IT
BECAUSE FOR US, WE WERE

00:08:37.800 --> 00:08:39.567
JUST TRYING TO
SOLVE PROBLEMS.

00:08:39.667 --> 00:08:41.200
YEAH, THAT'S REALLY
HOW IT HAPPENED.

00:08:41.300 --> 00:08:43.901
SO EVEN WITH THE
SIMULCAST, I DIDN'T HAVE

00:08:44.001 --> 00:08:45.901
A DESIRE TO HAVE A
SIMULCAST CHURCH.

00:08:46.001 --> 00:08:48.067
I'M LIKE A
SPIRITUAL FATHER.

00:08:48.167 --> 00:08:50.901
I WANTED TO RAISE UP OTHER
PREACHERS, AND WHEN I HAD

00:08:51.001 --> 00:08:53.733
PEOPLE IN ROTATION
PREACHING, WHAT HAPPENED

00:08:53.833 --> 00:08:56.534
WAS THEY STARTED
GETTING LIKE BURNT OUT.

00:08:56.634 --> 00:08:59.100
JULIE: WHEN YOU PREACH EVERY
NOW AND THEN, THAT'S CUTE.

00:08:59.200 --> 00:09:02.133
BUT WHEN YOU PREACH 52
WEEKS A YEAR, IT'S WILD.

00:09:02.233 --> 00:09:05.567
AND SO I DID IT FOR A LONG
TIME AND I WAS LIKE, SIR,

00:09:05.667 --> 00:09:06.200
I NEED.


00:09:06.300 --> 00:09:07.833
I'M LIKE, THIS IS CRAZY.


00:09:07.933 --> 00:09:08.900
MIKE: YEAH.


00:09:09.000 --> 00:09:10.167
OUR PREACHERS BASICALLY
CAME BACK TO ME AND

00:09:10.267 --> 00:09:11.833
THEY'RE LIKE, I DON'T
THINK I CAN PREACH THIS

00:09:11.933 --> 00:09:13.000
FREQUENTLY.


00:09:13.100 --> 00:09:15.167
SO I SAID, WELL, LET'S SET
UP SIMULCAST AND SEE IF

00:09:15.267 --> 00:09:16.300
THAT IS, THAT WAY,


00:09:16.400 --> 00:09:18.100
IT'LL ALLEVIATE
THE BURDEN.

00:09:18.200 --> 00:09:20.434
AND THEN WE DID AND OUR
CHURCH EXPLODED MORE.

00:09:20.534 --> 00:09:21.667
JONATHAN: WOW.


00:09:21.767 --> 00:09:23.267
MIKE: SO THERE'S THAT'S ONE
THERE'S JUST A WEIRD GRACE

00:09:23.367 --> 00:09:23.900
ON US.


00:09:24.000 --> 00:09:25.134
YOU KNOW.


00:09:25.234 --> 00:09:26.333
REBECCA: IT'S KIND OF LIKE WHEN
MOSES AND JETHRO CAME TO

00:09:26.433 --> 00:09:28.034
HIM AND HE WAS, LIKE,
DIVIDE IT UP THIS WAY

00:09:28.134 --> 00:09:29.767
BECAUSE HE WAS TAKING ON
TOO MUCH HIMSELF IN THE

00:09:29.867 --> 00:09:30.667
OLD TESTAMENT?


00:09:30.767 --> 00:09:31.700
MIKE: THAT'S IT.


00:09:31.800 --> 00:09:32.333
REBECCA: SO IT'S LIKE
THAT HEAVENLY WISDOM

00:09:32.433 --> 00:09:33.434
ON HOW TO EXPAND.


00:09:33.534 --> 00:09:35.101
AND THEN GOD, WHEN YOU
ALL PUT THAT IN PLACE, IT

00:09:35.201 --> 00:09:36.367
EXPLODED EVEN MORE.


00:09:36.467 --> 00:09:38.433
MIKE: YES, BECAUSE THEY WERE
LIKE, BASICALLY, MIKE,

00:09:38.533 --> 00:09:41.900
YOU'RE THE PREACHER, BUT
LET US BE THE PASTOR.

00:09:42.000 --> 00:09:43.667
AND NOT EVERY PASTOR
SHOULD PREACH AND NOT

00:09:43.767 --> 00:09:45.400
EVERY PREACHER
SHOULD PASTOR.

00:09:45.500 --> 00:09:46.601
REBECCA: THAT'S TRUE.


00:09:46.701 --> 00:09:49.034
MIKE: AND THAT WAS LIKE A REAL
IMPORTANT STEP FOR US.

00:09:49.134 --> 00:09:50.267
SO YEAH.


00:09:50.367 --> 00:09:51.733
JONATHAN: AND THEN HOW DID YOU
GET FROM INDIANA TO NEW

00:09:51.833 --> 00:09:52.834
YORK?


00:09:52.934 --> 00:09:54.167
MIKE: SO FOR I'M IN MY THE
REASON WHY I LAUGH.

00:09:54.267 --> 00:09:55.301
YEAH.


00:09:55.401 --> 00:09:57.400
SO I'M IN MY GARAGE AND I
SEE I'M WATCHING THE NEWS

00:09:57.500 --> 00:10:00.101
AND HURRICANE SANDY
JUST HIT NEW YORK.

00:10:00.201 --> 00:10:01.533
AND I'M LOOKING AT
ALL THE FOOTAGE OF THE

00:10:01.633 --> 00:10:02.667
DEVASTATION.


00:10:02.767 --> 00:10:05.133
AND MY HEART STARTED LIKE
GOING OUT TO THEM BECAUSE

00:10:05.233 --> 00:10:06.534
IT WAS LIKE, MAN, THAT
LOOKS LIKE IT'S REALLY

00:10:06.634 --> 00:10:07.600
BAD.


00:10:07.700 --> 00:10:09.567
ACTUALLY, THE BACK BACK
STORY WAS THAT WHEN

00:10:09.667 --> 00:10:12.534
HURRICANE KATRINA HIT NEW
ORLEANS, I WORKED DOWN

00:10:12.634 --> 00:10:14.500
THERE FOR A
WHILE AFTER THAT.

00:10:14.600 --> 00:10:17.134
SO I'VE SEEN WHAT A STORM
COULD DO TO DEVASTATE

00:10:17.234 --> 00:10:18.167
PEOPLE'S LIVES.


00:10:18.267 --> 00:10:20.134
AND I FELT LIKE THE HOLY
SPIRIT SAID, GO TO NEW

00:10:20.234 --> 00:10:22.301
YORK AND SERVE THOSE
PEOPLE WITH YOUR LIFE.

00:10:22.401 --> 00:10:24.234
THAT WAS LIKE THE PHRASE.


00:10:24.334 --> 00:10:26.433
AND I TOLD MY WIFE, I
SAID, YOU KNOW WHAT?

00:10:26.533 --> 00:10:28.933
IF I JUST WENT OUT TO NEW
YORK AND HELPED FOR, YOU

00:10:29.033 --> 00:10:31.100
KNOW, JUST HELP FOR A WEEK
OR SO AND SHE SAID, YEAH,

00:10:31.200 --> 00:10:32.267
GO DO IT.


00:10:32.367 --> 00:10:36.300
SO MY THOUGHT PROCESS WAS,
IF I BRING MY CHAINSAW, I

00:10:36.400 --> 00:10:37.967
CAN HELP REMOVE DEBRIS
BECAUSE THERE WERE TREES

00:10:38.067 --> 00:10:39.733
FALLING EVERYWHERE
AND ALL THAT.

00:10:39.833 --> 00:10:41.500
AND THEN I'LL BRING MY
ACOUSTIC GUITAR AND JUST

00:10:41.600 --> 00:10:45.134
LEAD WORSHIP FOR PEOPLE
THAT ARE DEVASTATED.

00:10:45.234 --> 00:10:47.067
SO I SHOW UP TO
NEW YORK CITY AND.

00:10:47.167 --> 00:10:48.933
JONATHAN: WITH A CHAINSAW
AND A GUITAR?

00:10:49.033 --> 00:10:49.767
MIKE: LITERALLY,
THAT WAS IT.

00:10:49.867 --> 00:10:50.967
REBECCA: I LOVE IT.


00:10:51.067 --> 00:10:52.100
MIKE: AND AND LIKE A RATION
OF GASOLINE, BECAUSE THEY

00:10:52.200 --> 00:10:55.334
WERE AT THAT TIME, CARS
WERE LIKE IN LINE FOR GAS

00:10:55.434 --> 00:10:56.533
FOR MILES.


00:10:56.633 --> 00:10:59.100
SO I'LL NEVER FORGET,
LIKE, YEAH, I SHOW UP.

00:10:59.200 --> 00:11:01.867
I LITERALLY DROVE MY CAR
RIGHT INTO THE EPICENTER

00:11:01.967 --> 00:11:04.967
OF THIS STORM DEBRIS AND
JUST STARTED HELPING

00:11:05.067 --> 00:11:06.134
PEOPLE.


00:11:06.234 --> 00:11:08.733
BUT THE CRAZY THING IS,
THERE WERE THESE WARMING

00:11:08.833 --> 00:11:11.067
TENTS, AND THERE WERE
HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS OF

00:11:11.167 --> 00:11:12.533
NEW YORKERS IN THERE
BECAUSE THEY HAD BEEN

00:11:12.633 --> 00:11:14.200
DISPLACED FROM
THEIR HOMES.

00:11:14.300 --> 00:11:15.834
AND I PULLED OUT THE
ACOUSTIC GUITAR AND I

00:11:15.934 --> 00:11:16.967
STARTED SINGING THAT SONG.


00:11:17.067 --> 00:11:18.634
WHAT CAN WASH
AWAY MY SINS?

00:11:18.734 --> 00:11:20.167
NOTHING BUT THE
BLOOD OF JESUS.

00:11:20.267 --> 00:11:22.367
AND THE WHOLE
ATMOSPHERE SHIFTED.

00:11:22.467 --> 00:11:24.667
AND THEN NEW YORKERS
JUST STARTED CRYING.

00:11:24.767 --> 00:11:26.700
AND I SAID, WELL, WHO
WANTS TO ACCEPT CHRIST?

00:11:26.800 --> 00:11:28.333
AND THEY WERE LIKE PEOPLE
WERE RAISING THEIR HAND.

00:11:28.433 --> 00:11:31.067
IT WAS LIKE I BASICALLY
MADE THE WARMING TENT INTO

00:11:31.167 --> 00:11:33.300
A CHURCH SERVICE
AND NOBODY CARED.

00:11:33.400 --> 00:11:34.567
REBECCA: A REVIVAL TENT.


00:11:34.667 --> 00:11:35.500
MIKE: YEAH.


00:11:35.600 --> 00:11:36.500
AND I REMEMBER ONE
WOMAN TOLD ME SHE.

00:11:36.600 --> 00:11:36.967
YEAH.


00:11:37.067 --> 00:11:38.234
REVIVAL TENT.


00:11:38.334 --> 00:11:41.200
SHE SAID, YOU KNOW, WE
HAVE FOOD, WE HAVE WATER,

00:11:41.300 --> 00:11:44.101
WE HAVE THE WARMING TENTS,
BUT WE DON'T HAVE PEACE.

00:11:44.201 --> 00:11:45.834
AND WHEN YOU STARTED
PLAYING THE GUITAR, THAT'S

00:11:45.934 --> 00:11:47.134
WHAT WE NEEDED.


00:11:47.234 --> 00:11:48.567
AND.


00:11:48.667 --> 00:11:49.701
YEAH.


00:11:49.801 --> 00:11:51.000
SO THEN I TOLD MY WIFE, I
SAID, I FEEL LIKE THIS IS

00:11:51.100 --> 00:11:52.833
HOME.


00:11:52.933 --> 00:11:54.967
AND THEN WE JUST STARTED
GOING OUT TO NEW YORK

00:11:55.067 --> 00:11:57.867
INCREMENTALLY, JUST LIKE
SPYING OUT THE LAND.

00:11:57.967 --> 00:11:58.467
REBECCA: THAT'S


00:11:58.567 --> 00:11:59.734
SUCH A POWERFUL WORD.


00:11:59.834 --> 00:12:01.767
WHAT THAT LADY
SAID, BECAUSE THAT'S TRUE.

00:12:01.867 --> 00:12:02.867
IT'S LIKE


00:12:02.967 --> 00:12:04.034
EVEN IF YOU HAVE ALL OF
YOUR BASIC NEEDS MET, IF

00:12:04.134 --> 00:12:06.734
YOU DON'T HAVE GOD,
YOU'RE GOING TO BE EMPTY.

00:12:06.834 --> 00:12:08.600
AND SO SPEAKING TO THE
SPIRITUAL HUNGER OF THE

00:12:08.700 --> 00:12:09.533
CITY.


00:12:09.633 --> 00:12:10.734
MIKE: YEAH.


00:12:10.834 --> 00:12:11.867
REBECCA: BUT I LOVE YOUR HEART
BECAUSE IT WASN'T LIKE

00:12:11.967 --> 00:12:13.234
WE'RE GOING TO GO OUT AND
BUILD THIS HUGE CHURCH.

00:12:13.334 --> 00:12:14.767
IT WAS LIKE, I'M JUST
GOING TO GO OUT AND SERVE

00:12:14.867 --> 00:12:15.734
THESE PEOPLE.


00:12:15.834 --> 00:12:18.967
BUT THEN GOD UNFOLDED
THIS BIGGER PLAN.

00:12:19.067 --> 00:12:20.167
MIKE: YEAH.


00:12:20.267 --> 00:12:21.434
REBECCA: AND SO I LOVE THAT
Y'ALL'S HEART WAS JUST TO

00:12:21.534 --> 00:12:23.534
SERVE BECAUSE THAT SHOULD
BE OUR HEART POSTURE.

00:12:23.634 --> 00:12:24.700
MIKE: YES.


00:12:24.800 --> 00:12:26.233
REBECCA: TO SERVE PEOPLE NOT
LIKE WE HAVE THESE BIG

00:12:26.333 --> 00:12:27.001
PLANS.


00:12:27.101 --> 00:12:27.634
WE'RE GONNA DO THIS THING.


00:12:27.734 --> 00:12:28.434
YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?


00:12:28.534 --> 00:12:29.400
MIKE: WELL, ALL THESE.


00:12:29.500 --> 00:12:30.533
IT'S SO FUNNY YOU'RE
SAYING THAT YOU'RE

00:12:30.633 --> 00:12:32.767
TOUCHING ON SOMETHING
ALL THESE YEARS LATER.

00:12:32.867 --> 00:12:34.567
YOU KNOW, WE, LIKE,
MARRIED THE CITY, YOU

00:12:34.667 --> 00:12:36.667
KNOW, LIKE, IT'S VERY HARD
LIVING IN NEW YORK CITY

00:12:36.767 --> 00:12:38.067
AFTER THE PANDEMIC.


00:12:38.167 --> 00:12:40.767
I MEAN, HUNDREDS OF
THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE LEFT.

00:12:40.867 --> 00:12:41.367
WE STAYED.


00:12:41.467 --> 00:12:43.267
OBVIOUSLY THAT'S TRUE.


00:12:43.367 --> 00:12:45.867
AND IN THE MINISTRY WORLD,
EVERYBODY USES NEW YORK AS

00:12:45.967 --> 00:12:47.834
THEIR COOL EVENT SPACE.


00:12:47.934 --> 00:12:49.834
YOU KNOW, IT'S LIKE, I
WANT TO DO SOMETHING EPIC.

00:12:49.934 --> 00:12:51.067
LET'S GO TO NEW YORK.


00:12:51.167 --> 00:12:52.833
AND SOMETIMES WHEN YOU
LIVE THERE, IT CAN BE

00:12:52.933 --> 00:12:55.600
LIKE, YEAH, BUT WE DON'T
NEED A ONE TIME EVENT.

00:12:55.700 --> 00:12:57.834
WE NEED WE NEED SOMEBODY
WHO WILL, LIKE, LIVE HERE

00:12:57.934 --> 00:13:00.767
AND SERVE AND, YOU KNOW,
LIKE AND BUILD REAL

00:13:00.867 --> 00:13:03.900
PARTNERSHIP, YOU KNOW,
AND ESPECIALLY LIKE NEW

00:13:04.000 --> 00:13:06.701
YORKERS ARE VERY SKEPTICAL
BECAUSE LIKE PEOPLE COME

00:13:06.801 --> 00:13:09.201
AND THEY GO, THEY THEY
START MINISTRIES AND THEN

00:13:09.301 --> 00:13:10.634
THEY FAIL AND THEY LEAVE.


00:13:10.734 --> 00:13:14.833
AND I THINK FOR US, LIKE
IT TOOK ALMOST LIKE 6 OR 7

00:13:14.933 --> 00:13:17.600
YEARS FOR THE NEW YORKERS
TO TRUST US BECAUSE THEY

00:13:17.700 --> 00:13:19.067
JUST KEPT THINKING, WELL,
YOU'RE GOING TO LEAVE TOO,

00:13:19.167 --> 00:13:20.334
YOU KNOW?


00:13:20.434 --> 00:13:23.401
AND SO WE REALLY LIKE WE
SHOWED UP AS SERVANTS, NOT

00:13:23.501 --> 00:13:25.834
PREACHERS, NOT YOUTUBERS.


00:13:25.934 --> 00:13:27.567
LIKE, I SHOWED UP
JUST AS A SERVANT.

00:13:27.633 --> 00:13:29.800
WE STILL HAVE THAT
HEART POSTURE TODAY.

00:13:29.900 --> 00:13:31.234
JULIE: YEAH, WE STILL SERVE.


00:13:31.334 --> 00:13:33.600
MIKE: WE STILL
DISTRIBUTE FOOD TOO.

00:13:33.700 --> 00:13:35.633
JULIE: IN FACT, THE THE SAME
BUILDING THAT WE HAD OUR

00:13:35.733 --> 00:13:37.933
VISION CAST FOR
OUR CHURCH IN.

00:13:38.033 --> 00:13:40.534
WE WOULD IT IT HAD
MISSIONARY HOUSING.

00:13:40.634 --> 00:13:42.634
WE WOULD STAY THERE WHEN
WE WERE PLANTING OUR

00:13:42.734 --> 00:13:45.734
CHURCH BECAUSE WE WERE
LIKE WE WERE NOT SECOND OR

00:13:45.834 --> 00:13:47.567
THIRD OR FOURTH
GENERATION MINISTRY.

00:13:47.667 --> 00:13:51.034
WE WERE FIRST GENERATION,
SO WE KNEW HOW TO DO

00:13:51.134 --> 00:13:51.734
NOTHING.


00:13:51.834 --> 00:13:52.734
WE HAD NOTHING.


00:13:52.834 --> 00:13:56.167
NO MONEY, NO FUNDS,
NO, NO ANYTHING.

00:13:56.267 --> 00:14:00.034
AND THE PLACE WHERE WE HAD
OUR VISION CAST, WE WOULD

00:14:00.134 --> 00:14:01.967
STAY THERE BECAUSE WE
COULD STAY THERE FOR FREE.

00:14:02.067 --> 00:14:05.334
IT WAS FOR MISSIONARIES,
AND WE WOULD GO THERE AND

00:14:05.434 --> 00:14:07.567
WE WOULD WORK ON OUR
CHURCH PLANT, AND WE

00:14:07.667 --> 00:14:09.533
ACTUALLY SERVE
FOOD OUT OF THERE.

00:14:09.633 --> 00:14:13.267
FOR THE LAST TEN YEARS, WE
JUST MOVED INTO OUR OWN

00:14:13.367 --> 00:14:16.300
OUR OWN LOCATION JUST A
FEW WEEKS AGO, AND IT'S

00:14:16.400 --> 00:14:20.034
LIKE WE WOULD JUST BEEN
SHOWING UP, JUST DOING THE

00:14:20.134 --> 00:14:21.600
SAME THING, YOU KNOW?


00:14:21.700 --> 00:14:22.834
SO I ALWAYS TELL
PEOPLE I'M LIKE, DON'T

00:14:22.934 --> 00:14:26.100
UNDERESTIMATE JUST
REPEATING THE SAME THING

00:14:26.200 --> 00:14:28.167
FOR MANY YEARS IN A ROW.


00:14:28.267 --> 00:14:31.400
AND I FEEL LIKE GOD'S
REALLY USED THAT TO BUILD

00:14:31.500 --> 00:14:32.800
TRUST WITH.


00:14:32.900 --> 00:14:34.567
REBECCA: BECAUSE YOU'RE
SHOWING CONSISTENCY.

00:14:34.667 --> 00:14:36.001
MIKE: YEAH, YEAH.


00:14:36.101 --> 00:14:37.701
JONATHAN: SO YOU GUYS ARE
BOTH FIRST GENERATION.

00:14:37.801 --> 00:14:42.734
SO NEITHER ONE WERE RAISED
IN A CHRISTIAN HOME.

00:14:42.834 --> 00:14:43.767
REBECCA: SO NOW WE'RE GOING TO
TRANSITION TO THE STORY

00:14:43.867 --> 00:14:45.000
BECAUSE I WANTED
TO GET TO THIS.

00:14:45.100 --> 00:14:47.267
BECAUSE Y'ALL HEARING
EVERYTHING THAT HOW GOD

00:14:47.367 --> 00:14:48.567
HAS USED YOU AND
EVERYTHING THAT Y'ALL ARE

00:14:48.667 --> 00:14:49.700
DOING.


00:14:49.800 --> 00:14:50.867
BUT WHEN I THINK BACK ON
YOUR STORY, I'M LIKE, THIS

00:14:50.967 --> 00:14:51.467
IS WILD.


00:14:51.567 --> 00:14:52.433
LIKE WHAT GOD CAN DO.


00:14:52.533 --> 00:14:54.600
SO CAN YOU GUYS
SHARE YOUR STORY?

00:14:54.700 --> 00:14:58.300
JULIE: YEAH, YEAH, WE'RE FIRST
GENERATION MINISTRY, OKAY.

00:14:58.400 --> 00:15:00.867
BUT I WAS
MULTI-GENERATIONAL, LIKE

00:15:00.967 --> 00:15:02.000
CHRISTIAN.


00:15:02.100 --> 00:15:04.467
MY GREAT GRANDFATHER WAS A
SPIRIT FILLED CHRISTIAN,

00:15:04.567 --> 00:15:05.633
HAS A MIRACULOUS STORY.


00:15:05.733 --> 00:15:09.034
I ACTUALLY HAVE MIRACULOUS
CONVERSIONS ON BOTH SIDES

00:15:09.134 --> 00:15:10.433
OF MY FAMILY.


00:15:10.533 --> 00:15:11.967
REBECCA: WAIT, CAN YOU SHARE,
LIKE, MAYBE ONE LITTLE

00:15:12.067 --> 00:15:12.700
STORY?


00:15:12.800 --> 00:15:13.834
I JUST LOVE
THOSE STORIES.

00:15:13.934 --> 00:15:14.767
MIKE: TELL THE STORY
ABOUT YOUR GRANDFATHER,

00:15:14.867 --> 00:15:15.567
AND THE WORD


00:15:15.667 --> 00:15:16.633
HE HAD ABOUT A
HUNDRED YEARS.

00:15:16.733 --> 00:15:17.800
JULIE: YEAH.


00:15:17.900 --> 00:15:21.967
SO A FEW, A FEW YEARS AGO,
I GOT SENT THIS YOUTUBE

00:15:22.067 --> 00:15:23.634
VIDEO BY MY MOM.


00:15:23.734 --> 00:15:27.067
ONE OF THE FAMILY MEMBERS
HAD UPLOADED THIS VIDEO

00:15:27.167 --> 00:15:30.367
THAT WAS FILMED WITH
THOSE OLD HUGE VCRS.

00:15:30.467 --> 00:15:33.767
YEAH, IN THE 80S OR
WHATEVER, OR I DON'T EVEN

00:15:33.867 --> 00:15:34.834
KNOW, CAMCORDERS.


00:15:34.934 --> 00:15:36.067
I DON'T EVEN KNOW
THE WORDS ANYMORE.

00:15:36.167 --> 00:15:37.200
THANK YOU.


00:15:37.300 --> 00:15:38.367
JONATHAN: VCR WAS THE
TAPES, THE VCR?

00:15:38.467 --> 00:15:39.767
[ LAUGHING ]
JULIE: YEAH.

00:15:39.867 --> 00:15:42.634
SO SOMEBODY HAD THE
WHEREWITHAL TO JUST START

00:15:42.734 --> 00:15:45.267
FILMING ONE OF ONE OF OUR
FAMILY DISTANT FAMILY

00:15:45.367 --> 00:15:49.034
MEMBERS, AND SHE RECORDED
THIS TESTIMONY OF MY GREAT

00:15:49.134 --> 00:15:52.800
GRANDFATHER TELLING ABOUT
HIS MIRACULOUS CONVERSION

00:15:52.900 --> 00:15:58.867
STORY, ABOUT HOW THE LORD
MIRACULOUSLY SAVED HIM.

00:15:58.967 --> 00:16:01.967
YOU KNOW, THROUGH THIS
REVIVAL THAT HAD WENT

00:16:02.067 --> 00:16:04.233
THROUGH THEIR TOWN AND HOW
HE CRIED OUT TO GOD, AND

00:16:04.333 --> 00:16:07.033
HE GOT FILLED WITH THE
HOLY SPIRIT IMMEDIATELY,

00:16:07.133 --> 00:16:09.334
AND JUST THIS MIRACULOUS
THING THAT HAPPENED TO

00:16:09.434 --> 00:16:11.367
HIM, HE HAD LIKE AN
ANGELIC ENCOUNTER, ALL

00:16:11.467 --> 00:16:12.667
THIS CRAZY STUFF.


00:16:12.767 --> 00:16:13.900
REBECCA: WOW.


00:16:14.000 --> 00:16:17.401
JULIE: AND HE IS SITTING IN THIS
LIVING ROOM TALKING ABOUT

00:16:17.501 --> 00:16:21.334
HIS CONVERSION FROM THOSE
IN 1923 IS WHEN THAT

00:16:21.434 --> 00:16:22.367
HAPPENED.


00:16:22.467 --> 00:16:23.800
THE HIS CONVERSION.


00:16:23.900 --> 00:16:27.033
AND THIS IS LIKE 1980
SOMETHING IN THIS LIVING

00:16:27.133 --> 00:16:28.133
ROOM.


00:16:28.233 --> 00:16:30.001
AND HE'S SHARING THIS
STORY AND HE'S GIVING A

00:16:30.101 --> 00:16:33.900
PROPHETIC WORD FOR IN THE
NEXT, YOU KNOW, IN 100

00:16:34.000 --> 00:16:37.334
YEARS, OUR GRANDCHILDREN
HAVE TO CARRY ON THIS

00:16:37.434 --> 00:16:40.467
LEGACY OF LIKE
THE SUPERNATURAL.

00:16:40.567 --> 00:16:42.567
THEY HAVE TO CARRY ON THIS
LEGACY OF LIKE, SPIRIT

00:16:42.667 --> 00:16:45.700
FILLED CHRISTIANITY,
CHRISTIANITY WITH POWER.

00:16:45.800 --> 00:16:47.400
AND HE'S SHARING
THIS WORD.

00:16:47.500 --> 00:16:50.533
AND ME AND MIKE ARE JUST
BAWLING BECAUSE AT THE

00:16:50.633 --> 00:16:53.167
TIME THAT THIS WORD WAS
SHARED, HE GOT SAVED IN

00:16:53.267 --> 00:16:54.667
1923.


00:16:54.767 --> 00:16:58.167
AND IT'S 2023, AND WE'RE
WATCHING THIS WORD AND

00:16:58.267 --> 00:17:00.067
WE'RE GETTING READY TO
HAVE OUR CONFERENCE AND

00:17:00.167 --> 00:17:02.267
WE'RE GETTING READY TO
PLANT ANOTHER CAMPUS.

00:17:02.367 --> 00:17:05.967
AND IT WAS LIKE THE WORD
WAS BEING FULFILLED.

00:17:06.067 --> 00:17:07.600
YEAH.


00:17:07.700 --> 00:17:09.734
AND I WOULD SAY, LIKE, IF
ANYBODY IS LISTENING, LIKE

00:17:09.834 --> 00:17:12.434
YOU BE THE ONE IN YOUR
FAMILY TO GIVE THE

00:17:12.534 --> 00:17:15.500
PROPHETIC WORD, IF YOU'RE
THE FIRST GENERATION IN

00:17:15.600 --> 00:17:18.534
YOUR FAMILY, LIKE GIVE
THAT WORD, OPEN UP YOUR

00:17:18.634 --> 00:17:21.601
MOUTH AND SEE WHAT WHAT
GOD MIGHT FULFILL IN 100

00:17:21.701 --> 00:17:22.634
YEARS FROM NOW.


00:17:22.734 --> 00:17:24.267
SO THAT'S KIND
OF MY TESTIMONY.

00:17:24.367 --> 00:17:25.900
HE'S GOT A CRAZIER STORY.


00:17:26.000 --> 00:17:27.234
WHICH A LITTLE JUICIER.


00:17:27.334 --> 00:17:28.401
REBECCA: I HAVE TO SAY,
REALLY QUICK.

00:17:28.501 --> 00:17:30.667
THAT'S LIKE Y'ALL'S BOOK,
BECAUSE IT'S LIKE THROUGH

00:17:30.767 --> 00:17:31.934
THE GENERATIONS.


00:17:32.034 --> 00:17:33.234
BOTH: YES.


00:17:33.334 --> 00:17:36.134
REBECCA: IT'S LIKE HE CHANGED
THE ENTIRE GOD IN HIS GRACE,

00:17:36.234 --> 00:17:37.900
CHANGED THE ENTIRE LINEAGE
OF YOUR FAMILY, AND YOU'RE

00:17:38.000 --> 00:17:39.101
STILL LIVING THAT OUT.


00:17:39.201 --> 00:17:40.067
THAT'S POWERFUL.


00:17:40.167 --> 00:17:40.700
JULIE: YES.


00:17:40.800 --> 00:17:42.067
IT REALLY, REALLY WAS.


00:17:42.167 --> 00:17:43.200
MIKE: WASN'T IT?


00:17:43.300 --> 00:17:44.900
LIKE THE DAY THE DAY HE
GOT SAVED, THE LORD SPOKE

00:17:45.000 --> 00:17:48.234
TO HIM AND SAID, 100 YEARS
FROM NOW THAT THEY THEY

00:17:48.334 --> 00:17:50.233
ARE GOING TO NEED THE
POWER OF GOD AGAIN.

00:17:50.333 --> 00:17:51.300
THEY'RE GOING TO.


00:17:51.400 --> 00:17:53.033
AND THEN WE'RE SITTING
THERE GETTING READY TO

00:17:53.133 --> 00:17:55.134
PREPARE FOR THIS, LIKE,
STADIUM EVENT, ALL THIS

00:17:55.234 --> 00:17:56.667
CRAZY STUFF WE'RE DOING.


00:17:56.767 --> 00:17:57.900
AND IT'S LIKE THAT.


00:17:58.000 --> 00:18:00.367
YOU'RE THE GREAT
GRANDDAUGHTER OF THE MAN.

00:18:00.467 --> 00:18:01.967
AND A HUNDRED YEARS
FROM NOW, HIS GREAT

00:18:02.067 --> 00:18:04.934
GRANDDAUGHTER IS LEADING A
MULTI-SITE NATIONAL CHURCH

00:18:05.034 --> 00:18:07.000
STADIUM CONFERENCES.


00:18:07.100 --> 00:18:09.034
AND AND IT WAS LIKE,
THERE'S NO WAY HE COULD

00:18:09.134 --> 00:18:10.701
HAVE KNOWN, BECAUSE I
DON'T THINK YOU EVER EVEN

00:18:10.801 --> 00:18:11.867
MET HIM.


00:18:11.967 --> 00:18:14.233
JULIE: DON'T EVEN REMEMBER
MEETING HIM LIKE HE YOU

00:18:14.333 --> 00:18:15.334
KNOW, HE DIED WHEN I WAS
JUST LIKE A TODDLER OR

00:18:15.434 --> 00:18:16.434
SOMETHING.


00:18:16.534 --> 00:18:18.333
BUT IT WAS LIKE THE FACT
THAT THAT WAS ON FILM AND

00:18:18.433 --> 00:18:20.200
THAT WE JUST
HAPPENED TO GET IT.

00:18:20.300 --> 00:18:22.833
I MEAN, HOW MANY VHS ARE
JUST SITTING IN PEOPLE'S

00:18:22.933 --> 00:18:23.734
ATTICS.


00:18:23.834 --> 00:18:25.267
REBECCA: LIKE THAT WAS
A GOD THING.

00:18:25.367 --> 00:18:25.600
JULIE: NEVER TO BE SEEN?


00:18:25.700 --> 00:18:26.134
YES.


00:18:26.234 --> 00:18:27.001
AND I JUST


00:18:27.101 --> 00:18:28.201
HAPPENED TO GET
MY HANDS ON IT.

00:18:28.301 --> 00:18:29.033
SO YEAH.


00:18:29.133 --> 00:18:29.967
GOD'S CRAZY.


00:18:30.067 --> 00:18:31.167
REBECCA: THAT'S SO COOL.


00:18:31.267 --> 00:18:32.534
JULIE: THAT'S A LITTLE
BIT OF MY, MY STORY. BUT YEAH.

00:18:32.634 --> 00:18:33.733
MIKE: MINE'S MUCH DARKER.


00:18:33.833 --> 00:18:35.501
[ LAUGHING ]
JULIE: HIS IS MUCH DARKER.

00:18:35.601 --> 00:18:37.067
DO TELL.


00:18:37.167 --> 00:18:39.567
[ LAUGHING ]


00:18:39.667 --> 00:18:42.367
MIKE: NO I MEAN MY, MY MOM
EVENTUALLY DID GET SAVED,

00:18:42.467 --> 00:18:44.600
YOU KNOW WHEN I WAS A KID
AND WHICH WAS AN AMAZING

00:18:44.700 --> 00:18:45.734
STORY.


00:18:45.834 --> 00:18:47.900
AND SO SHE TRIED TO RAISE
US IN CHURCH, BUT SHE WAS

00:18:48.000 --> 00:18:49.233
REPEATING CYCLES.


00:18:49.333 --> 00:18:51.734
SO SHE WAS SAVED, BUT SHE
DIDN'T UNDERSTAND HOW TO

00:18:51.834 --> 00:18:54.667
DEAL WITH TRAUMA AND THE
PAIN FROM HER PAST AND ALL

00:18:54.767 --> 00:18:55.833
OF THAT.


00:18:55.933 --> 00:18:57.567
SO SHE KEPT LIKE REPEATING
CERTAIN MISTAKES OVER AND

00:18:57.667 --> 00:18:59.567
OVER AGAIN SO SHE WOULD
GET MARRIED TO THE WRONG

00:18:59.667 --> 00:19:02.900
GUY AND THEN GET DIVORCED,
GET MARRIED, GET DIVORCED.

00:19:03.000 --> 00:19:04.034
REBECCA: SO THAT CYCLE.


00:19:04.134 --> 00:19:05.234
MIKE: YES.


00:19:05.334 --> 00:19:06.567
AND THAT WAS LIKE MY
CHILDHOOD WAS REALLY

00:19:06.667 --> 00:19:09.234
UNSTABLE AS A
RESULT OF THAT.

00:19:09.334 --> 00:19:12.400
AND SO IT WAS THERE WERE
A LOT OF UPS AND DOWNS.

00:19:12.500 --> 00:19:13.934
REBECCA: WHAT ABOUT YOUR DAD?


00:19:14.034 --> 00:19:14.967
SO BECAUSE YOU TALKED
ABOUT YOUR MOM, WHERE WAS

00:19:15.067 --> 00:19:16.367
YOUR DAD IN THE PICTURE?


00:19:16.467 --> 00:19:17.533
MIKE: YEAH.


00:19:17.633 --> 00:19:19.400
SO THEY GOT DIVORCED WHEN
I WAS VERY YOUNG, LIKE ONE

00:19:19.500 --> 00:19:22.167
ONE YEARS OLD, LIKE
BEFORE I WAS A TODDLER.

00:19:22.267 --> 00:19:25.067
AND HE LIVED A VERY
WILD LIFE, YOU KNOW?

00:19:25.167 --> 00:19:27.934
SO HE WAS LIKE, A DRINKER
AND A WOMANIZER AND, YOU

00:19:28.034 --> 00:19:30.401
KNOW, FAST CARS AND, LIKE,
YOU KNOW, KIND OF LIKE

00:19:30.501 --> 00:19:32.700
ROCK STAR LIFE, YOU KNOW?


00:19:32.800 --> 00:19:33.634
AND.


00:19:33.734 --> 00:19:35.867
BUT HIS DAD DIED
PREMATURELY AND HIS DAD,

00:19:35.967 --> 00:19:37.067
YOU KNOW, SO
I THINK --

00:19:37.167 --> 00:19:38.067
JONATHAN: GENERATIONAL.


00:19:38.167 --> 00:19:39.901
MIKE: YES, THERE WAS
THIS FEAR OF DEATH.

00:19:40.001 --> 00:19:42.234
I THINK THERE WAS A I'M
JUST GONNA LIVE MY LIFE.

00:19:42.334 --> 00:19:43.567
GOD'S NOT REAL.


00:19:43.667 --> 00:19:46.334
YOU KNOW, MY DAD WASN'T
A MAN OF FAITH LIKE.

00:19:46.434 --> 00:19:48.067
AND I THINK HE JUST
SAID, YOU KNOW WHAT?

00:19:48.167 --> 00:19:51.367
I'M JUST GONNA LIVE LIFE
IN WHATEVER PLEASURES.

00:19:51.467 --> 00:19:54.567
LIKE I'M JUST GOING TO
SATISFY MY OWN DESIRES.

00:19:54.667 --> 00:19:55.800
AND THAT WAS KIND OF IT.


00:19:55.900 --> 00:19:58.000
AND I DIDN'T HAVE A
RELATIONSHIP WITH HIM.

00:19:58.100 --> 00:19:59.667
JONATHAN: AND IS HE
STILL ALIVE TODAY?

00:19:59.767 --> 00:20:00.134
MIKE: NO.


00:20:00.234 --> 00:20:01.100
SO WHEN --


00:20:01.200 --> 00:20:02.033
REBECCA: AN INTEGRAL
PART OF THE STORY.

00:20:02.133 --> 00:20:03.100
MIKE: YEAH.


00:20:03.200 --> 00:20:05.334
BECAUSE SO FAST FORWARD,
I'M TRYING TO LIVE FOR

00:20:05.434 --> 00:20:06.367
GOD.


00:20:06.467 --> 00:20:07.900
REBECCA: DID YOU GET SAVED
AT A YOUNG AGE?

00:20:08.000 --> 00:20:08.334
WHEN DID YOU


00:20:08.434 --> 00:20:09.600
GET SAVED?


00:20:09.700 --> 00:20:11.600
MIKE: OKAY, SO WHEN MY SO THE
STORY THAT, THAT I'VE TOLD

00:20:11.700 --> 00:20:14.433
MANY TIMES IS LIKE MY
MOTHER WAS THE VICTIM OF

00:20:14.533 --> 00:20:15.833
DOMESTIC VIOLENCE.


00:20:15.933 --> 00:20:18.900
SO IT'S LIKE SHE LITERALLY
HAS TWO BLACK EYES, YOU

00:20:19.000 --> 00:20:20.900
KNOW, AND A BROKEN RIB.


00:20:21.000 --> 00:20:23.633
AND SHE'S RECOVERING
FROM THIS LAST INCIDENT.

00:20:23.733 --> 00:20:26.267
MY STEPFATHER HAD JUST
LEFT THE HOME, YOU KNOW,

00:20:26.367 --> 00:20:28.267
AND SHE'S READING
THE NEWSPAPER.

00:20:28.367 --> 00:20:30.667
SO, YOU KNOW, LIKE
OLD SCHOOL NEWSPAPER.

00:20:30.767 --> 00:20:33.134
AND A PASTOR HAD PUT A
CLASSIFIED AD THAT SAID

00:20:33.234 --> 00:20:35.434
HE WAS LOOKING FOR
A WORSHIP LEADER.

00:20:35.534 --> 00:20:38.067
AND SO THE STORY IS SO
ABSURD, LIKE THE OLDER YOU

00:20:38.167 --> 00:20:40.101
GET, LIKE, YOU LOOK BACK
AND YOU'RE LIKE, THIS IS A

00:20:40.201 --> 00:20:42.201
CRAZY, LIKE, REALLY ABSURD
BECAUSE MY MOM, FOR

00:20:42.301 --> 00:20:45.033
WHATEVER REASON, HAS THE
AUDACITY TO PICK UP THE

00:20:45.133 --> 00:20:46.834
PHONE AND CALL
THIS PASTOR.

00:20:46.934 --> 00:20:50.201
AND SHE BASICALLY SAID TO
HIM, YOU KNOW, I CAN PLAY

00:20:50.301 --> 00:20:51.401
THE PIANO AND SING.


00:20:51.501 --> 00:20:53.033
I CAN BE YOUR
WORSHIP LEADER.

00:20:53.133 --> 00:20:54.700
BUT THE ONLY PROBLEM IS,
LIKE, I GOT TWO BLACK

00:20:54.800 --> 00:20:55.801
EYES.


00:20:55.901 --> 00:20:57.733
MY MARRIAGE IS PROBABLY
GOING TO END IN DIVORCE.

00:20:57.833 --> 00:20:58.800
MY LIFE IS A MESS.


00:20:58.900 --> 00:21:00.567
I DON'T EVEN KNOW
IF I'M A CHRISTIAN.

00:21:00.667 --> 00:21:03.334
AND THEN THE GUY THIS
PASTOR SAID, WELL, I'M

00:21:03.434 --> 00:21:05.633
GONNA HE'S HE WAS LIKE AN
OLD SCHOOL PENTECOSTAL

00:21:05.733 --> 00:21:06.767
PASTOR.


00:21:06.867 --> 00:21:08.867
SO HE'S LIKE, HONEY, I'M
GONNA GRAB MY WIFE AND I'M

00:21:08.967 --> 00:21:11.233
COMING TO YOUR HOUSE AND
YOU'RE GOING TO BE SAVED.

00:21:11.333 --> 00:21:14.301
AND HE LITERALLY THAT MY
MOM HUNG UP THE PHONE,

00:21:14.401 --> 00:21:17.267
AND WITHIN AN HOUR LATER,
HE CAME TO OUR HOUSE WITH

00:21:17.367 --> 00:21:21.000
HIS WIFE AND LED MY
MOM TO CHRIST, PRAYED.

00:21:21.100 --> 00:21:23.401
SHE'S BAWLING HER EYES
OUT, AND I'M WATCHING MY

00:21:23.501 --> 00:21:25.833
MOM EXPERIENCE THE
JOY OF SALVATION.

00:21:25.933 --> 00:21:27.767
NOW I KNOW WHAT IT WAS
BECAUSE IT WASN'T THE

00:21:27.867 --> 00:21:29.434
TEARS OF PAIN.


00:21:29.534 --> 00:21:31.900
IT WAS THE TEARS OF
LIKE, RELIEF, RIGHT?

00:21:32.000 --> 00:21:33.201
JONATHAN: RIGHT, RELIEF.


00:21:33.301 --> 00:21:34.933
MIKE: JOY. AND IT WAS LIKE TO
ME, MY MOM WAS GLOWING.

00:21:35.033 --> 00:21:38.634
SO THAT NIGHT, AFTER THIS
WAS ALL OVER, I SAID, MOM,

00:21:38.734 --> 00:21:39.567
WHAT HAPPENED?


00:21:39.667 --> 00:21:40.434
WHAT HAPPENED TO YOU?


00:21:40.534 --> 00:21:42.134
AND SHE WAS LIKE,
I ACCEPTED JESUS.

00:21:42.234 --> 00:21:44.634
I GOT SAVED, AND SHE WAS
LIKE, DO YOU WANT TO

00:21:44.734 --> 00:21:46.167
ACCEPT CHRIST AS WELL?


00:21:46.267 --> 00:21:47.500
AND I SAID, YEAH.


00:21:47.600 --> 00:21:49.800
AND SO MY MOM
LED ME TO CHRIST.

00:21:49.900 --> 00:21:52.834
SO THAT'S WHAT STARTED MY
JOURNEY OF JUST SERVING

00:21:52.934 --> 00:21:53.967
THE LORD.


00:21:54.067 --> 00:21:55.967
AND WE WENT TO CHURCH AND
THROUGH ALL THE UPS AND

00:21:56.067 --> 00:21:58.067
DOWNS, THAT WAS THE ONE
CONSTANT WAS LIKE, WE'RE

00:21:58.167 --> 00:21:59.100
GOING TO CHURCH.


00:21:59.200 --> 00:22:00.567
WE HAVE NO IDEA HOW TO
LIVE LIFE, BUT WE'RE

00:22:00.667 --> 00:22:02.333
GOING TO FIGURE THIS OUT.


00:22:02.433 --> 00:22:06.934
REBECCA: AND SO FROM THERE,
YOU TWO MET EACH OTHER?

00:22:07.034 --> 00:22:07.933
CAN YOU TELL THAT STORY?


00:22:08.033 --> 00:22:08.634
JULIE: YEAH.


00:22:08.734 --> 00:22:11.201
[GO AHEAD.
[ LAUGHING ]

00:22:11.301 --> 00:22:11.833
JONATHAN: THERE'S A LOT OF
GO AHEAD.

00:22:11.933 --> 00:22:13.067
REBECCA: DO TELL.


00:22:13.167 --> 00:22:15.034
MIKE: SO LIKE EVENTUALLY LIKE
I STARTED PREACHING AND

00:22:15.134 --> 00:22:17.867
LEADING WORSHIP
AND ALL THAT.

00:22:17.967 --> 00:22:18.767
REBECCA: SO YOU FELT THE
CALL TO MINISTRY?

00:22:18.867 --> 00:22:19.467
MIKE: OH YEAH.


00:22:19.567 --> 00:22:20.867
DEFINITELY.


00:22:20.967 --> 00:22:21.900
DEFINITELY.


00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:23.900
AND YOU KNOW, I WAS
STRUGGLING TOO BECAUSE

00:22:24.000 --> 00:22:26.367
BACK IN THE DAY, LIKE WHEN
YOU THINK ABOUT THE 80S,

00:22:26.467 --> 00:22:30.901
THE 90S, THE EARLY 2000,
LIKE THERAPY, COUNSELING,

00:22:31.001 --> 00:22:32.234
YOU DIDN'T TALK.


00:22:32.334 --> 00:22:35.767
IT WAS JUST LIKE YOU PRAY
ABOUT IT AND THAT'S IT, RIGHT?

00:22:35.867 --> 00:22:36.900
JULIE: YOU DIDN'T EVEN TALK.


00:22:37.000 --> 00:22:39.067
I MEAN, PEOPLE DIDN'T EVEN
TALK ABOUT THOSE THINGS,

00:22:39.167 --> 00:22:39.534
RIGHT?


00:22:39.634 --> 00:22:40.334
MUCH LESS.


00:22:40.434 --> 00:22:41.334
JONATHAN: WHAT THINGS?


00:22:41.434 --> 00:22:42.100
JULIE: PRAY ABOUT THEM.


00:22:42.200 --> 00:22:42.801
LIKE TRAUMA.


00:22:42.901 --> 00:22:43.434
JONATHAN: OKAY.


00:22:43.534 --> 00:22:44.634
REBECCA: INNER HEALING.


00:22:44.734 --> 00:22:46.067
GOING GOING TO THERAPY.


00:22:46.167 --> 00:22:47.100
JULIE: REJECTION. YEAH.


00:22:47.200 --> 00:22:47.567
ALL THOSE THINGS.


00:22:47.667 --> 00:22:48.067
MIKE: YEAH.


00:22:48.167 --> 00:22:49.000
YOU JUST, YOU --


00:22:49.100 --> 00:22:49.967
REBECCA:
FATHER WOUNDS,

00:22:50.067 --> 00:22:51.100
ATTACHMENT STYLES.


00:22:51.200 --> 00:22:52.200
ALL THE STUFF THAT
WE TALK ABOUT NOW.

00:22:52.300 --> 00:22:52.834
MIKE: YEAH.


00:22:52.934 --> 00:22:54.000
NOW IT'S LIKE NORMAL.


00:22:54.100 --> 00:22:55.234
BUT I REMEMBER BACK IN THE
DAY, IT'S LIKE IF SOMEONE

00:22:55.334 --> 00:22:56.967
SAID, I'M IN THERAPY, YOU
WERE LIKE, OH, YOU'RE

00:22:57.067 --> 00:22:58.801
CRAZY.


00:22:58.901 --> 00:22:59.400
YOU KNOW, LIKE.


00:22:59.500 --> 00:23:00.667
IT WASN'T NORMAL.


00:23:00.767 --> 00:23:02.633
IT WASN'T ESPECIALLY WHERE
WE'RE FROM BECAUSE IT WAS

00:23:02.733 --> 00:23:03.967
LIKE BLUE COLLAR.


00:23:04.067 --> 00:23:06.200
SO AND I HAD ALL THIS
STUFF THAT I HADN'T DEALT

00:23:06.300 --> 00:23:08.067
WITH AND I'M THINKING,
WELL, I'M JUST GOING TO

00:23:08.167 --> 00:23:09.201
BE THIS...


00:23:09.301 --> 00:23:09.633
REBECCA: FROM
YOUR CHILDHOOD.

00:23:09.733 --> 00:23:10.134
MIKE: YEAH.


00:23:10.234 --> 00:23:12.100
SUPER CHRISTIAN.


00:23:12.200 --> 00:23:14.733
SO ANYWAYS, I COME OUT
TO DO THIS, LIKE EVENT AND

00:23:14.833 --> 00:23:16.633
I'M PLAYING ON THE BAND,
AND THEN I LOOK DOWN AND

00:23:16.733 --> 00:23:19.900
INTO THE CROWD AND I SEE
THIS, LIKE, CURLY HEADED,

00:23:20.000 --> 00:23:21.601
BLOND HAIRED GIRL.


00:23:21.701 --> 00:23:24.133
AND I WAS LIKE, I'M THAT
GIRL, I WANT THAT GIRL.

00:23:24.233 --> 00:23:26.134
[LAUGHTER] SO I BASICALLY
WENT UP TO HER AND TRIED

00:23:26.234 --> 00:23:29.434
TO SPIT SOME GAME
AND SHE REJECTED ME.

00:23:29.534 --> 00:23:29.900
JONATHAN: DANG.


00:23:30.000 --> 00:23:30.667
JULIE: YEAH.


00:23:30.767 --> 00:23:32.500
HE WANTED MY NUMBER.


00:23:32.600 --> 00:23:35.267
I WAS LIKE, NO, THANK
YOU, I'M DATING JESUS.

00:23:35.367 --> 00:23:36.833
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU GUYS
REMEMBER THAT PHASE.

00:23:36.933 --> 00:23:38.034
REBECCA: OH YEAH.


00:23:38.134 --> 00:23:38.934
JULIE: LIKE I'M


00:23:39.034 --> 00:23:39.867
FOCUSED ON THE LORD.


00:23:39.967 --> 00:23:41.834
I'M LIKE, CAN'T
CAN'T HELP YOU THERE.

00:23:41.934 --> 00:23:43.233
SORRY, BUT YEAH.


00:23:43.333 --> 00:23:44.334
YEAH.


00:23:44.434 --> 00:23:45.433
AND I THINK WE HAD MET
LIKE MAYBE ONE OTHER TIME

00:23:45.533 --> 00:23:46.334
BEFORE THAT.


00:23:46.434 --> 00:23:48.934
AND SO THIS WAS LIKE
HIS MEGA ATTEMPT

00:23:49.034 --> 00:23:49.733
TO LIKE.


00:23:49.833 --> 00:23:50.267
MIKE: YEAH.


00:23:50.367 --> 00:23:50.734
YEAH.


00:23:50.834 --> 00:23:51.833
SO YOU SAID...


00:23:51.933 --> 00:23:53.000
JULIE: TO GET ME.


00:23:53.100 --> 00:23:54.667
MIKE: LIKE SOMETHING TO
THE SHE WAS LIKE, WELL, WE

00:23:54.767 --> 00:23:55.467
COULD BE FRIENDS.


00:23:55.567 --> 00:23:56.467
LIKE I'LL GIVE
YOU MY EMAIL.

00:23:56.567 --> 00:23:57.400
JULIE: YEAH.


00:23:57.500 --> 00:23:58.634
I WAS LIKE, I'LL GIVE
YOU MY EMAIL.

00:23:58.734 --> 00:24:01.334
AND HE EMAILED
ME EVERY DAY.

00:24:01.434 --> 00:24:02.467
REBECCA: THAT'S A BIG DEAL.


00:24:02.567 --> 00:24:04.267
THAT'S CONSISTENCY.


00:24:04.367 --> 00:24:05.767
JULIE: HE WAS A
COMMITTED EMAILER.

00:24:05.867 --> 00:24:06.400
MIKE: YEAH.


00:24:06.500 --> 00:24:07.367
REBECCA: THAT'S SWEET.


00:24:07.467 --> 00:24:08.533
MIKE: YEAH. AND SO I KEPT
EMAILING HER.

00:24:08.633 --> 00:24:10.734
AND THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN I
WAS LIKE, HEY, IT'S NOT A

00:24:10.834 --> 00:24:13.033
DATE, BUT WHAT IF WE
JUST GO OUT FOR COFFEE?

00:24:13.133 --> 00:24:14.934
YOU KNOW, BECAUSE THAT
WAS KIND OF MY FAKE OUT.

00:24:15.034 --> 00:24:16.967
SO SHE WAS LIKE, YEAH, YOU
KNOW, LIKE, I GUESS WE

00:24:17.067 --> 00:24:17.700
COULD JUST BE FRIENDS.


00:24:17.800 --> 00:24:19.200
WE'LL GO OUT FOR COFFEE.


00:24:19.300 --> 00:24:21.034
AND THEN WITHIN THE FIRST
FIVE MINUTES, LIKE I HAD

00:24:21.134 --> 00:24:23.367
HER LAUGHING AND COFFEE,
LIKE, CAME OUT OF HER NOSE

00:24:23.467 --> 00:24:25.967
AND SHE WAS
LAUGHING SO HARD.

00:24:26.067 --> 00:24:27.867
I BASICALLY WAS LIKE,
ALL RIGHT, I GOT HER.

00:24:27.967 --> 00:24:28.567
IT'S OVER.


00:24:28.667 --> 00:24:29.133
REBECCA: IT'S LOCKED IN.


00:24:29.233 --> 00:24:29.934
IT WAS.


00:24:30.034 --> 00:24:30.400
JULIE: I WAS LOCKED IN.


00:24:30.500 --> 00:24:30.867
YEAH.


00:24:30.967 --> 00:24:31.300
AND HE DID.


00:24:31.400 --> 00:24:32.167
HE GOT ME.


00:24:32.267 --> 00:24:33.133
I WAS LIKE, THAT'S IT.


00:24:33.233 --> 00:24:34.467
THAT'S HAPPENING.


00:24:34.567 --> 00:24:38.234
LIKE I NEVER I NEVER
WANTED ANYONE ELSE SINCE.

00:24:38.334 --> 00:24:39.601
REBECCA: AW, THAT'S SWEET.


00:24:39.701 --> 00:24:41.167
SO HOW LONG UNTIL
Y'ALL GOT MARRIED?

00:24:41.267 --> 00:24:42.401
HOW OLD WERE YOU GUYS?


00:24:42.501 --> 00:24:43.300
JULIE: BABIES.


00:24:43.400 --> 00:24:44.867
MIKE: LIKE TEENAGERS,
LIKE 19.

00:24:44.967 --> 00:24:45.467
JULIE: YEAH.


00:24:45.567 --> 00:24:46.434
CHILDREN.


00:24:46.534 --> 00:24:47.301
JONATHAN: WOW.


00:24:47.401 --> 00:24:48.267
JULIE: 19, 20.


00:24:48.367 --> 00:24:49.200
MIKE: SO WE GOT MARRIED
AT 20 AND 21.

00:24:49.300 --> 00:24:50.134
JULIE: YEAH.


00:24:50.234 --> 00:24:52.234
SO WE WERE 19 WHEN
WE STARTED DATING.

00:24:52.334 --> 00:24:54.467
WE WERE ENGAGED
NINE MONTHS LATER.

00:24:54.567 --> 00:24:56.833
SO WE WE STARTED DATING
OFFICIALLY IN JANUARY.

00:24:56.933 --> 00:24:59.201
WE WERE ENGAGED
IN OCTOBER.

00:24:59.301 --> 00:25:04.767
AND THEN WE GOT MARRIED
LIKE A YEAR, JUST OVER A

00:25:04.867 --> 00:25:07.101
YEAR LATER THAN THAT.


00:25:07.201 --> 00:25:08.901
SO IT WAS LIKE SUPER FAST.


00:25:09.001 --> 00:25:11.267
REBECCA: SO THAT'S HARD TOO,
BECAUSE YOU WERE YOUNG.

00:25:11.367 --> 00:25:15.934
JULIE: OH YOUNG, DUMB
AND IN ARGUMENTATIVE.

00:25:16.034 --> 00:25:16.900
MIKE: THAT'S GONNA
BE OUR BOOK,

00:25:17.000 --> 00:25:17.467
YOUNG,


00:25:17.567 --> 00:25:20.267
DUMB, AND IN LOVE.


00:25:20.367 --> 00:25:21.334
REBECCA: AND SO WAS IT


00:25:21.434 --> 00:25:24.234
AROUND THE TIME OF YOU
HAVING YOUR FIRST CHILD

00:25:24.334 --> 00:25:26.001
WHEN THINGS BEGAN TO.


00:25:26.101 --> 00:25:27.800
BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, HAVING
KIDS WILL BRING UP ALL

00:25:27.900 --> 00:25:28.934
YOUR PAST.


00:25:29.034 --> 00:25:30.101
MIKE: OH, YEAH.


00:25:30.201 --> 00:25:31.334
JULIE: OH, FOR SURE.


00:25:31.434 --> 00:25:32.967
MIKE: YOU KNOW, OKAY, I'LL
TELL YOU A STORY ABOUT THAT.

00:25:33.067 --> 00:25:36.167
SO YEAH, BECAUSE YOU'RE
LIKE A TRIGGERING

00:25:36.267 --> 00:25:37.433
SOMETHING.


00:25:37.533 --> 00:25:39.534
REBECCA: IT IS BECAUSE IT'S LIKE
NOW YOU'RE IN THE POSITION

00:25:39.634 --> 00:25:40.833
WHERE YOU'RE THE PARENT,
YOU'RE LOOKING AT YOUR OWN

00:25:40.933 --> 00:25:42.133
CHILD.


00:25:42.233 --> 00:25:43.233
SO IT'S BRINGING
UP YOUR CHILDHOOD.

00:25:43.333 --> 00:25:44.334
MIKE: YEAH.


00:25:44.434 --> 00:25:45.900
WELL, WE GOT MARRIED
AND THEN YOU GOT PREGNANT.

00:25:46.000 --> 00:25:47.067
WHAT, THREE MONTHS IN?


00:25:47.167 --> 00:25:47.600
JULIE: YEAH.


00:25:47.700 --> 00:25:48.067
REBECCA: OH,


00:25:48.167 --> 00:25:48.667
THAT WAS...


00:25:48.767 --> 00:25:49.367
JULIE: HE LIKES


00:25:49.467 --> 00:25:49.867
TO BRAG ABOUT IT.


00:25:49.967 --> 00:25:50.667
[ LAUGHING ]


00:25:50.767 --> 00:25:52.034
REBECCA: WE WERE
SEVEN MONTHS IN.

00:25:52.134 --> 00:25:53.034
MIKE: OH, MAN.
FIST BUMP.

00:25:53.134 --> 00:25:55.900
[ LAUGHING ]
REBECCA: YEAH, IT WAS QUICK.

00:25:56.000 --> 00:25:57.867
AND THAT CHANGES
EVERYTHING.

00:25:57.967 --> 00:25:58.433
JULIE: I WAS LIKE BAWLING.


00:25:58.533 --> 00:25:59.733
I WAS LIKE, YEEES.


00:25:59.833 --> 00:26:00.700
[ LAUGHING ]


00:26:00.800 --> 00:26:03.267
MIKE: YEAH, IT WAS
SUCH A FUNNY THING.

00:26:03.367 --> 00:26:03.633
SO.


00:26:03.733 --> 00:26:04.767
YEAH.


00:26:04.867 --> 00:26:06.600
BUT THEN BELLA WAS BORN
AND I'M HOLDING HER IN MY

00:26:06.700 --> 00:26:08.834
ARMS, AND IT WAS LIKE THIS
WEIRD THING WHERE I WAS

00:26:08.934 --> 00:26:11.734
LIKE, I, I'M JUST MEETING
YOU FOR THE FIRST TIME,

00:26:11.834 --> 00:26:14.167
BUT I ALREADY LOVE YOU
WITH, LIKE, A RIGHT.

00:26:14.267 --> 00:26:15.801
AND YOU FELT THAT
FATHERLY LOVE.

00:26:15.901 --> 00:26:17.034
JONATHAN: IT'S SO WEIRD.
YEAH.

00:26:17.134 --> 00:26:17.767
MIKE: THAT YOU'RE LIKE, THIS
IS A DIFFERENT LOVE THAN I

00:26:17.867 --> 00:26:18.733
HAVE FOR MY WIFE.


00:26:18.833 --> 00:26:19.467
YEAH.


00:26:19.567 --> 00:26:20.467
YOU KNOW.


00:26:20.567 --> 00:26:21.267
JONATHAN: YOU CAN'T EXPLAIN IT.


00:26:21.367 --> 00:26:22.433
MIKE: YOU CAN'T.


00:26:22.533 --> 00:26:23.167
JONATHAN: NO. AND YOU CAN'T
ANTICIPATE IT EITHER.

00:26:23.267 --> 00:26:24.400
MIKE: RIGHT.


00:26:24.500 --> 00:26:26.900
JONATHAN: AND I REMEMBER WHEN WE
WERE GOING TO HAVE A KID,

00:26:27.000 --> 00:26:28.633
I WAS LIKE, I DON'T KNOW
IF I'M GONNA LOVE THE KID.

00:26:28.733 --> 00:26:30.567
I WAS WORRIED ABOUT THAT
BECAUSE I WAS JUST LIKE,

00:26:30.667 --> 00:26:31.834
I DON'T KNOW IF I'M IN
TOUCH ENOUGH WITH MY

00:26:31.934 --> 00:26:33.000
FEELINGS.


00:26:33.100 --> 00:26:34.701
REBECCA: BECAUSE MEN REALLY
DON'T CONNECT

00:26:34.801 --> 00:26:35.900
UNTIL THE BABY COMES OUT.


00:26:36.000 --> 00:26:37.134
MIKE: YEAH.


00:26:37.234 --> 00:26:37.500
JONATHAN: YOU KNOW, IT'S KIND OF
LIKE, OH, YEAH, THEY'RE

00:26:37.600 --> 00:26:38.367
THERE.


00:26:38.467 --> 00:26:40.934
JONATHAN: IT'S SO TRUE.


00:26:41.034 --> 00:26:42.433
REBECCA: HE'S THE BEST DAD.
HE'S THE BEST DAD.

00:26:42.533 --> 00:26:43.500
[ LAUGHING ]


00:26:43.600 --> 00:26:44.567
JONATHAN: AS SOON AS
I, I DIDN'T MEAN TO CUT

00:26:44.667 --> 00:26:45.800
OFF YOUR STORY BUT
RESONATE WITH LIKE AS SOON

00:26:45.900 --> 00:26:47.634
AS YOU HAD AS SOON
AS ASHER CAME OUT.

00:26:47.734 --> 00:26:48.834
ASHER WAS OUR FIRSTBORN.


00:26:48.934 --> 00:26:51.101
IT WAS JUST LIKE YOU JUST
IMMEDIATELY FEEL THE

00:26:51.201 --> 00:26:52.501
FATHER'S LOVE.


00:26:52.601 --> 00:26:55.000
YEAH, LIKE HIT
YOU FOR THE KID.

00:26:55.100 --> 00:26:56.334
IT'S LIKE SUPERNATURAL,
ACTUALLY.

00:26:56.434 --> 00:26:58.900
AND THEN IT JUST
GOES FROM THERE.

00:26:59.000 --> 00:26:59.767
MIKE: IT IS SUPER.


00:26:59.867 --> 00:27:00.233
I LOVE THAT NAME.


00:27:00.333 --> 00:27:01.067
ASHER.


00:27:01.167 --> 00:27:01.867
JONATHAN: THANK YOU.


00:27:01.967 --> 00:27:02.300
REBECCA: AW,


00:27:02.400 --> 00:27:02.900
THANK YOU.


00:27:03.000 --> 00:27:03.267
MIKE: SO.


00:27:03.367 --> 00:27:03.800
YEAH.


00:27:03.900 --> 00:27:04.534
SO YOU FELT THAT?


00:27:04.634 --> 00:27:05.201
JONATHAN: YEAH.


00:27:05.301 --> 00:27:05.834
MIKE: LIKE, YOU KNOW WHAT


00:27:05.934 --> 00:27:06.367
I'M, OKAY.


00:27:06.467 --> 00:27:07.367
BECAUSE IT WAS.


00:27:07.467 --> 00:27:08.500
YEAH.


00:27:08.600 --> 00:27:09.400
AND SHE'S LIKE KIND OF
LOOKING AT, YOU KNOW BELLA

00:27:09.500 --> 00:27:10.901
WAS LIKE TRYING
TO OPEN HER EYES.

00:27:11.001 --> 00:27:12.300
AND IT WAS JUST A MOMENT.


00:27:12.400 --> 00:27:14.167
SO THEN BUT THEN ALL
OF A SUDDEN I WENT BACK

00:27:14.267 --> 00:27:15.833
BECAUSE THIS WAS
BACK IN THE DAY.

00:27:15.933 --> 00:27:17.767
YOU COULDN'T STAY THE
NIGHT LIKE THE HUSBAND

00:27:17.867 --> 00:27:19.067
COULDN'T STAY THE NIGHT.


00:27:19.167 --> 00:27:19.801
SO.


00:27:19.901 --> 00:27:20.434
WHICH WAS WEIRD.


00:27:20.534 --> 00:27:21.234
JULIE: LIKE THE '50S.


00:27:21.334 --> 00:27:22.634
REBECCA: THAT IS WEIRD.


00:27:22.734 --> 00:27:23.267
JULIE: THAT'S HOW IT FEELS.


00:27:23.367 --> 00:27:24.334
REBECCA: THAT'S HORRIBLE.


00:27:24.434 --> 00:27:25.067
JULIE: THEY WERE LIKE,
HE NEEDS TO GO HOME.

00:27:25.167 --> 00:27:25.834
LIKE, EXCUSE ME?


00:27:25.934 --> 00:27:26.267
JONATHAN: YEAH.


00:27:26.367 --> 00:27:27.167
YOU'RE LIKE,


00:27:27.267 --> 00:27:28.133
BUT HE'S GONNA
HELP WITH THE BABY.

00:27:28.233 --> 00:27:29.233
MIKE: RIGHT?


00:27:29.333 --> 00:27:31.867
SO I GO BACK HOME AND
ALL OF A SUDDEN I'M IN.

00:27:31.967 --> 00:27:34.300
AND I HAD NEVER HAD A
PANIC ATTACK BEFORE, AND

00:27:34.400 --> 00:27:36.700
ALL OF A SUDDEN I'M,
LIKE, WASHING MY HANDS.

00:27:36.800 --> 00:27:38.201
AND ALL OF A SUDDEN
EVERYTHING FEELS LIKE

00:27:38.301 --> 00:27:39.234
TUNNEL VISION.


00:27:39.334 --> 00:27:40.367
AND THEN I START
BLACKING OUT.

00:27:40.467 --> 00:27:42.301
BEFORE YOU KNOW IT, LIKE
I'M ON THE FLOOR OF THE

00:27:42.401 --> 00:27:44.234
BATHROOM, I'M
BAWLING MY EYES OUT.

00:27:44.334 --> 00:27:45.467
REBECCA: OH MY GOSH.


00:27:45.567 --> 00:27:47.700
MIKE: WHAT I DIDN'T REALIZE WHAT
HAPPENED WAS THAT LOVE

00:27:47.800 --> 00:27:49.467
THAT I FELT FOR
MY DAUGHTER.

00:27:49.567 --> 00:27:51.400
THIS THOUGHT OCCURRED TO
ME WHILE I WAS WASHING MY

00:27:51.500 --> 00:27:52.234
HANDS.


00:27:52.334 --> 00:27:55.000
DID MY DAD NEVER
FEEL THAT FOR ME?

00:27:55.100 --> 00:27:55.834
LIKE.


00:27:55.934 --> 00:27:56.701
BECAUSE HOW COULD
HE ABANDON ME?

00:27:56.801 --> 00:27:57.600
HOW COULD HE LEAVE?


00:27:57.700 --> 00:27:58.433
HOW COULD.


00:27:58.533 --> 00:28:00.367
SO SOMETHING AND
IT JUST BROKE ME.

00:28:00.467 --> 00:28:03.401
THEN WHAT'S CRAZIER IS
NOT TOO LONG AFTER THAT I

00:28:03.501 --> 00:28:07.300
FOUND OUT MY DAD DIED, AND
THEN IT CLOSED THE DOOR OF

00:28:07.400 --> 00:28:09.134
ANY POSSIBILITY OF...


00:28:09.234 --> 00:28:10.267
REBECCA: A CONVERSATION.


00:28:10.367 --> 00:28:11.000
MIKE: I'M NEVER
GOING TO HEAR.

00:28:11.100 --> 00:28:11.634
I'M PROUD OF YOU.


00:28:11.734 --> 00:28:12.801
I'M NEVER GOING TO HEAR.


00:28:12.901 --> 00:28:15.334
YOU KNOW I LOVE YOU.


00:28:15.434 --> 00:28:16.967
AND IT JUST I
STARTED AND THEN MY.

00:28:17.067 --> 00:28:18.034
AND THEN AT THE TIME.


00:28:18.134 --> 00:28:20.700
SO WE'RE IN MINISTRY
ALREADY AND I'M PREACHING

00:28:20.800 --> 00:28:22.434
AND SHE'S, YOU KNOW, WE'RE
WE'RE JUST LIVING THAT

00:28:22.534 --> 00:28:24.267
MINISTRY LIFE TOGETHER.


00:28:24.367 --> 00:28:27.100
AND ALL OF A SUDDEN MY
PASTOR HAS AN INFIDELITY.

00:28:27.200 --> 00:28:28.900
AND THEN MY, ONE OF
MY OTHER MENTORS, HIS

00:28:29.000 --> 00:28:30.500
MARRIAGE FALLS APART
BECAUSE HIS WIFE HAD AN

00:28:30.600 --> 00:28:31.933
INFIDELITY.


00:28:32.033 --> 00:28:34.367
AND IT WAS LIKE MY WHOLE
WORLD COLLAPSED ALL AT

00:28:34.467 --> 00:28:35.600
ONCE.


00:28:35.700 --> 00:28:36.700
JONATHAN: AND AFTER YOU
HAD YOUR FIRST KID.

00:28:36.800 --> 00:28:37.367
MIKE: YES.


00:28:37.467 --> 00:28:38.400
REBECCA: ALL YOUR


00:28:38.500 --> 00:28:40.134
FATHER FIGURES LIKE
THAT FOUNDATION WENT.

00:28:40.234 --> 00:28:40.967
MIKE: THAT'S IT.


00:28:41.067 --> 00:28:42.100
YEAH, THAT WAS IT.


00:28:42.200 --> 00:28:43.434
AND I HADN'T DEALT WITH
ANY OF THE TRAUMA, ANY OF

00:28:43.534 --> 00:28:44.334
THE PAIN.


00:28:44.434 --> 00:28:46.900
SO IT JUST GOT
EXPOSED AND IT JUST.

00:28:47.000 --> 00:28:48.167
YEAH.


00:28:48.267 --> 00:28:49.100
REBECCA: THAT WAS LIKE
AN EXPLOSION.

00:28:49.200 --> 00:28:49.734
MIKE: YEAH.


00:28:49.834 --> 00:28:50.700
JULIE: IT WAS.


00:28:50.800 --> 00:28:52.067
YEAH, IT WAS AN
EXPLOSION OF, LIKE, EPIC

00:28:52.167 --> 00:28:53.901
PROPORTIONS.


00:28:54.001 --> 00:28:56.467
IT WAS JUST I
YEAH, I DON'T

00:28:56.567 --> 00:28:57.633
KNOW WHAT HAPPENED.


00:28:57.733 --> 00:28:58.167
REBECCA: IT'S LIKE THE RUG
GETTING LIKE PULLED OUT

00:28:58.267 --> 00:28:58.633
FROM UNDER YOU.


00:28:58.733 --> 00:28:59.734
MIKE: YEAH.


00:28:59.834 --> 00:29:01.667
WELL, I STARTED LOOKING
FOR ANSWERS IN SCRIPTURE

00:29:01.767 --> 00:29:04.067
BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, I'M A
PREACHER AND I'M A WHAT DOES

00:29:04.167 --> 00:29:05.600
THE BIBLE HAVE
TO SAY ABOUT.

00:29:05.700 --> 00:29:08.567
AND I WAS FIGHTING FOR
MY LIFE TO FIND ANSWERS.

00:29:08.667 --> 00:29:11.800
AND IT WAS CRAZY BECAUSE I
WENT TO A BIBLE STUDY AT A

00:29:11.900 --> 00:29:13.601
GUY'S HOUSE
THAT I TRUSTED.

00:29:13.701 --> 00:29:14.767
HE WAS A BIG TIME
THEOLOGIAN, VERY WELL

00:29:14.834 --> 00:29:18.033
KNOWN IN THE AREA, AND I
LOOKED UP TO HIM AND HE

00:29:18.133 --> 00:29:19.967
WAS THE ONE WHO WAS LIKE,
HEY MAN, LET'S JUST HAVE A

00:29:20.067 --> 00:29:21.901
FEW DRINKS, LET'S RELAX.


00:29:22.001 --> 00:29:25.167
AND SO IT DIDN'T COME TO
ME IN THE FORM OF LIKE,

00:29:25.267 --> 00:29:27.067
LET'S GO TO THE CLUB,
LET'S GO TO THE BAR,

00:29:27.167 --> 00:29:28.167
LET'S.


00:29:28.267 --> 00:29:30.034
IT LITERALLY WAS, HEY,
WE HAD OUR BIBLES OPEN.

00:29:30.134 --> 00:29:32.267
AND HE WAS LIKE, LET'S
JUST HAVE A COUPLE DRINKS.

00:29:32.367 --> 00:29:35.433
AND THERE WAS SOMETHING
ABOUT THAT MOMENT, I THINK

00:29:35.533 --> 00:29:38.634
THAT IT THRUST ME INTO
FULL BLOWN ALCOHOLISM

00:29:38.734 --> 00:29:39.367
BECAUSE.


00:29:39.467 --> 00:29:40.233
JONATHAN: WOW.


00:29:40.333 --> 00:29:41.367
MIKE: YEAH.


00:29:41.467 --> 00:29:43.067
AND I'VE ALWAYS BEEN A
REALLY, LIKE, INTELLECTUAL

00:29:43.167 --> 00:29:44.101
TYPE CEREBRAL.


00:29:44.201 --> 00:29:46.767
MY MIND GOES, I'M
ENTREPRENEURIAL.

00:29:46.867 --> 00:29:47.767
I'VE ALWAYS HAD
MULTIPLE BUSINESSES.

00:29:47.867 --> 00:29:49.734
SO I'M A THINKER.


00:29:49.834 --> 00:29:52.534
SO IT WAS LIKE WHEN I WAS
DRINKING WITH HIM THAT

00:29:52.634 --> 00:29:54.934
FIRST TIME, I WAS LIKE,
THIS FEELS LIKE A MENTAL

00:29:55.034 --> 00:29:56.901
VACATION.


00:29:57.001 --> 00:29:57.933
REBECCA: IT CAN NUMB YOU.


00:29:58.033 --> 00:29:59.067
MIKE: YES, IT'S
NUMB IN MY BRAIN.

00:29:59.167 --> 00:30:03.401
AND IT WAS A REALLY BAD
SOLUTION FOR A REALLY VERY

00:30:03.501 --> 00:30:04.267
REAL PROBLEM.


00:30:04.367 --> 00:30:05.367
JONATHAN: RIGHT.


00:30:05.467 --> 00:30:06.533
REBECCA: THERE'S LIKE
TWO DIFFERENT.

00:30:06.633 --> 00:30:08.201
SO I'M TRYING TO FIGURE
OUT I THINK MY FIRST THING

00:30:08.301 --> 00:30:10.567
IS, WHAT WOULD YOUR ADVICE
BE FROM YOUR JUST YOUR OWN

00:30:10.667 --> 00:30:11.567
EXPERIENCE?


00:30:11.667 --> 00:30:12.600
WE'LL GET BACK TO THE
STORY, BUT IT IS A

00:30:12.700 --> 00:30:14.001
QUESTION THAT I'VE
ACTUALLY WANTED TO TALK TO

00:30:14.101 --> 00:30:15.367
SOMEONE ABOUT.


00:30:15.467 --> 00:30:17.300
WHAT WOULD YOUR ADVICE
BE TO CHRISTIANS WHO DO

00:30:17.400 --> 00:30:18.400
DRINK?


00:30:18.500 --> 00:30:20.434
BECAUSE THE BIBLE SAYS
DON'T LEAD YOUR BROTHER TO

00:30:20.534 --> 00:30:21.367
STUMBLE?


00:30:21.467 --> 00:30:22.233
MIKE: YEAH.


00:30:22.333 --> 00:30:23.567
REBECCA: SO HOW DO
YOU HANDLE THAT?

00:30:23.667 --> 00:30:24.901
BECAUSE HE LITERALLY
OPENED THE DOOR TO

00:30:25.001 --> 00:30:26.567
SOMETHING CRAZY IN YOUR
LIFE AND THAT COULD HAVE

00:30:26.667 --> 00:30:27.701
BEEN PREVENTED.


00:30:27.801 --> 00:30:28.967
MIKE: YEAH, EXACTLY.


00:30:29.067 --> 00:30:31.100
REBECCA: SO IT'S LIKE, HOW ARE
WE HOW DO HOW DOES SOMEONE

00:30:31.200 --> 00:30:32.167
BE A GOOD WITNESS?


00:30:32.267 --> 00:30:33.733
BECAUSE I KNOW THERE ARE
CHRISTIANS WHO DO DRINK.

00:30:33.833 --> 00:30:35.001
MIKE: RIGHT.


00:30:35.101 --> 00:30:36.334
REBECCA: AND THAT'S LIKE ONE OF
THE BIGGEST PROBLEMS IS

00:30:36.434 --> 00:30:38.000
THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO
CAN'T DRINK AT ALL.

00:30:38.100 --> 00:30:38.667
IT'S LIKE


00:30:38.767 --> 00:30:39.734
HORRIBLE FOR THEM.


00:30:39.834 --> 00:30:41.100
SO WHAT WOULD YOUR
ANSWER BE TO THAT?

00:30:41.200 --> 00:30:43.501
MIKE: IT'S LIKE I HAD A
GENETIC PREDISPOSITION

00:30:43.601 --> 00:30:44.933
THAT THAT GUY DIDN'T KNOW.


00:30:45.033 --> 00:30:46.034
REBECCA: AND A LOT OF PEOPLE DO.


00:30:46.134 --> 00:30:47.233
MIKE: EXACTLY.


00:30:47.333 --> 00:30:51.067
IT'S HONESTLY LIKE YOU
HAVE A LOADED GUN AND

00:30:51.167 --> 00:30:53.234
THAT FIRST DRINK IS
PULLING THE TRIGGER.

00:30:53.334 --> 00:30:56.567
AND SO WHY WOULD YOU WHY
WOULD YOU COLLABORATE WITH

00:30:56.667 --> 00:30:57.067
THAT.


00:30:57.167 --> 00:30:58.667
RIGHT.


00:30:58.767 --> 00:30:59.833
AND PEOPLE WILL SAY, WELL,
WE'RE NOT EVEN IN PUBLIC.

00:30:59.933 --> 00:31:00.967
WE'RE.


00:31:01.067 --> 00:31:01.967
SO THAT'S THE THING
IS, I WASN'T IN PUBLIC.

00:31:02.067 --> 00:31:03.434
WE WERE IN PRIVATE.


00:31:03.534 --> 00:31:05.200
BUT HE DIDN'T KNOW ME.


00:31:05.300 --> 00:31:07.800
HE DIDN'T KNOW MY
PREDISPOSITION.

00:31:07.900 --> 00:31:10.500
AND OF COURSE, IT WASN'T
HIS FAULT IN THE SENSE

00:31:10.600 --> 00:31:14.433
THAT I ULTIMATELY MADE
THE CHOICE AS AN ADULT.

00:31:14.533 --> 00:31:16.034
MIKE: BUT HE SENT
ME ON A PATH.

00:31:16.134 --> 00:31:18.200
HE PUSHED ME IN THAT
DIRECTION AND EVEN.

00:31:18.300 --> 00:31:20.301
AND I THINK THE THING
THAT'S CRAZIER IS THAT HE

00:31:20.401 --> 00:31:22.167
DID THIS AS A
CHRISTIAN MAN.

00:31:22.267 --> 00:31:23.233
RIGHT.


00:31:23.333 --> 00:31:25.334
AND SO I THINK THE
OFFERING IT AND SO I DON'T

00:31:25.434 --> 00:31:26.600
WANT TO BE RESPONSIBLE.


00:31:26.700 --> 00:31:28.500
THAT'S HOW I LOOK AT
ALL THESE YEARS LATER.

00:31:28.600 --> 00:31:30.034
I DON'T THERE'S
TWO THINGS.

00:31:30.134 --> 00:31:32.633
ONE IS I DON'T WANT
SOMEBODY TO SEE ME DO

00:31:32.733 --> 00:31:36.100
SOMETHING AND THINK THAT
THEY CAN DO IT RIGHT.

00:31:36.200 --> 00:31:38.067
SO I DON'T WANT TO USE
MY INFLUENCE LIKE THAT.

00:31:38.167 --> 00:31:42.967
AND THEN NUMBER TWO IS YOU
NEVER KNOW WHO WHAT THEIR

00:31:43.067 --> 00:31:44.600
PREDISPOSITION IS.


00:31:44.700 --> 00:31:47.167
SO I THINK ULTIMATE WISDOM
IS JUST TO NEVER DO IT.

00:31:47.267 --> 00:31:48.101
REBECCA: OKAY.


00:31:48.201 --> 00:31:49.834
MIKE: AND THAT'S
WHERE I LAND.

00:31:49.934 --> 00:31:50.900
AND HERE'S WHAT'S CRAZY.


00:31:51.000 --> 00:31:52.667
I'VE BEEN IN MINISTRY
CIRCLES WITH VERY HIGH

00:31:52.767 --> 00:31:55.100
LEVEL PEOPLE, VERY FAMOUS
PEOPLE, VERY INFLUENTIAL

00:31:55.200 --> 00:31:58.633
PEOPLE, AND I THINK
THEY'VE PERCEIVED ME AS

00:31:58.733 --> 00:31:59.767
WELL.


00:31:59.867 --> 00:32:01.901
YOU'RE JUST LEGALISTIC,
YOU'RE JUST OLD SCHOOL.

00:32:02.001 --> 00:32:04.234
BUT THEN THOSE SAME
PEOPLE, YEARS LATER,

00:32:04.334 --> 00:32:06.500
ALCOHOL DESTROYED THEIR
ENTIRE MARRIAGE, THEIR

00:32:06.600 --> 00:32:07.733
MINISTRY AND EVERYTHING.


00:32:07.833 --> 00:32:09.634
AND ACTUALLY WITHIN THE
LAST COUPLE YEARS, I'VE

00:32:09.734 --> 00:32:12.334
RECEIVED QUITE A FEW
APOLOGIES FOR PEOPLE WHO

00:32:12.434 --> 00:32:13.267
ARE LIKE, YOU
KNOW WHAT, MIKE?

00:32:13.367 --> 00:32:14.667
I DIDN'T GET IT.


00:32:14.767 --> 00:32:18.567
I JUSTIFIED IT, AND THEN
BUT I SAW THE TRAJECTORY.

00:32:18.667 --> 00:32:21.867
IT JUST I DIDN'T SEE IT AT
THE TIME AND NOW I GET IT.

00:32:21.967 --> 00:32:23.467
REBECCA: BUT THE THING IS,
AND THAT'S WHY I.

00:32:23.567 --> 00:32:25.300
I'M SO GLAD I'M WANTING
TO TALK ABOUT THIS ON THE

00:32:25.400 --> 00:32:27.867
PODCAST FOR SO LONG,
BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE I

00:32:27.967 --> 00:32:29.667
WANT TO HAVE THAT
CONVERSATION, BECAUSE FOR

00:32:29.767 --> 00:32:32.034
SOME PEOPLE IT IS
LEGALISTIC, BUT IT'S NOT

00:32:32.134 --> 00:32:33.201
THE CASE FOR EVERYONE.


00:32:33.301 --> 00:32:34.734
SOME PEOPLE IT'S A
PERSONAL CONVICTION AND

00:32:34.834 --> 00:32:36.734
THEN SOME PEOPLE LITERALLY
THEY THEY SHOULD NEVER

00:32:36.834 --> 00:32:39.401
DRINK ALCOHOL BECAUSE THEY
WILL BECOME EXTREMELY

00:32:39.501 --> 00:32:41.267
ADDICTED TO IT.


00:32:41.367 --> 00:32:42.267
AND I THINK THE CHURCH
DOESN'T LOOK AT IT IN THIS

00:32:42.367 --> 00:32:42.900
LENS.


00:32:43.000 --> 00:32:43.534
IT'S LIKE, IS IT OKAY?


00:32:43.634 --> 00:32:44.400
IS IT NOT OKAY?


00:32:44.500 --> 00:32:45.567
YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?


00:32:45.667 --> 00:32:48.200
AND I'M JUST LIKE, AND
EVEN IF PEOPLE THINK IT'S

00:32:48.300 --> 00:32:50.167
OKAY AND THEY DON'T FEEL
CONVICTION, IT CAN GET

00:32:50.267 --> 00:32:53.600
VERY OUT OF HAND AND IT
CAN RUIN YOUR HEALTH.

00:32:53.700 --> 00:32:54.601
IT CAN RUIN YOUR LIFE.


00:32:54.701 --> 00:32:55.801
IT CAN RUIN YOUR MARRIAGE.


00:32:55.901 --> 00:32:57.434
AND SO I THINK PEOPLE
NEED TO HAVE THESE

00:32:57.534 --> 00:32:59.234
CONVERSATIONS, BECAUSE
I JUST THINK THE CHURCH

00:32:59.334 --> 00:33:00.634
MAKES IT A IS IT OKAY?


00:33:00.734 --> 00:33:01.800
IS IT NOT OKAY?


00:33:01.900 --> 00:33:03.600
AND THEY'RE NOT TALKING
ABOUT PEOPLE WHO HAVE LIKE

00:33:03.700 --> 00:33:07.267
A TENDENCY TOWARDS
ALCOHOLISM OR HOW EVEN YOU

00:33:07.367 --> 00:33:09.600
CAN IF YOU START
MEDICATING WITH IT, EVEN

00:33:09.700 --> 00:33:11.434
IF YOU'RE NOT ALCOHOLIC
AND IT BECOMES A PROBLEM,

00:33:11.534 --> 00:33:12.233
YOU KNOW WHAT


00:33:12.333 --> 00:33:13.300
I MEAN?


00:33:13.400 --> 00:33:14.201
SO I THINK THOSE KIND OF
CONVERSATIONS NEED TO

00:33:14.301 --> 00:33:15.834
HAPPEN BECAUSE IT'S
MULTI-LAYERED.

00:33:15.934 --> 00:33:18.034
MIKE: YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.


00:33:18.134 --> 00:33:19.867
AND THE OTHER THING
TOO IS I THINK THAT PEOPLE

00:33:19.967 --> 00:33:21.867
ARE NOT BEING HONEST
WITH THEMSELVES.

00:33:21.967 --> 00:33:23.533
SO THEY'LL SAY, WELL, I
DON'T DRINK AND GET DRUNK,

00:33:23.633 --> 00:33:24.833
BUT THEY DO.


00:33:24.933 --> 00:33:27.034
AND THEY'RE NOT BEING
HONEST ABOUT IT.

00:33:27.134 --> 00:33:29.467
AND WHAT HOW I KNEW
THAT IS WHEN I MADE THE

00:33:29.567 --> 00:33:31.367
DECISION TO STOP DRINKING
ALTOGETHER AND I GOT

00:33:31.467 --> 00:33:34.901
SOBER, A LOT OF MY FRIENDS
CAME TO ME AND THESE WERE

00:33:35.001 --> 00:33:37.267
VERY LIKE BIG TIME
THEOLOGIAN TYPES.

00:33:37.367 --> 00:33:39.867
AND THEY'RE LIKE, HEY, I
KNOW THAT I NEED TO STOP

00:33:39.967 --> 00:33:41.033
TOO.


00:33:41.133 --> 00:33:43.634
AND I'VE BEEN I'VE BEEN
SELF-DECEIVED BECAUSE I AM

00:33:43.734 --> 00:33:46.400
GETTING DRUNK AND I
AM DEPENDENT ON IT.

00:33:46.500 --> 00:33:48.334
AND I AND, YOU KNOW,
AND I HAD A LOT OF

00:33:48.434 --> 00:33:50.601
CONVERSATIONS, LIKE BEHIND
CLOSED DOORS THAT WERE

00:33:50.701 --> 00:33:53.567
LIKE, OH, THIS IS MOST
PEOPLE THERE'S SOME LEVEL

00:33:53.667 --> 00:33:55.334
OF STRUGGLE THAT
THEY'RE NOT ADMITTING.

00:33:55.434 --> 00:33:57.067
ALL: YEAH.


00:33:57.167 --> 00:33:58.167
JULIE: EVEN THAT, LIKE WHEN
YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT

00:33:58.267 --> 00:33:59.834
LIKE BEING HONEST WITH
YOURSELF BECAUSE PEOPLE

00:33:59.934 --> 00:34:02.267
ALWAYS WANT TO SAY LIKE
MODERATION, RIGHT.

00:34:02.367 --> 00:34:06.267
AND BUT MY THING IS,
IS LIKE, OKAY, WELL

00:34:06.367 --> 00:34:10.001
MODERATION IS SUBJECTIVE
BECAUSE HOW DO YOU GAUGE

00:34:10.101 --> 00:34:12.134
WHAT'S MODERATE?


00:34:12.234 --> 00:34:14.900
BECAUSE WHAT'S MODERATE TO
YOU MAY NOT BE MODERATE TO

00:34:15.000 --> 00:34:16.600
ME OR VICE VERSA.


00:34:16.700 --> 00:34:19.933
AND WE WERE SITTING DOWN
WITH WE WERE HAVING DINNER

00:34:20.033 --> 00:34:22.700
WITH, WITH A PASTOR AND
THEY WERE JUST KNOCKING

00:34:22.800 --> 00:34:23.367
THEM BACK.


00:34:23.467 --> 00:34:24.801
I WAS ACTUALLY SHOCKED.


00:34:24.901 --> 00:34:26.133
I DON'T KNOW IF I'M GONNA
GET IN TROUBLE BY TALKING

00:34:26.233 --> 00:34:28.134
ABOUT THIS, BUT
I'M GOING TO TALK

00:34:28.234 --> 00:34:29.034
ABOUT IT BECAUSE...


00:34:29.134 --> 00:34:29.600
JONATHAN: JUST DON'T
SAY ANY NAMES.

00:34:29.700 --> 00:34:30.133
JULIE: I WILL NOT.


00:34:30.233 --> 00:34:31.234
I WILL NOT.


00:34:31.334 --> 00:34:35.233
I WOULD NEVER, BUT IT WAS
SO INTERESTING BECAUSE

00:34:35.333 --> 00:34:37.300
THEY KEPT TALKING ABOUT,
YOU KNOW, I DO THIS IN

00:34:37.400 --> 00:34:39.567
MODERATION AND
I'M LIKE COUNTING.

00:34:39.667 --> 00:34:42.300
AND I'M LIKE, THERE'S
NO WAY, THERE'S NO

00:34:42.400 --> 00:34:44.333
WAY THAT YOU


00:34:44.433 --> 00:34:45.967
ARE MODERATELY...


00:34:46.067 --> 00:34:47.000
[ LAUGHING ]
JULIE: YEAH, YEAH.

00:34:47.100 --> 00:34:48.400
JOANTHAN: YOU'RE ABOUT
11 DRINKS IN.

00:34:48.500 --> 00:34:49.101
JULIE: I'M LIKE, YOU'RE


00:34:49.201 --> 00:34:50.167
TWO DRINKS PAST


00:34:50.267 --> 00:34:51.767
MODERATION IN
MY LIKE IN MY

00:34:51.867 --> 00:34:53.933
SUBJECTIVE OPINION.


00:34:54.033 --> 00:34:54.733
YEAH.


00:34:54.833 --> 00:34:55.967
SO IT'S LIKE SO
INTERESTING.

00:34:56.067 --> 00:34:57.600
AND THEN LIKE I THINK THE
OTHER THING YOU HAVE TO

00:34:57.700 --> 00:35:00.467
ASK YOURSELF IS SOME
PEOPLE HAVE ADDICTIVE

00:35:00.567 --> 00:35:02.234
PERSONALITIES.


00:35:02.334 --> 00:35:05.300
AND IT'S, AND IT'S LIKE
THEY, THEY REALLY BELIEVE

00:35:05.400 --> 00:35:07.300
THAT THEY CAN DO SOME
THINGS IN MODERATION.

00:35:07.400 --> 00:35:10.033
BUT THE REALITY IS, IS HIS
BRAIN THE WAY THAT IT'S

00:35:10.133 --> 00:35:14.200
WIRED, LIKE HE'LL EXERCISE
TOO MUCH OR HE WOULD HAVE

00:35:14.300 --> 00:35:16.267
DRANK TOO MUCH, LIKE.


00:35:16.367 --> 00:35:17.500
REBECCA: THAT'S A THING.


00:35:17.600 --> 00:35:18.633
JULIE: YOU CAN'T SEPARATE --


00:35:18.733 --> 00:35:19.167
REBECCA: I KNOW
PEOPLE LIKE THIS.

00:35:19.267 --> 00:35:20.100
YES.


00:35:20.200 --> 00:35:21.334
[ LAUGHING ]
REBECCA: YEAH.

00:35:21.434 --> 00:35:22.534
JULIE: SO I ALWAYS SAY, ASK
YOURSELF, YOU KNOW, LIKE I

00:35:22.634 --> 00:35:25.900
HAVE TWO KIDS, ONE THAT IS
OBSESSIVE ABOUT THINGS AND

00:35:26.000 --> 00:35:27.367
THE OTHER ONE THAT
COULD CARE LESS.

00:35:27.467 --> 00:35:30.200
AND I'M LIKE TRYING TO
GIVE THEM WISDOM NOW AS

00:35:30.300 --> 00:35:32.267
THEY'RE YOUNG AND BEING
LIKE, THERE'S CERTAIN

00:35:32.367 --> 00:35:34.367
THINGS THAT YOU'RE GOING
TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT

00:35:34.467 --> 00:35:37.100
YOU'RE NOT GOING TO BE
ABLE TO DO, BECAUSE THEIR

00:35:37.200 --> 00:35:39.534
BRAINS ARE JUST
WIRED SO DIFFERENTLY.

00:35:39.634 --> 00:35:43.234
I DIDN'T HAVE THAT ISSUE,
BUT BECAUSE OF WHAT I

00:35:43.334 --> 00:35:45.734
WATCHED HIM GO THROUGH,
I'M SO MUCH IN AGREEMENT.

00:35:45.834 --> 00:35:46.800
I'M LIKE, YOU KNOW WHAT?


00:35:46.900 --> 00:35:48.500
THIS JUST DOESN'T HAVE
A PLACE IN OUR FAMILY.

00:35:48.600 --> 00:35:50.534
YEAH, IT'S JUST NOT A
HEALTHY THING TO HAVE IN

00:35:50.634 --> 00:35:52.301
OUR FAMILY, IN OUR HOME.


00:35:52.401 --> 00:35:53.734
AND SO, YEAH.


00:35:53.834 --> 00:35:56.200
JONATHAN: SO GOING BACK TO YOU
OPEN THE DOOR TO ALCOHOL

00:35:56.300 --> 00:35:58.267
THROUGH THIS FRIEND WHO'S
A THEOLOGIAN, AND YOU HAVE

00:35:58.367 --> 00:36:01.033
THIS NEWBORN BABY AT HOME.


00:36:01.133 --> 00:36:02.100
REBECCA: IT'S ANOTHER EXPLOSION.


00:36:02.200 --> 00:36:03.101
JONATHAN: WHAT HAPPENS?


00:36:03.201 --> 00:36:04.701
HOW DOES THIS,
WHAT TRANSPIRES?

00:36:04.801 --> 00:36:07.000
MIKE: I MEAN, I JUST
SPIRALED YEAH I SPIRALED.

00:36:07.100 --> 00:36:07.900
REBECCA: WAS IT REALLY QUICK?


00:36:08.000 --> 00:36:08.701
MIKE: YEAH.


00:36:08.801 --> 00:36:09.834
FOR ME IT WAS.


00:36:09.934 --> 00:36:13.967
IT REALLY WAS BECAUSE I
WAS ALREADY IN SUCH A BAD

00:36:14.067 --> 00:36:14.400
PLACE.


00:36:14.500 --> 00:36:15.267
YOU KNOW.


00:36:15.367 --> 00:36:16.501
JONATHAN: IT WAS A
TRIGGERING EVENT.

00:36:16.601 --> 00:36:17.367
MIKE: IT WAS.


00:36:17.467 --> 00:36:18.267
REBECCA: IT WAS TRIGGERING.


00:36:18.367 --> 00:36:19.167
IT BECAME YOUR
COPING MECHANISM.

00:36:19.267 --> 00:36:20.167
MIKE: IT DID.


00:36:20.267 --> 00:36:20.734
REBECCA: AND THEN
A FULL BLOWN ADDICTION.

00:36:20.834 --> 00:36:21.400
MIKE: YES.


00:36:21.500 --> 00:36:22.901
IT WAS LIKE ESCAPISM.


00:36:23.001 --> 00:36:24.667
YOU KNOW, I STARTED
PLAYING MUSIC ALL THE TIME

00:36:24.767 --> 00:36:26.201
AND DRINKING ALL THE TIME
AND HANGING OUT WITH

00:36:26.301 --> 00:36:28.367
FRIENDS, AND IT WAS
JUST I WAS ESCAPING.

00:36:28.467 --> 00:36:32.467
AND BECAUSE I DIDN'T WANT
TO FACE THE SITUATION AND

00:36:32.567 --> 00:36:35.067
THEN THINGS KEPT
GETTING SO MUCH WORSE.

00:36:35.167 --> 00:36:37.667
IT WAS LIKE PROGRESSIVE,
BUT IT WAS VERY LIKE

00:36:37.767 --> 00:36:41.401
ACCELERATED THAT ONE DAY I
CAME HOME AND IT WAS LIKE

00:36:41.501 --> 00:36:42.334
I WAS SO DRUNK.


00:36:42.434 --> 00:36:44.034
I THOUGHT, OH, THE
HOUSE IS SO CLEAN.

00:36:44.134 --> 00:36:45.167
SHE CLEANED THE HOUSE.


00:36:45.267 --> 00:36:47.101
THEN I WOKE UP THE NEXT
DAY AND I REALIZED IT WAS

00:36:47.201 --> 00:36:49.500
EMPTY BECAUSE
SHE MOVED OUT.

00:36:49.600 --> 00:36:50.133
JONATHAN: REALLY?


00:36:50.233 --> 00:36:51.267
MIKE: YEAH.


00:36:51.367 --> 00:36:52.667
REBECCA: SO DID YOU KNOW
WHAT WAS GOING ON?

00:36:52.767 --> 00:36:54.101
JULIE: AT THIS JUNCTURE,


00:36:54.201 --> 00:36:57.200
SO THE DRINKING ESCALATED
PROBABLY SHORTLY AFTER WE

00:36:57.300 --> 00:36:59.133
HAD OUR FIRST DAUGHTER.


00:36:59.233 --> 00:37:01.367
AND THEN WHAT HAPPENED
IS, IS THAT JUST KEPT

00:37:01.467 --> 00:37:05.900
ESCALATING, LIKE INTO
EPIC, LIKE IN EPIC

00:37:06.000 --> 00:37:07.034
PROPORTIONS.


00:37:07.134 --> 00:37:09.500
AND IT WOULD ESCALATE AND
THEN COME DOWN AND THEN

00:37:09.600 --> 00:37:10.633
ESCALATE AND COME DOWN.


00:37:10.733 --> 00:37:13.334
SO JUST WHEN I WOULD BE
LIKE VERY CONCERNED, IT

00:37:13.434 --> 00:37:16.000
WOULD GET BETTER BECAUSE
WHAT HE WAS A HIGH

00:37:16.100 --> 00:37:19.567
FUNCTIONING ALCOHOLIC,
THAT HE DEVOLVED INTO A

00:37:19.667 --> 00:37:20.767
LOW FUNCTION ALCOHOLIC.


00:37:20.867 --> 00:37:23.401
BUT AT THE TIME IT WAS
LIKE HE COULD KEEP HIS

00:37:23.501 --> 00:37:24.867
JOB, HE COULD KEEP.


00:37:24.967 --> 00:37:25.567
IT'S LIKE HIS


00:37:25.667 --> 00:37:27.067
LIFE WAS INTACT.


00:37:27.167 --> 00:37:27.634
JONATHAN: WAS IT EVERY DAY
AT THAT POINT?

00:37:27.734 --> 00:37:28.601
MIKE: OH YEAH.


00:37:28.701 --> 00:37:29.867
JULIE: AT THAT POINT,
IT WAS EVERY DAY.

00:37:29.967 --> 00:37:30.900
JONATHAN: AND YOU WERE DRINKING
UP LIKE IN THE MORNING?

00:37:31.000 --> 00:37:32.001
MIKE: YEAH.


00:37:32.101 --> 00:37:34.201
AND WHAT'S CRAZY IS LIKE,
YOU'LL MEET LIKE, VERY

00:37:34.301 --> 00:37:36.134
SUCCESSFUL ENTREPRENEURS.


00:37:36.234 --> 00:37:37.934
I MEAN, THE PEOPLE THAT I
WAS ASSOCIATING WITH WERE

00:37:38.034 --> 00:37:40.734
NOT LIKE WHAT SOCIETY
WOULD CONSIDER LOW LIVES.

00:37:40.834 --> 00:37:43.067
I MEAN, THEY WERE LIKE
VERY SUCCESSFUL PEOPLE,

00:37:43.167 --> 00:37:45.367
BUT IT WAS JUST IT WAS
LIKE, OH, THIS DRINK WE

00:37:45.467 --> 00:37:47.801
HAVE BECAUSE I'M NOT GOING
TO EVEN NAME IT BECAUSE I

00:37:47.901 --> 00:37:49.033
DON'T WANT TO
TRIGGER ANYBODY.

00:37:49.133 --> 00:37:50.633
BECAUSE FOR PEOPLE
STRUGGLING, YOU COULD EVEN

00:37:50.733 --> 00:37:51.800
SAY IT.


00:37:51.900 --> 00:37:53.967
BUT THERE'S DRINKS FOR THE
MORNING THAT ARE SOCIALLY

00:37:54.067 --> 00:37:55.100
ACCEPTABLE.


00:37:55.200 --> 00:37:58.434
THERE'S DRINKS FOR IF WHEN
YOU GET INTO THAT WORLD,

00:37:58.534 --> 00:38:02.534
IT'S SUCH A BIZARRE THING,
AND I THINK IT HAPPENS

00:38:02.634 --> 00:38:05.300
MUCH MORE FREQUENTLY THAN
PEOPLE PICK UP ON, YOU

00:38:05.400 --> 00:38:06.301
KNOW?


00:38:06.401 --> 00:38:07.734
AND SO, YEAH, I MEAN,
IT WAS WHEN WE SAY

00:38:07.834 --> 00:38:10.900
ALCOHOLISM, IT WAS
LIKE DEFINITIONAL.

00:38:11.000 --> 00:38:12.067
IT WAS.


00:38:12.167 --> 00:38:15.834
LIKE DIAGNOSABLE, WHICH
EVENTUALLY I DID SEEK HELP

00:38:15.934 --> 00:38:19.133
AND GOT THAT CONFIRMATION,
WHICH IT'S WEIRD BECAUSE

00:38:19.233 --> 00:38:21.600
YOU DON'T YOU'RE IT'S LIKE
THE ALCOHOLIC IS THE LAST

00:38:21.700 --> 00:38:24.600
PERSON TO LEARN THEY'RE AN
ALCOHOLIC, YOU KNOW, IT'S

00:38:24.700 --> 00:38:25.134
LIKE.


00:38:25.234 --> 00:38:25.700
REBECCA: OH, SO


00:38:25.800 --> 00:38:26.334
YOU WEREN'T AWARE?


00:38:26.434 --> 00:38:27.400
MIKE: NO.


00:38:27.500 --> 00:38:29.100
IT'S ALMOST LIKE, AGAIN,
BECAUSE OUR CULTURE, AND

00:38:29.200 --> 00:38:31.201
ESPECIALLY IN AMERICA.


00:38:31.301 --> 00:38:32.167
REBECCA: WE'RE REALLY OKAY


00:38:32.267 --> 00:38:32.967
WITH IT.


00:38:33.067 --> 00:38:33.600
MIKE: WE ABUSE ALCOHOL.


00:38:33.700 --> 00:38:34.867
IT'S LIKE WE JUSTIFY.


00:38:34.967 --> 00:38:36.767
IT'S LIKE WE NORMALIZE IT.


00:38:36.867 --> 00:38:39.867
SO YEAH, IT WAS WHEN I
STARTED, ACTUALLY, WHAT

00:38:39.967 --> 00:38:42.767
HAPPENED WAS I WAS GOING
TO COUNSELING AND THEY

00:38:42.867 --> 00:38:44.534
WERE LIKE, WE WANT YOU TO
TAKE THIS TEST AND SEE HOW

00:38:44.634 --> 00:38:46.000
YOU SCORE.


00:38:46.100 --> 00:38:48.267
AND IT WAS BASICALLY A
TEST TO DETERMINE IF I WAS

00:38:48.367 --> 00:38:49.433
ADDICTED TO ALCOHOL.


00:38:49.533 --> 00:38:51.167
AND I WAS LIKE, OFF
THE RICHTER SCALE.

00:38:51.267 --> 00:38:52.200
REBECCA: REALLY?


00:38:52.300 --> 00:38:53.300
MIKE: YEAH.


00:38:53.400 --> 00:38:54.267
AND IT WAS LIKE IT WAS
I REMEMBER THEM SHOWING

00:38:54.367 --> 00:38:57.001
LIKE, LOOK, THIS
IS WHAT YOU ARE.

00:38:57.101 --> 00:38:58.500
AND THINGS
STARTED CLICKING.

00:38:58.600 --> 00:39:00.467
YEAH.


00:39:00.567 --> 00:39:02.333
REBECCA: WHAT GOT YOU TO LEAVE?


00:39:02.433 --> 00:39:03.534
JULIE: WELL,


00:39:03.634 --> 00:39:08.133
IT GOT TO A POINT WHERE
HIS BEHAVIOR WAS LIKE OUT

00:39:08.233 --> 00:39:09.800
OF CONTROL, YOU
KNOW WHAT I MEAN?

00:39:09.900 --> 00:39:13.534
LIKE THE ALCOHOLISM,
HEIGHTENED ANGER.

00:39:13.634 --> 00:39:16.367
I MEAN, WE WE WE LAUGH
ABOUT IT NOW AND IT'S LIKE

00:39:16.467 --> 00:39:18.401
WHEN WE'RE LAUGHING, I
HOPE PEOPLE KNOW, LIKE

00:39:18.501 --> 00:39:20.300
WE'RE NOT BELITTLING
WHAT HAPPENED.

00:39:20.400 --> 00:39:22.967
IT'S JUST THAT, GOD, WHEN
I WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THIS,

00:39:23.067 --> 00:39:25.200
IT FEELS LIKE WE'RE
TALKING ABOUT TWO

00:39:25.300 --> 00:39:25.867
DIFFERENT PEOPLE.


00:39:25.967 --> 00:39:26.434
JONATHAN: I WAS JUST


00:39:26.534 --> 00:39:27.567
THINKING THAT, YEAH.


00:39:27.667 --> 00:39:28.500
JULIE: LIKE IT DOESN'T


00:39:28.600 --> 00:39:29.900
FEEL LIKE I'M
TALKING ABOUT MY LIFE.

00:39:30.000 --> 00:39:32.167
I FEEL LIKE I'M TALKING
ABOUT SOMEONE ELSE'S LIFE.

00:39:32.267 --> 00:39:34.334
BUT IT REALLY WAS MY LIFE.


00:39:34.434 --> 00:39:38.767
AND THE ANGER HAD
ESCALATED AND JUST

00:39:38.867 --> 00:39:40.167
DECISION MAKING.


00:39:40.267 --> 00:39:44.067
AND AT THIS POINT, YOU
KNOW, WITH THE ALCOHOLISM

00:39:44.167 --> 00:39:45.534
CAME INFIDELITY.


00:39:45.634 --> 00:39:48.767
AND SO NOW WE'RE
JUGGLING ANGER.

00:39:48.867 --> 00:39:53.134
WE'RE JUGGLING INFIDELITY,
ALCOHOLISM, AND NOW WE'RE

00:39:53.234 --> 00:39:54.667
UNEQUALLY YOKED.


00:39:54.767 --> 00:39:57.333
YOU KNOW, I'M HERE TRYING
TO, LIKE, FIGHT FOR THE

00:39:57.433 --> 00:39:59.567
LORD, YOU KNOW, AND
AND RIGHTEOUSNESS.

00:39:59.667 --> 00:40:02.067
AND THEN HE'S
BEING BELLIGERENT.

00:40:02.167 --> 00:40:05.067
AND IT'S LIKE I'M TRYING
TO RECONCILE THESE WORLDS.

00:40:05.167 --> 00:40:06.967
AND SO IT GOT TO A POINT
WHERE I THOUGHT, THERE'S

00:40:07.067 --> 00:40:08.233
TOO MUCH.


00:40:08.333 --> 00:40:10.600
I'M ENABLING THIS.


00:40:10.700 --> 00:40:13.567
LIKE I AM ENABLING
HIS BEHAVIOR.

00:40:13.667 --> 00:40:17.301
I'M SAYING BY ALLOWING
LIKE, LIFE TO CONTINUE AS

00:40:17.401 --> 00:40:20.367
NORMAL, NOTHING'S
CHANGING.

00:40:20.467 --> 00:40:21.667
WE TRIED COUNSELING.


00:40:21.767 --> 00:40:25.000
NOTHING CHANGED AT THAT,
YOU KNOW, VERY LIGHTLY.

00:40:25.100 --> 00:40:28.533
NOT NOT TO THE DEGREE
AFTER THE FACT, BUT I JUST

00:40:28.633 --> 00:40:31.100
DECIDED THAT
I'D HAD ENOUGH.

00:40:31.200 --> 00:40:33.433
AND I DID NOT
FEEL SAFE ANYMORE.

00:40:33.533 --> 00:40:36.633
AND I NEEDED TO LEAVE, AND
I NEEDED TO DO IT BECAUSE

00:40:36.733 --> 00:40:38.001
I LOVED HIM.


00:40:38.101 --> 00:40:41.400
AND I THINK HE INTERPRETED
IT AT THAT TIME.

00:40:41.500 --> 00:40:44.867
YOU KNOW, IT WAS THAT I AT
THE TIME, I DIDN'T LOVE

00:40:44.967 --> 00:40:46.367
HIM, BUT IT WAS LIKE,
NO.

00:40:46.467 --> 00:40:47.633
REBECCA: THAT'S ABANDONMENT.


00:40:47.733 --> 00:40:50.934
JULIE: I ACTUALLY LOVE YOU TOO
MUCH TO BE A PART OF THIS.

00:40:51.034 --> 00:40:53.934
AND LIKE, I REALLY THOUGHT
EITHER TWO THINGS WERE

00:40:54.034 --> 00:40:55.000
GOING TO HAPPEN.


00:40:55.100 --> 00:40:57.033
HE WAS GOING TO DRINK
HIMSELF TO DEATH, LIKE

00:40:57.133 --> 00:40:59.500
ALCOHOL POISONING
OR SOMETHING.

00:40:59.600 --> 00:41:02.600
YEAH, OR HE WAS GOING TO
DRINK TO THE POINT WHERE

00:41:02.700 --> 00:41:06.367
SOMETHING HE WOULD GOT HIT
BY A CAR OR HE WOULD GET,

00:41:06.467 --> 00:41:08.501
YOU KNOW, I HAD THESE,
LIKE, INTRUSIVE THOUGHTS

00:41:08.601 --> 00:41:11.467
LIKE, EITHER THE ALCOHOL
IS GOING TO KILL HIM OR

00:41:11.567 --> 00:41:14.300
SOMETHING RELATING TO THE
ALCOHOL IS GOING TO KILL

00:41:14.400 --> 00:41:15.334
HIM.


00:41:15.434 --> 00:41:16.667
AND I JUST DIDN'T WANT
TO BE A PART OF IT.

00:41:16.767 --> 00:41:18.667
I WAS LIKE, I
CAN'T WATCH THAT.

00:41:18.767 --> 00:41:21.934
SO I LEFT AND IT WAS ONE
OF THE HARDEST DECISIONS I

00:41:22.034 --> 00:41:25.367
MADE, BUT ONE OF THE BEST
DECISIONS THAT I MADE,

00:41:25.467 --> 00:41:28.933
BECAUSE WHAT I DID WAS I
SENT A MESSAGE AND I WAS

00:41:29.033 --> 00:41:32.234
LIKE, I AM NOT GOING
TO LIVE LIKE THIS.

00:41:32.334 --> 00:41:36.101
AND, YOU KNOW, YOUR
CRAZINESS DOESN'T HAVE TO

00:41:36.201 --> 00:41:37.367
BE MY CRAZINESS.


00:41:37.467 --> 00:41:40.767
AND I'M SAD AND I LOVE
YOU, BUT YOU'RE GOING TO

00:41:40.867 --> 00:41:42.800
HAVE TO FIGURE THIS OUT
WITHOUT ME, BECAUSE I

00:41:42.900 --> 00:41:45.834
TRIED TO FIGURE IT OUT
WITH HIM, BUT HE JUST

00:41:45.934 --> 00:41:47.267
WASN'T READY.


00:41:47.367 --> 00:41:48.634
AND SO I LEFT.


00:41:48.734 --> 00:41:51.367
AND THAT WAS A REALLY
SAD DAY FOR ME.

00:41:51.467 --> 00:41:55.433
IT WAS A REALLY SAD DAY
FOR HIM, BUT I REALLY

00:41:55.533 --> 00:41:58.400
BELIEVE THAT WAS THE START
TO OUR FREEDOM JOURNEY.

00:41:58.500 --> 00:42:00.667
I KNOW THAT'S NOT
EVERYBODY'S STORY, BUT FOR

00:42:00.767 --> 00:42:03.000
US THAT'S WHAT
NEEDED TO HAPPEN.

00:42:03.100 --> 00:42:03.933
JONATHAN: SO WHAT HAPPENED?


00:42:04.033 --> 00:42:05.601
YOU WOKE UP, THE
HOUSE IS CLEANED OUT.

00:42:05.701 --> 00:42:06.767
WHAT DID YOU DO?


00:42:06.867 --> 00:42:07.767
MIKE: I WAS JUST GOING TO
SAY, SOMETIMES THINGS HAVE

00:42:07.867 --> 00:42:09.334
TO GET WAY WORSE BEFORE


00:42:09.434 --> 00:42:11.200
THEY GET BETTER.


00:42:11.300 --> 00:42:13.267
AND IT'S LIKE, YOU THINK
YOU'VE BOTTOMED OUT, BUT

00:42:13.367 --> 00:42:14.534
YOU'RE LIKE, NO, NO, YOU
HAVEN'T HIT THE BOTTOM

00:42:14.634 --> 00:42:15.700
YET.


00:42:15.800 --> 00:42:18.767
SO INITIALLY I WAS SO MAD
BECAUSE I'M LIKE, I NEEDED

00:42:18.867 --> 00:42:22.134
YOU THE MOST AND YOU LEFT
ME, WHICH IS SO STUPID.

00:42:22.234 --> 00:42:24.434
YOU KNOW, THE TRUTH IS,
LIKE, I DIDN'T EVEN

00:42:24.534 --> 00:42:26.700
DESERVE TO BE
MARRIED ANYMORE.

00:42:26.800 --> 00:42:29.267
BUT BUT, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE
YOU'RE IN SUCH A, LIKE,

00:42:29.367 --> 00:42:32.333
BAD PLACE THAT YOU'RE JUST
LIKE, OKAY, EVERYBODY,

00:42:32.433 --> 00:42:33.534
FINE.


00:42:33.634 --> 00:42:35.233
YOU KNOW, AND AND SO FOR A
WHILE, IT ACTUALLY DID GET

00:42:35.333 --> 00:42:37.767
WORSE AFTER
THAT INITIALLY.

00:42:37.867 --> 00:42:41.967
BUT THEN WHAT HAPPENED WAS
I REMEMBER IT GOT SO DARK

00:42:42.067 --> 00:42:44.767
THAT FINALLY THAT STARTED
TO WAKE ME UP OF LIKE, OH,

00:42:44.867 --> 00:42:47.800
WOW, HOW DID I GO FROM
THIS GUY PREACHING AND

00:42:47.900 --> 00:42:50.667
MINISTERING AND ALL THIS
TO NOW I'M HERE, LIKE,

00:42:50.767 --> 00:42:52.867
BECAUSE EVEN THE STORIES
WOULD SPREAD ABOUT ME AND

00:42:52.967 --> 00:42:54.634
PEOPLE WOULD
BARELY BELIEVE IT.

00:42:54.734 --> 00:42:57.867
LIKE, YOU MEAN MIKE, LIKE
MIKE'S LIKE LIKE HE.

00:42:57.967 --> 00:43:01.100
NO, IT'S IT DIDN'T
COMPUTE, YOU KNOW, AND

00:43:01.200 --> 00:43:02.733
IT'S ALMOST LIKE IT GOT
DARK ENOUGH FOR ME TO

00:43:02.833 --> 00:43:05.700
FINALLY REALIZE HOW
BAD LIKE, THIS IS.

00:43:05.800 --> 00:43:07.000
THIS IS BAD.


00:43:07.100 --> 00:43:09.234
AND SO I HAD THIS, LIKE,
JOB MOMENT BECAUSE I HAD A

00:43:09.334 --> 00:43:11.500
LOT OF OFFENSE WITH GOD.


00:43:11.600 --> 00:43:14.167
IT'S LIKE, BECAUSE I'M,
I WAS REALLY BIG INTO

00:43:14.267 --> 00:43:16.734
SCIENCE AND I WRESTLED
WITH ATHEISM IN COLLEGE,

00:43:16.834 --> 00:43:18.534
SO I GOT ON THE
OTHER SIDE OF THAT.

00:43:18.634 --> 00:43:20.433
SO I WAS CONVINCED
GOD EXISTS.

00:43:20.533 --> 00:43:24.900
BUT THEN MY NEW PROBLEM
WAS, YOU'RE NOT JUST LIKE,

00:43:25.000 --> 00:43:26.434
THIS IS --


00:43:26.534 --> 00:43:27.133
REBECCA: YOU WERE LIKE JOB.


00:43:27.233 --> 00:43:27.767
MIKE: YEAH.


00:43:27.867 --> 00:43:28.467
LIKE, THIS IS UNFAIR.


00:43:28.567 --> 00:43:29.467
LIKE, LIKE I LIVE FOR YOU.


00:43:29.567 --> 00:43:30.600
I GAVE YOU EVERYTHING.


00:43:30.700 --> 00:43:33.467
I DID, ALL THE THINGS THAT
YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO DO.

00:43:33.567 --> 00:43:35.067
AND WHY WOULD THIS HAPPEN?


00:43:35.167 --> 00:43:36.033
LIKE WHY?


00:43:36.133 --> 00:43:37.434
YOU KNOW, WHY CAN'T
I HAVE A REAL DAD?

00:43:37.534 --> 00:43:38.067
WHY CAN'T.


00:43:38.167 --> 00:43:39.301
WHY IS MY PASTOR THIS?


00:43:39.401 --> 00:43:39.867
AND I MEAN IT.


00:43:39.967 --> 00:43:40.967
JUST.


00:43:41.067 --> 00:43:44.167
SO SOME OF THOSE PRAYERS
IN THAT TIME WERE SO RAW,

00:43:44.267 --> 00:43:45.834
BUT THEY WERE SO REAL.


00:43:45.934 --> 00:43:48.001
AND I THINK WHAT WAS
HAPPENING WAS RELIGION WAS

00:43:48.101 --> 00:43:49.400
BREAKING OFF OF ME.


00:43:49.500 --> 00:43:51.600
NOW THAT I LOOK BACK AT
IT, BECAUSE I WAS LIKE,

00:43:51.700 --> 00:43:54.867
THOSE PRAYERS WERE REAL
PRAYERS, YOU KNOW, IT WAS

00:43:54.967 --> 00:43:57.667
LIKE I WAS CRYING OUT AND
I DIDN'T REALIZE I WAS

00:43:57.767 --> 00:44:00.133
REALLY FORMING AN ACTUAL
RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD IN

00:44:00.233 --> 00:44:01.301
THAT SEASON.


00:44:01.401 --> 00:44:03.334
EVEN THOUGH I WAS YELLING
AT HIM, I WAS STILL

00:44:03.434 --> 00:44:04.433
TALKING TO HIM.


00:44:04.533 --> 00:44:05.600
REBECCA: YOU'RE BEING
HONEST WITH HIM.

00:44:05.700 --> 00:44:06.834
MIKE: YES.


00:44:06.934 --> 00:44:09.100
REBECCA: AND YOU LEAVING HIM WAS
LIKE THE LAST EMOTIONAL

00:44:09.200 --> 00:44:11.000
SAFETY PLACE WHERE IT
WAS JUST YOU AND GOD.

00:44:11.100 --> 00:44:12.200
MIKE: THAT WAS IT.


00:44:12.300 --> 00:44:13.434
REBECCA: BUT YOU HAD TO GET
TO THE END OF YOURSELF.

00:44:13.534 --> 00:44:14.433
YEAH, LIKE HIT ROCK


00:44:14.533 --> 00:44:15.134
ROCK.


00:44:15.234 --> 00:44:15.934
I DON'T KNOW WHY WE ALL,


00:44:16.034 --> 00:44:16.634
THAT'S WHAT WE
HAD TO DO TOO.

00:44:16.734 --> 00:44:17.734
WE HAD TO HIT ROCK BOTTOM.


00:44:17.834 --> 00:44:19.234
I DON'T KNOW WHY THAT
HAPPENS TO SO MANY OF US,

00:44:19.334 --> 00:44:21.001
BUT THAT'S WHERE WE
END UP MEETING GOD.

00:44:21.101 --> 00:44:22.567
AND THEN HE LIFTS US OUT.


00:44:22.667 --> 00:44:23.334
MIKE: YES.


00:44:23.434 --> 00:44:24.300
THAT'S IT.


00:44:24.400 --> 00:44:25.434
IT WAS JUST ME AND GOD.


00:44:25.534 --> 00:44:26.933
AND AND THEN WITH THAT JOB
STORY, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE

00:44:27.033 --> 00:44:29.867
MY DAD DIED PREMATURELY
AND HIS DAD DIED

00:44:29.967 --> 00:44:31.033
PREMATURELY.


00:44:31.133 --> 00:44:33.667
SO NOW I HAVE A KID AND
I'M LIKE, SO AM I GOING TO

00:44:33.767 --> 00:44:35.067
DIE PREMATURELY, TOO?


00:44:35.167 --> 00:44:37.033
AM I NOT GOING TO BE
THERE FOR MY DAUGHTER?

00:44:37.133 --> 00:44:40.267
LIKE, YOU KNOW, LIFE'S NOT
I MEAN, I'M FREAKING OUT.

00:44:40.367 --> 00:44:43.533
AND THEN FINALLY THAT JOB
MOMENT HITS AND I'M LIKE,

00:44:43.633 --> 00:44:45.300
YOU KNOW, BECAUSE JOB
FAMOUSLY SAYS, THOUGH HE

00:44:45.400 --> 00:44:47.701
SLAY ME, YET WILL
I PRAISE HIM.

00:44:47.801 --> 00:44:49.601
AND I JUST TOLD GOD.


00:44:49.701 --> 00:44:52.167
I SAID, YOU KNOW, I MIGHT
DIE LIKE MY DAD, BUT I

00:44:52.267 --> 00:44:54.967
REFUSE TO LIVE LIKE HIM
BECAUSE THE THING, TOO, IS

00:44:55.067 --> 00:44:56.967
LIKE, THE DEVIL WILL
LITERALLY GET YOU TO THE

00:44:57.067 --> 00:44:59.734
SAME DESTINATION THROUGH
A DIFFERENT ROUTE.

00:44:59.834 --> 00:45:02.301
BECAUSE I ALWAYS SAID,
I'LL NEVER BE LIKE MY DAD.

00:45:02.401 --> 00:45:06.034
AND LITERALLY HERE I AM
NOW IN MY EARLY 20S, AND

00:45:06.134 --> 00:45:09.400
I'M RECOGNIZING I JUST GOT
TO THE SAME DESTINATION OF

00:45:09.500 --> 00:45:12.100
MY DAD THROUGH A
WHOLE DIFFERENT PATH.

00:45:12.200 --> 00:45:13.334
JONATHAN: GENERATIONAL.


00:45:13.434 --> 00:45:15.734
MIKE: YEAH, IT WAS LIKE THIS,
THE GENERATIONAL CURSES,

00:45:15.834 --> 00:45:17.900
AND IT WAS LIKE I HAD
NEVER DEALT WITH IT.

00:45:18.000 --> 00:45:20.267
BUT THAT MOMENT OF
SURRENDER WHERE I TOLD GOD

00:45:20.367 --> 00:45:23.934
I MIGHT DIE LIKE MY DAD,
BUT I WILL NOT LIVE LIKE

00:45:24.034 --> 00:45:24.901
HIM.


00:45:25.001 --> 00:45:26.967
I WANT TO LIVE LIKE
YOU WANT ME TO LIVE.

00:45:27.067 --> 00:45:28.300
THAT WAS THE MOMENT
OF SURRENDER.

00:45:28.400 --> 00:45:30.800
SO I PICKED UP THE PHONE
THE NEXT DAY AND I CALLED

00:45:30.900 --> 00:45:32.833
JULIE AND I WAS
LIKE, I'M READY.

00:45:32.933 --> 00:45:33.934
I WANT TO CHANGE.


00:45:34.034 --> 00:45:36.567
I'LL DO WHATEVER IT TAKES
IF YOU'LL LET ME TRY.

00:45:36.667 --> 00:45:37.834
REBECCA: WHAT WERE
YOU THINKING?

00:45:37.934 --> 00:45:39.433
REBECCA: YOU WERE PROBABLY
DOUBTING IT AT FIRST.

00:45:39.533 --> 00:45:40.534
JULIE: WELL, THAT


00:45:40.634 --> 00:45:42.767
PARTICULAR DAY, A FEW
MONTHS PRIOR, A FRIEND OF

00:45:42.867 --> 00:45:45.634
MINE HAD GIVEN ME A CARD
FOR A DIVORCE LAWYER

00:45:45.734 --> 00:45:47.467
BECAUSE AT THIS JUNCTURE,
WE HAD BEEN SEPARATED FOR

00:45:47.567 --> 00:45:49.667
QUITE SOME TIME.


00:45:49.767 --> 00:45:50.300
REBECCA: THERE'S PROBABLY A LOT
OF PEOPLE TELLING YOU TO

00:45:50.400 --> 00:45:51.667
DIVORCE HIM.


00:45:51.767 --> 00:45:55.033
JULIE: OH, A 100%. THEY'RE LIKE
GIRL BYE LIKE, HE NEEDS TO GO.

00:45:55.133 --> 00:45:59.634
AND SO YEAH, HE HAD A LOT
OF ENEMIES AT THAT TIME.

00:45:59.734 --> 00:46:00.800
WE'VE HEALED.


00:46:00.900 --> 00:46:02.667
PRAISE GOD.


00:46:02.767 --> 00:46:05.034
AND SO SHE HAD GIVEN ME
THIS CARD AND I HAD IT IN

00:46:05.134 --> 00:46:05.767
MY WALLET.


00:46:05.867 --> 00:46:07.000
I DIDN'T CALL.


00:46:07.100 --> 00:46:09.700
AND THAT PARTICULAR DAY,
IT'S LIKE GOD'S TIMING IS

00:46:09.800 --> 00:46:14.067
SO INTENTIONAL, BECAUSE
THAT DAY I THINK I HAD

00:46:14.167 --> 00:46:16.567
JUST ACCEPTED,
LIKE, YOU KNOW WHAT?

00:46:16.667 --> 00:46:17.967
HE MIGHT NOT CHANGE.


00:46:18.067 --> 00:46:20.833
AND THIS CAN'T BE A
LIFE SENTENCE FOR ME.

00:46:20.933 --> 00:46:23.400
AND SO, YOU KNOW, LIKE, IF
HE'S NOT GOING TO CHANGE,

00:46:23.500 --> 00:46:25.834
IF HE'S NOT GOING TO BE
REPENTANT LIKE I HAVE

00:46:25.934 --> 00:46:27.134
BIBLICAL, RIGHT?


00:46:27.234 --> 00:46:28.834
LIKE I CAN MOVE
FORWARD WITH MY LIFE.

00:46:28.934 --> 00:46:31.700
IT WAS LIKE THAT DAY
I WAS GOING TO CALL.

00:46:31.800 --> 00:46:33.967
I PULLED OUT THAT THING
IN MY WALLET AND I MADE A

00:46:34.067 --> 00:46:35.667
MENTAL NOTE LIKE, OKAY,
AFTER WORK, I'M GOING TO

00:46:35.767 --> 00:46:37.401
LIKE CALL THIS
PLACE OR WHATEVER.

00:46:37.501 --> 00:46:39.734
AND THAT WAS THE
DAY HE CALLED ME.

00:46:39.834 --> 00:46:41.734
AND HE WAS LIKE, I
WANT TO WORK ON THINGS.

00:46:41.834 --> 00:46:43.834
SO IT'S LIKE, GOD, REALLY?


00:46:43.934 --> 00:46:45.434
IT WASN'T ON MY TIMETABLE.


00:46:45.534 --> 00:46:47.234
I MEAN, I WOULD HAVE
PREFERRED LIKE THE WEEK

00:46:47.334 --> 00:46:49.900
THAT I LEFT FOR HIM TO
SEND THAT MESSAGE LIKE THE

00:46:50.000 --> 00:46:51.000
NEXT DAY.


00:46:51.100 --> 00:46:52.067
RIGHT?


00:46:52.167 --> 00:46:55.134
BUT SOMETIMES IT'S LIKE
PEOPLE, THEY REALLY,

00:46:55.234 --> 00:46:57.534
ESPECIALLY ADDICTS,
UNFORTUNATELY, YOU WANT TO

00:46:57.634 --> 00:47:02.567
SAVE THEM SO BAD, BUT YOU
REALLY HAVE TO JUST ALLOW

00:47:02.667 --> 00:47:04.300
GOD TO WORK.


00:47:04.400 --> 00:47:08.367
AND REALLY TRUST GOD WITH
THE PROCESS AND BE LIKE,

00:47:08.467 --> 00:47:09.134
YOU KNOW WHAT, LORD?


00:47:09.234 --> 00:47:10.867
IT'S IN YOUR HANDS.


00:47:10.967 --> 00:47:12.267
I REALLY HAD TO DO THAT.


00:47:12.367 --> 00:47:14.200
LIKE SINCERELY, EVEN
TALKING ABOUT IT, I'M

00:47:14.300 --> 00:47:17.167
LIKE, I CAN'T BELIEVE I
SURVIVED THAT UNMEDICATED

00:47:17.267 --> 00:47:19.700
UN, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, I
LOOK BACK AND I'M LIKE,

00:47:19.800 --> 00:47:22.267
MAN, THAT THAT POOR GIRL
LIKE, THAT WAS WILD.

00:47:22.367 --> 00:47:24.167
BUT YOU KNOW WHAT?


00:47:24.267 --> 00:47:26.067
SOMETIMES YOU GO THROUGH
STUFF AND YOU'RE LIKE, I

00:47:26.167 --> 00:47:27.267
CAN'T TAKE IT
ONE MORE DAY.

00:47:27.367 --> 00:47:28.800
YEAH, YOU CAN, YOU CAN.


00:47:28.900 --> 00:47:30.167
YOU'RE TOUGHER THAN
YOU THINK YOU ARE.

00:47:30.267 --> 00:47:31.800
YOU'RE STRONGER THAN
YOU THINK YOU ARE.

00:47:31.900 --> 00:47:34.633
YOU GOT MORE IN YOU THAN
YOU THINK THAT YOU DO.

00:47:34.733 --> 00:47:36.933
AND GOD IS SO BIG.


00:47:37.033 --> 00:47:38.301
HE'S SO MERCIFUL.


00:47:38.401 --> 00:47:39.433
HE WILL SUPPLY YOU.


00:47:39.533 --> 00:47:42.801
THE BIBLE SAYS THAT IT'S
LIKE NEW MERCIES EVERY

00:47:42.901 --> 00:47:43.867
MORNING.


00:47:43.967 --> 00:47:45.567
I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THAT
SCRIPTURE UNTIL I WALKED

00:47:45.667 --> 00:47:46.901
THROUGH SOMETHING
LIKE THAT.

00:47:47.001 --> 00:47:48.867
YOU DON'T HAVE ENOUGH FOR
THE FULL WEIGHT OF THE

00:47:48.967 --> 00:47:49.933
SEASON.


00:47:50.033 --> 00:47:53.601
YOU GET ENOUGH MERCY FOR
THAT DAY, AND THEN THE

00:47:53.701 --> 00:47:57.267
NEXT DAY YOU GET A WHOLE
FRESH DOSE OF MERCY FOR

00:47:57.367 --> 00:47:58.867
THAT NEXT DAY.


00:47:58.967 --> 00:48:02.134
AND I THINK SOMETIMES YOU
WANT ALL THE MERCY AT ONE

00:48:02.234 --> 00:48:05.267
TIME FOR A WHOLE SEASON,
BUT YOU COULDN'T EVEN BEAR

00:48:05.367 --> 00:48:06.100
THE WEIGHT OF THAT.


00:48:06.200 --> 00:48:07.833
IT WOULD BREAK YOU DOWN.


00:48:07.933 --> 00:48:10.334
AND IT'S LIKE GOD GAVE US
JUST ENOUGH TO GET THROUGH

00:48:10.434 --> 00:48:14.367
THAT TIME THAT WE EXPIRED
ON THE SAME EXACT DAY.

00:48:14.467 --> 00:48:15.567
REBECCA: YEAH.


00:48:15.667 --> 00:48:16.167
WOW.


00:48:16.267 --> 00:48:17.300
JULIE: I'M SO GLAD.


00:48:17.400 --> 00:48:18.433
AND I'M SO THANKFUL FOR
WHAT THE LORD HAS DONE IN

00:48:18.533 --> 00:48:22.633
OUR FAMILY BECAUSE I, YOU
KNOW, YOU KNOW HOW PEOPLE

00:48:22.733 --> 00:48:25.200
ARE LIKE, OH, I WOULD
DO IT ALL OVER AGAIN.

00:48:25.300 --> 00:48:27.133
I USED TO THINK,
NO, I WOULDN'T.

00:48:27.233 --> 00:48:28.700
THAT WAS HORRIBLE.


00:48:28.800 --> 00:48:29.901
[ LAUGHING ]


00:48:30.001 --> 00:48:32.100
JULIE: BUT NOW BEING SO MANY
YEARS ON THE OTHER SIDE

00:48:32.200 --> 00:48:34.800
AND SEEING LIKE WHAT THE
LORD HAS DONE, I'M LIKE,

00:48:34.900 --> 00:48:37.934
MAN, TO GET TO WHERE WE
ARE TODAY TO DO THIS, YOU

00:48:38.034 --> 00:48:40.834
KNOW, I WOULD DO IT
AGAIN AND I LOVE YOU.

00:48:40.934 --> 00:48:42.933
AND I'M SO I'M
SO PROUD OF HIM, YOU KNOW.

00:48:43.033 --> 00:48:43.467
REBECCA: AW.


00:48:43.567 --> 00:48:44.300
JONATHAN: YEAH.


00:48:44.400 --> 00:48:45.201
BECAUSE I'M SURE
THAT WASN'T EASY.

00:48:45.301 --> 00:48:46.600
IF YOU WERE FULLY
ADDICTED, THEN YOU

00:48:46.700 --> 00:48:48.000
PROBABLY HAD TO DETOX.


00:48:48.100 --> 00:48:48.567
REBECCA: WHAT WAS THAT
PROCESS LIKE?

00:48:48.900 --> 00:48:49.367
JONATHAN: THAT COULD BE
DANGEROUS.

00:48:49.467 --> 00:48:50.633
MIKE: YEAH.


00:48:50.733 --> 00:48:51.801
JONATHAN: ON TOP OF DETOXING, IF
THAT'S WHAT YOU HAD TO DO.

00:48:51.901 --> 00:48:53.333
I'M NOT SURE.


00:48:53.433 --> 00:48:55.101
REBECCA: ISN'T IT, LIKE, THE
MOST DANGEROUS SUBSTANCE

00:48:55.201 --> 00:48:56.633
TO DETOX FROM
BECAUSE YOU CAN DIE?

00:48:56.733 --> 00:48:57.334
MIKE: YEAH.


00:48:57.434 --> 00:48:58.600
AMY WINEHOUSE, ACTUALLY,


00:48:58.700 --> 00:49:00.401
PEOPLE THINK THAT SHE
DRANK HERSELF TO DEATH

00:49:00.501 --> 00:49:02.401
AND, YOU KNOW, SHE'S
A FAMOUS SINGER.

00:49:02.501 --> 00:49:03.367
FAMOUS ARTIST.


00:49:03.467 --> 00:49:04.533
REBECCA: OH, YEAH,
WE KNOW HER.

00:49:04.633 --> 00:49:06.134
MIKE: SHE ACTUALLY DIED
DETOXING FROM ALCOHOL LIKE

00:49:06.234 --> 00:49:07.934
SHE WAS TRYING TO QUIT.


00:49:08.034 --> 00:49:09.267
JONATHAN: WOW.
I DIDN'T KNOW THAT.

00:49:09.367 --> 00:49:09.633
MIKE: AND SHE,


00:49:09.733 --> 00:49:10.001
YEAH.


00:49:10.101 --> 00:49:10.801
BECAUSE.


00:49:10.901 --> 00:49:11.934
SO YOU HAVE TO
BE VERY CAREFUL.

00:49:12.034 --> 00:49:14.234
SO I ENDED UP FINDING THIS
CHRISTIAN COUNSELOR, AND

00:49:14.334 --> 00:49:16.567
HE WAS AN OLD, OLDER
GENTLEMAN AT THE END OF

00:49:16.667 --> 00:49:17.834
HIS CAREER.


00:49:17.934 --> 00:49:19.901
AND THE VERY FIRST
SESSION, I THREW A MAJOR

00:49:20.001 --> 00:49:22.600
FIT BECAUSE HE WAS PUSHING
ON ALL THESE FATHER WOUNDS

00:49:22.700 --> 00:49:23.667
AND STUFF.


00:49:23.767 --> 00:49:25.734
AND I'M GETTING LIKE
IRRITATED AND AGITATED.

00:49:25.834 --> 00:49:26.667
OH, YEAH.


00:49:26.767 --> 00:49:27.734
REBECCA: IT HURTS.


00:49:27.834 --> 00:49:28.667
MIKE: IT HURTS SO BAD.


00:49:28.767 --> 00:49:30.200
REBECCA: YOU'RE LIKE,
LEAVE ME ALONE.

00:49:30.300 --> 00:49:31.601
MIKE: AND I DIDN'T KNOW
WHAT I SIGNED UP FOR.

00:49:31.701 --> 00:49:33.800
SO HE'S, YOU KNOW,
HE'S ASKING ALL THESE

00:49:33.900 --> 00:49:34.801
QUESTIONS.


00:49:34.901 --> 00:49:38.000
AND AGAIN, FOR ME,
IT WAS THE INJUSTICE.

00:49:38.100 --> 00:49:39.867
IT WAS SO UNFAIR LIFE.


00:49:39.967 --> 00:49:41.200
WHY WHY DID I HAVE
TO GO THROUGH THIS?

00:49:41.300 --> 00:49:43.667
SO HE'S PUSHING ON IT AND
THEN FINALLY I EXPLODE.

00:49:43.767 --> 00:49:46.067
AND I JUMPED UP IN THAT
MIDDLE OF THAT COUNSELING

00:49:46.167 --> 00:49:48.067
SESSION, JUST STARTED
YELLING AT THIS GUY.

00:49:48.167 --> 00:49:50.167
AND THEN FINALLY I SAID,
AND YOU KNOW WHAT?

00:49:50.267 --> 00:49:51.700
NO MAN HAS EVER
CARED FOR ME.

00:49:51.800 --> 00:49:53.767
MY PASTOR DIDN'T CARE
ENOUGH ABOUT ME TO NOT

00:49:53.867 --> 00:49:54.600
CHEAT.


00:49:54.700 --> 00:49:56.101
I JUST WENT DOWN
THE WHOLE LIST.

00:49:56.201 --> 00:49:57.234
MY DAD NEVER.


00:49:57.334 --> 00:49:59.267
AND I SAID, AND NOW I HAVE
TO PAY YOU MONEY TO CARE

00:49:59.367 --> 00:50:00.267
ABOUT ME.


00:50:00.367 --> 00:50:01.667
I HAVE TO GIVE YOU MONEY


00:50:01.767 --> 00:50:02.734
SO YOU CARE ABOUT ME.


00:50:02.834 --> 00:50:05.001
AND HE WAS LIKE,
ARE YOU DONE?

00:50:05.101 --> 00:50:06.134
LIKE HE WAS SO CALM.


00:50:06.234 --> 00:50:08.100
AND I WAS LIKE, YEAH, I
THINK I'M DONE, YOU KNOW?

00:50:08.200 --> 00:50:10.534
AND HE SAID, ALL RIGHT, IF
YOU THINK THAT I GOT INTO

00:50:10.634 --> 00:50:13.601
THIS PROFESSION FOR
MONEY, YOU DON'T KNOW ME.

00:50:13.701 --> 00:50:15.400
AND HE SAID, I'LL MEET
WITH YOU FOR FREE FOR THE

00:50:15.500 --> 00:50:18.233
REST OF YOUR LIFE
UNTIL YOU GET FREE.

00:50:18.333 --> 00:50:19.600
AND HE WAS LIKE, THE ONLY
THING I ASK IS, YOU HAVE

00:50:19.700 --> 00:50:21.567
TO DO WHAT I
TELL YOU TO DO.

00:50:21.667 --> 00:50:24.233
SO HE CHECKMATED
ME, REALLY.

00:50:24.333 --> 00:50:26.867
AND HE WAS, WHICH WAS SO
GRACIOUS BECAUSE, YOU

00:50:26.967 --> 00:50:29.400
KNOW, YOU A COUNSELOR
DESERVES TO GET PAID.

00:50:29.500 --> 00:50:30.334
THAT'S REAL WORK.


00:50:30.434 --> 00:50:31.500
REBECCA: YEAH.


00:50:31.600 --> 00:50:32.567
MIKE: YOU KNOW, BUT BUT THAT
WAS THE FIT THAT I WAS

00:50:32.667 --> 00:50:33.733
THROWING.


00:50:33.833 --> 00:50:35.867
AND THAT MAN SAW SOMETHING
IN ME, AND HE WAS LIKE,

00:50:35.967 --> 00:50:36.900
I'LL MEET IF THAT'S.


00:50:37.000 --> 00:50:40.834
IF THAT'S WHAT YOU
BELIEVE I CARE ABOUT YOU.

00:50:40.934 --> 00:50:43.100
BUT THEN HE SAID,
HERE'S YOUR ASSIGNMENT.

00:50:43.200 --> 00:50:46.234
ONCE A WEEK, EVERY WEEK
YOU NEED TO GO TO A

00:50:46.334 --> 00:50:48.800
DIFFERENT PLACE WHERE YOU
WERE ABUSED, AND YOU NEED

00:50:48.900 --> 00:50:52.167
TO STAND THERE PHYSICALLY
IN THIS REGION, AND YOU

00:50:52.267 --> 00:50:54.901
NEED TO SAY, GOD, WHERE
WERE YOU WHEN IT HAPPENED?

00:50:55.001 --> 00:50:56.300
REBECCA: OH MY GOSH.


00:50:56.400 --> 00:50:59.034
MIKE: AND I THINK HE SENSED
THAT JUST SITTING DOWN AND

00:50:59.134 --> 00:51:00.167
TALKING TO ME WASN'T
GOING TO WORK.

00:51:00.267 --> 00:51:02.334
SO HE WAS LIKE, THIS GUY
NEEDS LIKE AN EXPERIENCE,

00:51:02.434 --> 00:51:04.200
LIKE HE NEEDS
SOMETHING DIFFERENT.

00:51:04.300 --> 00:51:06.434
THE VERY FIRST PLACE I
WENT WAS MY CHILDHOOD

00:51:06.534 --> 00:51:09.667
HOME, AND I STOOD, WHICH
WAS CRAZY BECAUSE, LIKE, I

00:51:09.767 --> 00:51:11.901
STOOD ON THE FRONT YARD
THAT THE PEOPLE WHO LIVED

00:51:12.001 --> 00:51:13.134
THERE NEVER CAME OUTSIDE.


00:51:13.234 --> 00:51:14.900
IT HAD TO BE THE WEIRDEST.


00:51:15.000 --> 00:51:16.434
HOPEFULLY THEY WEREN'T HOME.


00:51:16.534 --> 00:51:16.967
REBECCA: WHAT IS THAT MAN
DOING OUT THERE?

00:51:17.067 --> 00:51:17.400
[ LAUGHING ]


00:51:17.500 --> 00:51:18.467
MIKE: YEAH.


00:51:18.567 --> 00:51:19.601
AND I LITERALLY WAS
LIKE, GOD, WHERE WERE YOU

00:51:19.701 --> 00:51:20.101
WHEN THIS HAPPENED?


00:51:20.201 --> 00:51:20.634
WHERE ARE YOU?


00:51:20.734 --> 00:51:21.233
WHERE ARE YOU?


00:51:21.333 --> 00:51:22.367
THAT?


00:51:22.467 --> 00:51:24.167
AND I START, YOU KNOW,
LIKE AND ALL OF A SUDDEN I

00:51:24.267 --> 00:51:25.933
FELT THE PRESENCE
OF THE HOLY SPIRIT.

00:51:26.033 --> 00:51:28.601
AND I KIND OF SAW IT LIKE
A MOVIE, BUT IT WAS LIKE I

00:51:28.701 --> 00:51:31.633
KEPT GETTING FLASHES OF
THE PAST AND THE PRESENT

00:51:31.733 --> 00:51:34.733
AND THE LORD, THIS IS WHAT
I FELT LIKE, HE SAID, I'M

00:51:34.833 --> 00:51:36.167
STILL THERE.


00:51:36.267 --> 00:51:36.801
LIKE I'M.


00:51:36.901 --> 00:51:38.667
I'M THE GOD OF TIME.


00:51:38.767 --> 00:51:40.333
LIKE I'M STILL IN THE
MOMENT WHEN YOU WERE A

00:51:40.433 --> 00:51:41.334
LITTLE KID.


00:51:41.434 --> 00:51:43.434
AND I CAN TOUCH AND
HEAL YOU RIGHT NOW.

00:51:43.534 --> 00:51:45.500
JUST GIVE ME PERMISSION.


00:51:45.600 --> 00:51:47.567
AND I NEVER THOUGHT ABOUT
ABOUT IT LIKE THAT BECAUSE

00:51:47.667 --> 00:51:50.634
WE THINK ABOUT GOD
IN PRESENT TIME.

00:51:50.734 --> 00:51:52.967
BUT IT'S LIKE HE CAN DO
WHATEVER HE WANTS TO DO.

00:51:53.067 --> 00:51:55.200
AND I FELT LIKE THERE
WAS SOME SUPERNATURAL

00:51:55.300 --> 00:51:56.567
EXPERIENCE OF HEALING.


00:51:56.667 --> 00:51:59.067
AND THEN EACH
WEEK I DID THAT.

00:51:59.167 --> 00:52:01.900
SO PROBABLY LIKE 7 OR 8
WEEKS IN, I START FEELING

00:52:02.000 --> 00:52:03.667
LIKE I DON'T WANT
TO DRINK ANYMORE.

00:52:03.767 --> 00:52:06.000
SO I COME INTO COUNSELING
AND I TOLD HIM I WAS LIKE,

00:52:06.100 --> 00:52:07.700
I FEEL LIKE I DON'T
WANT TO DRINK ANYMORE.

00:52:07.800 --> 00:52:09.500
AND HE WAS LIKE, HE STARTS
LAUGHING AND HE'S LIKE,

00:52:09.600 --> 00:52:11.433
YEAH, I THOUGHT THAT WOULD
HAPPEN THIS WEEK OR NEXT

00:52:11.533 --> 00:52:12.767
WEEK.


00:52:12.867 --> 00:52:17.300
AND HE HAD ME ON SOME SORT
OF LIKE PLAN AND IT WAS

00:52:17.400 --> 00:52:18.301
POWERFUL.


00:52:18.401 --> 00:52:20.567
AND SO THEN WE WENT
THROUGH A MEDICALLY

00:52:20.667 --> 00:52:23.967
SUPERVISED DETOX, WHICH
WAS REALLY IT WAS HARD.

00:52:24.067 --> 00:52:25.167
REBECCA: REALLY?


00:52:25.267 --> 00:52:28.267
MIKE: OH, I WAS EATING LIKE A
PINT OF ICE CREAM A DAY.

00:52:28.367 --> 00:52:29.701
MY BLOOD SUGAR WAS
CRASHING OUT AND IT WAS

00:52:29.801 --> 00:52:31.001
LIKE INTENSE,


00:52:31.101 --> 00:52:31.867
BECAUSE I WAS,


00:52:31.967 --> 00:52:33.834
YEAH, IT WAS
VERY INTENSE.

00:52:33.934 --> 00:52:34.967
REBECCA: HOW LONG DID
IT TAKE YOU?

00:52:35.067 --> 00:52:36.300
MIKE: IT WAS WEEKS AND WEEKS.


00:52:36.400 --> 00:52:36.901
I MEAN.


00:52:37.001 --> 00:52:38.234
IT WAS NOT, BECAUSE


00:52:38.334 --> 00:52:40.834
IT'S LIKE A PROGRESSIVE
THING YOU DO BECAUSE IT'S

00:52:40.934 --> 00:52:43.933
YOU CAN'T JUST IMMEDIATELY
BECAUSE YOUR BODY WILL

00:52:44.033 --> 00:52:44.633
RECOIL.


00:52:44.733 --> 00:52:45.467
IT WAS.


00:52:45.567 --> 00:52:46.700
AND WHAT'S SO --


00:52:46.800 --> 00:52:47.200
REBECCA: SHOWS HOW
AWFUL IT IS.

00:52:47.300 --> 00:52:47.900
MIKE: YES.


00:52:48.000 --> 00:52:49.067
HERE'S WHAT'S CRAZIER.


00:52:49.167 --> 00:52:51.233
YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU'RE AN
ALCOHOLIC, YOU CRAVE I

00:52:51.333 --> 00:52:52.734
MEAN, YOU HAVE
YOUR FAVORITES.

00:52:52.834 --> 00:52:53.734
YOU HAVE YOUR THING.


00:52:53.834 --> 00:52:54.701
WHATEVER.


00:52:54.801 --> 00:52:56.200
I BELIEVE THAT WHATEVER
HAPPENED TO ME

00:52:56.300 --> 00:52:59.600
BIOLOGICALLY ALSO HAPPENED
TO ME SPIRITUALLY BECAUSE

00:52:59.700 --> 00:53:03.000
I AM AT THIS POINT, LIKE
REPULSED BY THE SMELL OF

00:53:03.100 --> 00:53:03.933
IT.


00:53:04.033 --> 00:53:06.434
THE LOOK LIKE I CAN'T
EVEN LOOK AT IT.

00:53:06.534 --> 00:53:08.267
IT'S AND WHICH I BELIEVE
IS SUPERNATURAL.

00:53:08.367 --> 00:53:09.934
THAT DOESN'T
MAKE ANY SENSE.

00:53:10.034 --> 00:53:11.200
YOU KNOW.


00:53:11.300 --> 00:53:13.667
REBECCA: THAT IS AN AMAZING
STORY. THAT WAS SO POWERFUL

00:53:13.767 --> 00:53:15.433
ABOUT HIM HAVING YOU GO TO
THOSE SPOTS BECAUSE YOU

00:53:15.533 --> 00:53:17.000
WERE LIKE, GOD,
WHERE ARE YOU?

00:53:17.100 --> 00:53:18.667
AND THEN HE LITERALLY
HAD YOU GO EACH OF THESE

00:53:18.767 --> 00:53:21.000
DIFFERENT PLACES, AND HE
BASICALLY SHOWED YOU HE

00:53:21.100 --> 00:53:21.767
WAS THERE.


00:53:21.867 --> 00:53:22.967
MIKE: YEAH.


00:53:23.067 --> 00:53:24.433
REBECCA: DO YOU FEEL LIKE GOD
SHOWED YOU THAT HE WAS

00:53:24.533 --> 00:53:26.234
YOUR FATHER THROUGH
ALL OF THIS?

00:53:26.334 --> 00:53:27.600
LIKE, EVEN THOUGH IT'S
LIKE YOU MIGHT NOT HAVE

00:53:27.700 --> 00:53:29.267
HAD YOUR EARTHLY FATHER,
HE'S LIKE, I'VE ALWAYS

00:53:29.367 --> 00:53:30.200
BEEN YOUR FATHER.


00:53:30.300 --> 00:53:31.334
DID HE GIVE YOU
THAT DOWNLOAD?

00:53:31.434 --> 00:53:33.434
MIKE: HE'S STILL DOING IT.


00:53:33.534 --> 00:53:34.567
HE YOU KNOW, BECAUSE
FATHERLESSNESS IS

00:53:34.667 --> 00:53:36.934
SOMETHING THAT YOU
DEAL WITH FOREVER.

00:53:37.034 --> 00:53:39.500
I ALWAYS TELL PEOPLE IT'S
LIKE A WOUND THAT REOPENS

00:53:39.600 --> 00:53:42.800
IN EVERY SEASON BECAUSE,
LIKE, LIKE I SAID, WHEN MY

00:53:42.900 --> 00:53:46.034
DAUGHTER WAS
BORN, IT OPENED.

00:53:46.134 --> 00:53:48.900
YOU KNOW, AND IT
WAS LIKE, WELL THEN.

00:53:49.000 --> 00:53:50.134
BUT THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN
AT EACH STAGE, IT'S LIKE,

00:53:50.234 --> 00:53:51.201
WELL, YOU KNOW WHAT


00:53:51.301 --> 00:53:52.334
IF I HAD A DAD?


00:53:52.434 --> 00:53:54.000
AS A MATTER OF FACT, JUST
WEEKS AGO, I WAS THINKING

00:53:54.100 --> 00:53:56.701
ABOUT, YOU KNOW, MAN, I
WISH THAT MY CHILDREN HAD

00:53:56.801 --> 00:54:00.034
A GRANDFATHER, YOU KNOW,
MY, YOU KNOW, AND AND I

00:54:00.134 --> 00:54:01.001
WAS.


00:54:01.101 --> 00:54:02.934
BUT I WAS SURRENDERED
TO GOD IN PRAYER.

00:54:03.034 --> 00:54:04.034
AND I SAID, YOU
KNOW WHAT, GOD?

00:54:04.167 --> 00:54:05.934
BUT YOU'RE A GOOD FATHER,
AND I'M THANKFUL FOR YOU.

00:54:06.034 --> 00:54:08.534
AND I KID YOU NOT, I'M
FRIENDS WITH JOHN BEVERE.

00:54:08.634 --> 00:54:11.267
AND I WAS DOING AN
INTERVIEW WITH JOHN, AND

00:54:11.367 --> 00:54:13.167
WHEN IT WAS OVER, HE I
WENT TO GO END IT AND HE

00:54:13.267 --> 00:54:14.033
SAID, WAIT A SECOND.


00:54:14.133 --> 00:54:15.234
I JUST WANT TO DO
ONE LAST THING.

00:54:15.334 --> 00:54:16.867
I FEEL LIKE THE HOLY
SPIRIT WANTED ME TO TELL

00:54:16.967 --> 00:54:18.800
YOU THAT.


00:54:18.900 --> 00:54:21.033
THAT HE THAT GOD IS A
FATHER TO YOU, HE'S PROUD

00:54:21.133 --> 00:54:22.334
OF YOU.


00:54:22.434 --> 00:54:23.767
AND AND THEN HE GOES,
AND YOU KNOW WHAT?

00:54:23.867 --> 00:54:25.800
I JUST WANT TO SAY THIS
AS A DAD IN THE FAITH.

00:54:25.900 --> 00:54:26.967
I'M PROUD OF YOU, MIKE.


00:54:27.067 --> 00:54:28.200
AND IT JUST WRECKED ME.


00:54:28.300 --> 00:54:31.467
SO IT WAS LIKE, BECAUSE
GOD KNEW WHAT I NEEDED

00:54:31.567 --> 00:54:32.301
EVEN.


00:54:32.401 --> 00:54:33.567
AND THAT WAS LIKE
THREE WEEKS AGO.

00:54:33.667 --> 00:54:34.867
REBECCA: WOW.
THAT'S SO COOL.

00:54:34.967 --> 00:54:36.967
MIKE: SO IT'S LIKE, GOD, I
THINK THE THING IS, IF THE

00:54:37.067 --> 00:54:41.000
FATHER WOUND HAS POTENTIAL
TO OPEN IN EVERY SEASON,

00:54:41.100 --> 00:54:43.301
THEN THE HEAVENLY, OUR
HEAVENLY FATHER CAN HEAL

00:54:43.401 --> 00:54:44.834
IT IN EVERY SEASON.


00:54:44.934 --> 00:54:47.867
BUT BUT I THINK WHAT I GOT
BETTER AT IS GOING TO HIM.

00:54:47.967 --> 00:54:51.267
NOT ALCOHOL, GOING TO HIM
INSTEAD OF WHATEVER ELSE

00:54:51.367 --> 00:54:52.467
YOU KNOW.


00:54:52.567 --> 00:54:54.234
JONATHAN: AND ONE THING THAT YOU
MENTIONED EARLIER ON WAS

00:54:54.334 --> 00:54:57.567
THAT YOU'RE YOU HAVE BEEN
A FATHER TO OTHER GUYS,

00:54:57.667 --> 00:54:59.200
WHICH I THOUGHT THAT WHILE
I WAS HEARING YOUR STORY,

00:54:59.300 --> 00:55:01.867
I THOUGHT HOW AMAZING THAT
IS TO HAVE, YOU KNOW, YOU

00:55:01.967 --> 00:55:04.567
DIDN'T HAVE A DAD
FROM ONE YEARS OLD ON.

00:55:04.667 --> 00:55:06.733
BUT YET THE LOVE OF THE
FATHER IS SO DEEPLY

00:55:06.833 --> 00:55:08.734
INSTILLED IN YOU, AND
WHATEVER REVELATION GOD

00:55:08.834 --> 00:55:13.134
HAS GIVEN YOU, YOU'RE ABLE
TO SOW INTO OTHER PEOPLE

00:55:13.234 --> 00:55:15.400
IN A WAY THAT
A FATHER WOULD.

00:55:15.500 --> 00:55:17.367
DO YOU FEEL LIKE GOD
SUPERNATURALLY GAVE YOU

00:55:17.467 --> 00:55:19.567
THAT DESIRE TO
FATHER OTHERS?

00:55:19.667 --> 00:55:21.233
DO YOU FEEL LIKE IT JUST
HAPPENED ORGANICALLY?

00:55:21.333 --> 00:55:23.667
MIKE: WELL, WHAT'S SO WEIRD
IS LIKE, TECHNICALLY, I

00:55:23.767 --> 00:55:25.201
HATE SOCIAL MEDIA.


00:55:25.301 --> 00:55:26.367
I THINK IT'S TOXIC.


00:55:26.467 --> 00:55:28.267
I THINK IT'S, YOU
KNOW, WHATEVER.

00:55:28.367 --> 00:55:29.434
JONATHAN: IT IS.


00:55:29.534 --> 00:55:30.433
REBECCA: YEAH, IT IS, LIKE
WE FEEL THE SAME.

00:55:30.533 --> 00:55:31.367
MIKE: YEAH.


00:55:31.467 --> 00:55:32.401
SO FOR YEARS, I
NEVER REALLY DID IT.

00:55:32.501 --> 00:55:33.867
I WAS LIKE, NO, I'M
A REAL PREACHER.

00:55:33.967 --> 00:55:34.900
I DON'T NEED SOCIAL MEDIA.


00:55:35.000 --> 00:55:36.867
I'M NOT ONE OF THOSE
CHRISTIAN INFLUENCERS.

00:55:36.967 --> 00:55:37.767
I'M NOT CRINGEY.


00:55:38.433 --> 00:55:40.800
AND WHEN THE PANDEMIC HIT,
MY WIFE WAS LIKE, MIKE,

00:55:40.900 --> 00:55:44.800
JUST DO WHAT YOU DO IN
REAL LIFE IN IN ONLINE.

00:55:44.900 --> 00:55:46.967
SO ANYWAYS, THE ONLINE
MINISTRY EXPLODED, LIKE WE

00:55:47.067 --> 00:55:47.834
MENTIONED.


00:55:47.934 --> 00:55:49.034
BUT HERE'S WHAT'S WEIRD.


00:55:49.134 --> 00:55:53.000
I COME FROM A SICILIAN
FAMILY, SO I CALLED MY DAD

00:55:53.100 --> 00:55:54.434
WHEN HE WAS STILL ALIVE.


00:55:54.534 --> 00:55:56.967
WHAT LITTLE INTERACTIONS
WE HAD WHEN WE WERE A KID.

00:55:57.067 --> 00:55:58.601
I CALLED HIM PAPA.


00:55:58.701 --> 00:56:00.834
SO THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN ON
THE INTERNET ONE DAY I WAS

00:56:00.934 --> 00:56:03.234
TEACHING ABOUT THE FATHER
WOUNDS AND THE FATHER'S

00:56:03.334 --> 00:56:04.634
HEART AND ALL THAT.


00:56:04.734 --> 00:56:07.267
AND SOMEBODY IN THE
COMMENT SECTION SAID,

00:56:07.367 --> 00:56:09.734
WE'RE GOING TO START
CALLING YOU PAPA SIGS.

00:56:09.834 --> 00:56:11.867
AND BECAUSE MY LAST
NAME, SIGNORELLI.

00:56:11.967 --> 00:56:12.767
JONATHAN: THAT'S A
DOPE NICKNAME.

00:56:12.867 --> 00:56:13.734
MIKE: YEAH, PAPA SIGS.


00:56:13.834 --> 00:56:15.100
REBECCA: I LOVE PAPA SIGS.


00:56:15.200 --> 00:56:16.033
MIKE: AND THEN ALL


00:56:16.133 --> 00:56:17.067
THE COMMENTS AND
BECAUSE IT WAS A LIVE

00:56:17.167 --> 00:56:18.734
STREAM, THEY ALL STARTED
SAYING, YEAH, THAT'S IT,

00:56:18.834 --> 00:56:20.400
PAPA SIGS, PAPA SIGS.


00:56:20.500 --> 00:56:21.933
AND IT WAS SO FUNNY
BECAUSE IT WAS LIKE THEY

00:56:22.033 --> 00:56:24.267
STARTED CALLING ME AND
THAT BECAME A JOKE OF

00:56:24.367 --> 00:56:26.867
LIKE, YOU'RE PAPA
SIGS, YOU'RE PAPA SIGS.

00:56:26.967 --> 00:56:29.367
AND IT WAS LIKE HOW THE
LORD FLIPPED THAT ON ME.

00:56:29.467 --> 00:56:30.267
TO WHERE LIKE --


00:56:30.367 --> 00:56:30.900
JONATHAN: THAT'S SUCH
A GOD THING.

00:56:31.000 --> 00:56:31.700
MIKE: OH, IT'S SUCH A


00:56:31.800 --> 00:56:32.467
GOD THING.


00:56:32.567 --> 00:56:33.567
SO YEAH.


00:56:33.667 --> 00:56:35.767
SO I'LL GO TO PLACES ALL
OVER THE WORLD LONDON,

00:56:35.867 --> 00:56:37.467
THESE DIFFERENT COUNTRIES,
DIFFERENT CITIES, AND I'LL

00:56:37.567 --> 00:56:39.900
BE SIGNING BOOKS AND
THERE'LL BE LIKE GROWN

00:56:40.000 --> 00:56:42.133
WOMEN CRYING, SAYING LIKE,
I NEVER HAD A DAD, BUT

00:56:42.233 --> 00:56:44.500
WHEN I WATCH YOU ONLINE,
I JUST FEEL LIKE YOU'RE A

00:56:44.600 --> 00:56:46.534
FATHER AND I JUST FEEL
THE LOVE OF THE HEAVENLY

00:56:46.634 --> 00:56:47.534
FATHER THROUGH.


00:56:47.634 --> 00:56:48.534
I KNOW THAT YOU'RE NOT.


00:56:48.634 --> 00:56:50.067
YOU KNOW, IT'S
ALL ABOUT GOD.

00:56:50.167 --> 00:56:51.434
BUT LIKE GOD'S USED


00:56:51.534 --> 00:56:53.600
YOU AS AN EXTENSION
OF HIS HEART.

00:56:53.600 --> 00:56:56.267
AND IT'S IT'S JUST
A WEIRD THING.

00:56:56.367 --> 00:56:57.933
REBECCA: SORRY, I'M LIKE,


00:56:58.033 --> 00:56:59.267
AMEN, AMEN.


00:56:59.367 --> 00:56:59.734
YES, BROTHER.


00:56:59.834 --> 00:57:00.734
YES, BROTHER.


00:57:00.834 --> 00:57:03.267
[ LAUGHING ]
I'M JUST REALLY INTO IT.

00:57:03.367 --> 00:57:04.834
BUT FROM, LIKE, A
RECORDING STANDPOINT, IT'S

00:57:04.934 --> 00:57:06.234
GONNA LOOK DUMB.


00:57:06.334 --> 00:57:07.167
BUT IT'S OKAY.


00:57:07.267 --> 00:57:08.234
MIKE: NO, YOU GO THERE.


00:57:08.334 --> 00:57:10.567
REBECCA: I WILL HAVE TO
SAY THE OTHER THING.

00:57:10.667 --> 00:57:12.034
WHEN YOU SAID
THAT IN EVERY.

00:57:12.134 --> 00:57:13.067
I'VE NEVER HEARD
ANYONE SAY THAT.

00:57:13.167 --> 00:57:14.467
I FEEL LIKE THERE'S SUCH
WISDOM IN THAT WORD.

00:57:14.567 --> 00:57:15.933
AND EVERY SEASON, THE
FATHER WOUND CAN BE

00:57:16.033 --> 00:57:17.100
OPENED.


00:57:17.200 --> 00:57:18.834
BUT IN EVERY OPPORTUNITY,
IT'S A WAY FOR YOU TO MEET

00:57:18.934 --> 00:57:20.567
WITH THE FATHER
IN A NEW WAY.

00:57:20.667 --> 00:57:24.367
AND YOU SAID, I LEARNED
TO TURN TO GOD AND NOT TO

00:57:24.467 --> 00:57:25.333
ALCOHOL.


00:57:25.433 --> 00:57:27.334
AND IT'S LIKE EVERYONE
HAS THAT THING.

00:57:27.434 --> 00:57:28.867
IT'S JUST DIFFERENT
FOR EVERYONE.

00:57:28.967 --> 00:57:30.334
AND SO THAT'S A
WORD FOR EVERYONE.

00:57:30.434 --> 00:57:32.367
LIKE LEARN NOT TO TURN TO
THAT THING, BUT TO THE

00:57:32.467 --> 00:57:33.734
FATHER


00:57:33.834 --> 00:57:35.167
IN THOSE SITUATIONS.


00:57:35.267 --> 00:57:37.433
AND IT WILL BECOME LESS
AND LESS EVEN, LIKE HAVE A

00:57:37.533 --> 00:57:38.600
HOLD ON YOU.


00:57:38.700 --> 00:57:39.700
MIKE: WELL,


00:57:39.800 --> 00:57:41.334
IT'S LIKE I'M GETTING
WEEPY BECAUSE MY WIFE HAD

00:57:41.434 --> 00:57:43.733
THE BEST DAD AND HE
WAS A HERO OF MINE.

00:57:43.833 --> 00:57:46.934
HIS NAME WAS RANDY, AND IN
THE LATTER YEARS OF HIS

00:57:47.034 --> 00:57:49.000
LIFE HE WAS A PILLAR
OF OUR CHURCH.

00:57:49.100 --> 00:57:52.100
ME AND HIM, ACTUALLY,
AFTER I RECONCILED WITH MY

00:57:52.200 --> 00:57:53.200
WIFE.


00:57:53.300 --> 00:57:54.333
IF YOU THINK ABOUT IF ANY
MAN ON THE PLANET WAS

00:57:54.433 --> 00:57:57.333
GOING TO HATE MY GUTS, IT
WAS GOING TO BE HER DAD.

00:57:57.433 --> 00:57:58.800
AND HE DID.


00:57:58.900 --> 00:57:59.867
BUT THEN.


00:57:59.967 --> 00:58:02.533
BUT THEN WHEN HE SAW THE
CHANGES IN MY LIFE, HE

00:58:02.633 --> 00:58:03.567
KNEW IT WAS REAL.


00:58:03.667 --> 00:58:05.233
AND HE EMBRACED ME.


00:58:05.333 --> 00:58:07.301
AND WE REBUILT OUR
RELATIONSHIP AND WE ENDED

00:58:07.401 --> 00:58:09.667
UP BECOMING LIKE
BEST FRIENDS.

00:58:09.767 --> 00:58:11.634
WHICH WAS
SUCH A GOD THING.

00:58:11.734 --> 00:58:14.001
AND THEN HE UNEXPECTEDLY
PASSED AWAY.

00:58:14.101 --> 00:58:18.267
AND IT WAS SO WEIRD
BECAUSE I WATCHED MY WIFE

00:58:18.367 --> 00:58:21.834
GO THROUGH THE ORPHAN AND
ALL THAT STUFF, AND IT WAS

00:58:21.934 --> 00:58:25.500
LIKE THIS WEIRD HOW IN
GOD'S LIKE I CALL IT FATE.

00:58:25.600 --> 00:58:26.601
I DON'T KNOW
THE RIGHT WORD.

00:58:26.701 --> 00:58:30.267
FORGIVE ME, BUT IT WAS
LIKE SHE SUFFERED SO MUCH

00:58:30.367 --> 00:58:32.233
BECAUSE OF MY
FATHERLESSNESS.

00:58:32.333 --> 00:58:34.934
BUT THEN WHEN SHE BECAME
FATHERLESS AND I NEVER

00:58:35.034 --> 00:58:38.367
THOUGHT ABOUT HER BEING
FATHERLESS, I SAW HER.

00:58:38.467 --> 00:58:41.767
THE ANGER, THE THESE
PEOPLE IN MINISTRY DON'T.

00:58:41.867 --> 00:58:43.633
THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND
BECAUSE THEY HAVE A DAD.

00:58:43.733 --> 00:58:47.767
AND I SEEN HER ACTING, HOW
I ACTED, AND I SEEN THE

00:58:47.867 --> 00:58:50.134
TOXICITY IN HER
BUILDING UP.

00:58:50.234 --> 00:58:53.067
AND IT WAS THIS WEIRD
TWIST OF FATE WHERE I WAS

00:58:53.167 --> 00:58:55.467
LIKE, I GRABBED HER HAND
AND I WAS LIKE, LET ME

00:58:55.567 --> 00:58:58.233
SHOW YOU HOW YOU CAN GET
HEALED FROM THE FATHER

00:58:58.333 --> 00:58:59.067
WOUND.


00:58:59.167 --> 00:59:01.667
AND I WAS ABLE
TO WALK MY WIFE.

00:59:01.767 --> 00:59:04.800
SO IT WAS LIKE SHE REAPED
IN THE SAME AREA THAT SHE

00:59:04.900 --> 00:59:05.934
SOWED.


00:59:06.034 --> 00:59:06.967
SO IT WAS LIKE.


00:59:07.067 --> 00:59:09.901
SHE AND IT WAS LIKE
THIS BEAUTIFUL THING.

00:59:10.001 --> 00:59:13.501
JULIE: AND, MAN, I'LL TELL YOU
WHAT IT DID A HEALING.

00:59:13.601 --> 00:59:15.200
YOU KNOW, WHEN I LOST MY
DAD AND WALKING THROUGH

00:59:15.300 --> 00:59:17.900
THE GRIEF OF THAT WHICH I
KNOW, YOU KNOW, YOU GUYS

00:59:18.000 --> 00:59:19.367
UNDERSTAND.


00:59:19.467 --> 00:59:23.300
BUT YOU KNOW, AND AND MY
STORY IS DIFFERENT THAN

00:59:23.400 --> 00:59:26.600
HIS, YOU KNOW, MY DAD WAS
GREAT AND AWESOME, AND I'M

00:59:26.700 --> 00:59:28.400
SO THANKFUL FOR THAT.


00:59:28.500 --> 00:59:31.200
BUT GOING THROUGH OUR
MARRIAGE STUFF, I ALWAYS

00:59:31.300 --> 00:59:35.033
HAD SO MUCH RESENTMENT,
YOU KNOW, JUST FOR THE

00:59:35.133 --> 00:59:37.400
THINGS THAT WOULD RISE UP
IN DIFFERENT TIMES, EVEN

00:59:37.500 --> 00:59:41.433
BEING RECONCILED BECAUSE
IT'S LIKE, YOU KNOW, YOU

00:59:41.533 --> 00:59:42.534
DON'T HAVE A
DAD WHO CARES.

00:59:42.634 --> 00:59:44.367
50% OF AMERICA
DOESN'T HAVE A DAD.

00:59:44.467 --> 00:59:45.967
YOU KNOW, THAT'S HOW
YOU FEEL LIKE YOUR

00:59:46.067 --> 00:59:47.733
SELFISHNESS.


00:59:47.833 --> 00:59:51.867
AND THEN WHEN YOU LOSE
YOUR OWN, THE EMPATHY OF

00:59:51.967 --> 00:59:56.134
THAT FATHERLESSNESS IT
HEALED ME IN WAYS THAT I

00:59:56.234 --> 00:59:58.734
DIDN'T EVEN KNOW THAT I
NEEDED TO BE HEALED STILL

00:59:58.834 --> 01:00:00.734
IN WITHIN OUR MARRIAGE.


01:00:00.834 --> 01:00:04.100
AND IT WAS LIKE, MAN,
I HAD SO MUCH MORE.

01:00:04.200 --> 01:00:06.934
NOW, GRANTED, YOU KNOW,
SHOULD HE HAVE BROKEN ALL

01:00:07.034 --> 01:00:08.434
OF OUR PLATES ONE TIME?


01:00:08.534 --> 01:00:11.533
NO, HE PROBABLY SHOULDN'T
HAVE DONE THAT.

01:00:11.633 --> 01:00:12.234
BUT IT WAS LIKE...


01:00:12.334 --> 01:00:13.000
JONATHAN: POOR PAPA SIGS.


01:00:13.100 --> 01:00:14.500
REBECCA: POOR PAPA SIGS.


01:00:14.600 --> 01:00:17.967
JULIE: BUT IT WAS LIKE I LOOKED
AT IT DIFFERENTLY.

01:00:18.067 --> 01:00:20.234
AND I THOUGHT, I WANT TO
THROW ALL THE PLATES.

01:00:20.334 --> 01:00:21.367
I'M MAD.


01:00:21.467 --> 01:00:23.500
I LOST MY DAD
UNEXPECTEDLY.

01:00:23.600 --> 01:00:28.700
AND, YOU KNOW, IT'S LIKE I
WANTED TO BE ANGRY AND I.

01:00:28.800 --> 01:00:31.467
AND NOT THAT THAT ANGER
DIRECTED AT YOUR SPOUSE IS

01:00:31.567 --> 01:00:35.633
OKAY, BUT IT'S LIKE,
MAN, THE FORGIVENESS.

01:00:35.733 --> 01:00:38.067
IT'S LIKE, I DIDN'T EVEN
KNOW THERE WERE STILL

01:00:38.167 --> 01:00:40.000
AREAS I NEEDED
TO FORGIVE HIM.

01:00:40.100 --> 01:00:43.733
SO IT WAS LIKE US, YOU
KNOW, THAT THAT FATHER

01:00:43.833 --> 01:00:44.800
WOUND.


01:00:44.900 --> 01:00:45.334
YEAH.


01:00:45.434 --> 01:00:46.567
IT'S HARD.


01:00:46.667 --> 01:00:49.867
BUT IF YOU COME INTO
AGREEMENT IN MARRIAGE, NOT

01:00:49.967 --> 01:00:53.301
LIKE TOXIC TRAUMA
BONDING, BUT LIKE, TRUE

01:00:53.401 --> 01:00:56.100
LIKE WE'RE GONNA
HEAL TOGETHER.

01:00:56.200 --> 01:00:57.634
YEAH, IT WAS A
WHOLE NOTHER LEVEL

01:00:57.734 --> 01:00:58.467
I THINK IN OUR


01:00:58.567 --> 01:00:59.667
MARRIAGE.


01:00:59.767 --> 01:01:01.700
MIKE: YOU WOULD SAY THINGS
LIKE, I THINK I UNDERSTAND

01:01:01.800 --> 01:01:02.667
NOW.


01:01:02.767 --> 01:01:03.734
REBECCA: OH, YEAH.


01:01:03.834 --> 01:01:04.667
MIKE: BECAUSE SHE
WOULD BE SO UPSET.

01:01:04.767 --> 01:01:05.667
JONATHAN: YEAH.


01:01:05.767 --> 01:01:07.100
IT WAS LIKE HER PAIN
GAVE HER EYES TO SEE

01:01:07.200 --> 01:01:07.967
WHAT YOUR


01:01:08.067 --> 01:01:09.200
PAIN WAS LIKE.


01:01:09.300 --> 01:01:10.733
MIKE: WE'RE LEADING A MULTI-SITE
NATIONAL CHURCH, AND IT'S

01:01:10.833 --> 01:01:13.434
FATHER'S DAY, AND SHE'S
WATCHING EVERYBODY WITH

01:01:13.534 --> 01:01:16.267
THEIR FATHER, AND SHE'S
LIKE, YOU KNOW, AND SHE'S

01:01:16.367 --> 01:01:17.767
WEEPING BEHIND STAGE.


01:01:17.867 --> 01:01:20.400
AND THEN SHE'S LIKE,
MIKE, I GET IT NOW.

01:01:20.500 --> 01:01:22.300
AND SO IT WAS LIKE THIS
WEIRD THING WHERE, LIKE

01:01:22.400 --> 01:01:24.034
YOU SAID, IT WASN'T
TRAUMA BONDING.

01:01:24.134 --> 01:01:27.634
IT WASN'T CODEPENDENCY,
BUT IT WAS EMPATHY.

01:01:27.734 --> 01:01:29.767
AND IT WAS LIKE A DEEPER
EMPATHY OF LIKE, IT

01:01:29.867 --> 01:01:32.733
DOESN'T IT DOESN'T JUSTIFY
DOING THE WRONG THING.

01:01:32.833 --> 01:01:35.233
BUT I THINK I UNDERSTAND
YOUR PAIN IN A WAY THAT I

01:01:35.333 --> 01:01:37.301
DIDN'T UNDERSTAND IT,
WHICH IS ACTUALLY MAKING

01:01:37.401 --> 01:01:40.667
IT EASIER TO FORGIVE IN
AREAS I NEED TO FORGIVE.

01:01:40.767 --> 01:01:42.267
REBECCA: YEAH, TOTALLY.


01:01:42.367 --> 01:01:43.800
NO, IT MAKES
COMPLETE SENSE TO ME.

01:01:43.900 --> 01:01:45.334
AND WHAT WAS COOL IS
THE BIBLE SAYS WHEN GOD

01:01:45.434 --> 01:01:47.667
COMFORTS US IN OUR
PAIN, HE ENABLES.

01:01:47.767 --> 01:01:49.534
HE EMPOWERS US TO
COMFORT OTHERS.

01:01:49.634 --> 01:01:51.800
AND SO HE COMFORTED YOU
AND YOUR FATHERLESSNESS,

01:01:51.900 --> 01:01:54.067
WHICH LED YOU TO BE ABLE
TO COMFORT HER AND HER

01:01:54.167 --> 01:01:55.000
FATHERLESSNESS.


01:01:55.100 --> 01:01:56.700
AND IT GAVE YOU
THE INSIGHT.

01:01:56.800 --> 01:01:57.867
AND I THINK ABOUT ME.


01:01:57.967 --> 01:01:59.500
ONE OF THE JOURNEYS GOD
HAS TAKEN ME ON IS I THINK

01:01:59.600 --> 01:02:02.234
THAT'S WHY I JUST I'VE
COME TO A PLACE WHERE I

01:02:02.334 --> 01:02:04.467
REALLY IF I FIND MYSELF
JUDGING SOMEONE OR A

01:02:04.567 --> 01:02:06.400
SITUATION, I'M
IMMEDIATELY REPENT.

01:02:06.500 --> 01:02:08.267
BUT I'VE JUST SEEN ENOUGH
AND GONE THROUGH ENOUGH

01:02:08.367 --> 01:02:10.934
STUFF WHERE IT'S LIKE, YOU
REALLY CAN'T JUDGE PEOPLE

01:02:11.034 --> 01:02:13.101
BECAUSE IT'S LIKE UNTIL
YOU UNDERSTAND, LIKE, AND

01:02:13.201 --> 01:02:15.867
YOU STEP INTO THEIR SHOES,
YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT'S

01:02:15.967 --> 01:02:16.900
LIKE.


01:02:17.000 --> 01:02:19.100
AND SO I WOULD JUST
ENCOURAGE ANY CHRISTIAN,

01:02:19.200 --> 01:02:21.167
DON'T BE IN THE SEAT OF
JUDGMENT AGAINST YOUR

01:02:21.267 --> 01:02:23.633
BROTHER, BUT JUST LOVE
THEM AND PRAY FOR THEM AND

01:02:23.733 --> 01:02:24.767
COVER THEM.


01:02:24.867 --> 01:02:26.633
YOU KNOW, THE BIBLE SAYS
LOVE COVERS A MULTITUDE OF

01:02:26.733 --> 01:02:27.700
SINS.


01:02:27.800 --> 01:02:29.167
AND IT'S LIKE WHEN YOU
BEGIN TO EXPERIENCE SOME

01:02:29.267 --> 01:02:30.633
OF THAT, WHAT THEY WENT
THROUGH, YOU'RE LIKE, OH

01:02:30.733 --> 01:02:32.900
MY GOSH, NOW I UNDERSTAND,
BUT I THINK THAT'S

01:02:33.000 --> 01:02:33.901
BEAUTIFUL.


01:02:34.001 --> 01:02:35.467
I LOVE LIKE Y'ALL'S
TRANSPARENCY IN YOUR

01:02:35.567 --> 01:02:37.167
MARRIAGE AND HOW LIKE,
GOD'S BROUGHT YOU THROUGH.

01:02:37.267 --> 01:02:39.433
LIKE IT JUST SHOWS LIKE
IF TWO PEOPLE CAN BE

01:02:39.533 --> 01:02:41.001
SURRENDERED AND CHOOSE
TO LOVE AND SERVE ONE

01:02:41.101 --> 01:02:43.567
ANOTHER, IT'S LIKE, AND
YOU CHOOSE TO KEEP GOING

01:02:43.667 --> 01:02:46.601
TOGETHER, IT'S LIKE GOD
CAN WORK ANYTHING OUT.

01:02:46.701 --> 01:02:47.400
AND I JUST LOVE.


01:02:47.500 --> 01:02:48.734
DON'T YOU JUST
LOVE SEEING THAT?

01:02:48.834 --> 01:02:49.534
JONATHAN: YEAH, I LOVE IT.


01:02:49.634 --> 01:02:50.167
REBECCA: HOW MANY YEARS


01:02:50.267 --> 01:02:51.067
HAVE YOU BEEN MARRIED?


01:02:51.167 --> 01:02:52.200
MIKE: 20 YEARS.


01:02:52.300 --> 01:02:53.467
JULIE: WE JUST CELEBRATED
20 YEARS.

01:02:53.567 --> 01:02:54.067
REBECCA: OH,


01:02:54.167 --> 01:02:54.567
THAT'S SO EXCITING.


01:02:54.667 --> 01:02:55.433
JULIE: 20 YEARS.


01:02:55.533 --> 01:02:56.600
IT'S CRAZY.


01:02:56.700 --> 01:02:57.434
REBECCA: THAT IS CRAZY.


01:02:57.534 --> 01:02:59.300
SO 20 YEARS TOGETHER.


01:02:59.400 --> 01:03:01.734
JULIE: 20 YEARS OF MARRIAGE.


01:03:01.834 --> 01:03:04.200
REBECCA: AND ACCOMPLISHED SO
MUCH AND GONE THROUGH SO MUCH.

01:03:04.300 --> 01:03:06.767
HOW LONG WAS Y'ALL'S
HEALING JOURNEY THROUGH

01:03:06.867 --> 01:03:07.933
ALL OF THAT?


01:03:08.033 --> 01:03:08.967
MIKE: ABOUT 19.5.


01:03:09.067 --> 01:03:09.934
JONATHAN: YEAH, EXACTLY.


01:03:10.034 --> 01:03:11.434
[ LAUGHING ]
JONATHAN: ONGOING.

01:03:11.534 --> 01:03:12.300
REBECCA: THAT'S A GOOD WORD.


01:03:12.400 --> 01:03:15.534
I MEAN, I'M STILL
THREE QUARTERS.

01:03:15.634 --> 01:03:17.134
MIKE: WHEN WE WERE
TALKING ABOUT THAT LAST NIGHT --

01:03:17.234 --> 01:03:17.833
JONATHAN: DOES IT EVER END?


01:03:17.933 --> 01:03:18.933
MIKE: YEAH.


01:03:19.033 --> 01:03:19.967
LIKE LIKE WE'RE WE'RE
STILL GOING THROUGH IT.

01:03:20.067 --> 01:03:21.134
REBECCA: THAT'S HOW I FEEL.


01:03:21.234 --> 01:03:22.033
MIKE: AND TALKING
THINGS THROUGH AND

01:03:22.133 --> 01:03:23.200
LIKE, YEAH.


01:03:23.300 --> 01:03:23.934
JONATHAN: THAT'S TRUE.


01:03:24.034 --> 01:03:24.700
THAT'S THE REALNESS OF IT.


01:03:24.800 --> 01:03:25.500
REBECCA: I MEAN, BUT NO ONE


01:03:25.600 --> 01:03:26.867
PRESENTS IT THAT WAY.


01:03:26.967 --> 01:03:28.434
I FEEL LIKE, YOU
KNOW WHAT I MEAN?

01:03:28.534 --> 01:03:30.167
JONATHAN: I FEEL LIKE IT HAPPENS
IN STAGES AND LEVELS,

01:03:30.267 --> 01:03:31.067
LIKE YOU LOOK BACK --


01:03:31.167 --> 01:03:32.267
REBECCA: SAME WITH
SANCTIFICATION.

01:03:32.367 --> 01:03:34.800
JONATHAN: LIKE LAST YEAR, THE
BATTLES THAT THE LORD

01:03:34.900 --> 01:03:36.467
HELPED YOU OVERCOME ARE
DIFFERENT THAN THE NEW

01:03:36.567 --> 01:03:37.734
SEASON THAT YOU'RE IN.


01:03:37.834 --> 01:03:39.801
AND IT'S LIKE THIS JOURNEY
BECAUSE WE LIVE IN A

01:03:39.901 --> 01:03:40.600
FALLEN WORLD.


01:03:40.700 --> 01:03:41.967
IT'S NEVER GOING TO END.


01:03:42.067 --> 01:03:43.033
REBECCA: IT'S NEVER
GOING TO END.

01:03:43.133 --> 01:03:44.433
THAT'S GOOD.


01:03:44.533 --> 01:03:46.333
JONATHAN: BUT WE'RE GOING TO GET
LEVELED UP IN DIFFERENT IN

01:03:46.433 --> 01:03:47.700
EACH SEASON.


01:03:47.800 --> 01:03:48.667
REBECCA: IF WE ALLOW HIM TO.


01:03:48.767 --> 01:03:50.133
JONATHAN: 19 AND A HALF
OR 20 OR ONGOING.

01:03:50.233 --> 01:03:50.600
JULIE: YEAH.


01:03:50.700 --> 01:03:51.601
YEAH, YEAH.


01:03:51.701 --> 01:03:53.034
I MEAN THAT TRUST
BUILDING PHASE TRUSTING

01:03:53.134 --> 01:03:54.467
HIM, YOU KNOW.


01:03:54.567 --> 01:03:56.133
WAS HE TRULY SOBER?


01:03:56.233 --> 01:04:00.300
WAS HE TRULY, YOU KNOW,
WALKING IN INTEGRITY?

01:04:00.400 --> 01:04:02.334
I MEAN THAT THAT
WAS MANY YEARS.

01:04:02.434 --> 01:04:04.067
THAT TRUST TAKES YEARS.


01:04:04.167 --> 01:04:07.433
YOU KNOW, TRUST IS EASY TO
LOSE AND HARD TO BUILD.

01:04:07.533 --> 01:04:09.133
SO THAT TOOK
A LOT OF TIME.

01:04:09.233 --> 01:04:11.767
I WOULD SAY THAT WAS A 5
TO 7 YEAR JOURNEY AT THE

01:04:11.867 --> 01:04:13.567
BEGINNING OF OUR MARRIAGE.


01:04:13.667 --> 01:04:15.800
BUT IT'S LIKE, MAN, YOU
KNOW, AND THEN WHEN YOUR

01:04:15.900 --> 01:04:19.634
KIDS ARE LITTLE NOW,
YOU'RE JUGGLING LIKE THE

01:04:19.734 --> 01:04:21.701
HARDNESS OF LITTLE KIDS.


01:04:21.801 --> 01:04:24.133
BUT NOW THAT THEY'RE
OLDER, NOW WE'RE JUGGLING

01:04:24.233 --> 01:04:25.301
LIKE,


01:04:25.401 --> 01:04:27.067
HOW DO WE SPEND
OUR TIME TOGETHER?

01:04:27.167 --> 01:04:29.400
YOU KNOW, LIKE WE'RE
TOGETHER A LOT MORE OR,

01:04:29.500 --> 01:04:31.701
YOU KNOW, THE KIDS ARE
REALLY BUSY, SO WE'RE

01:04:31.801 --> 01:04:34.767
TOGETHER LESS, AND IT'S
LIKE YOU'RE ALWAYS GOING

01:04:34.867 --> 01:04:36.067
TO HAVE SOMETHING
TO NAVIGATE.

01:04:36.167 --> 01:04:38.767
I THINK THE BENEFIT FOR US
WAS GOING THROUGH ALL THE

01:04:38.867 --> 01:04:41.700
CRAZINESS AT
THE BEGINNING.

01:04:41.800 --> 01:04:42.967
[ LAUGHING ]
JULIE: WE GOT THAT ALL OUT OF

01:04:43.067 --> 01:04:46.167
THE WAY, AND NOW WE'RE JUST
GOING THROUGH THE CRAZINESS OF

01:04:46.267 --> 01:04:46.667
LIFE.


01:04:46.767 --> 01:04:47.100
IT'S JUST THE


01:04:47.200 --> 01:04:48.167
SAME SKILL.


01:04:48.267 --> 01:04:49.567
JONATHAN: BUT GOD, HE WAS LAYING
THAT FOUNDATION.

01:04:49.667 --> 01:04:50.634
REBECCA: YEAH, THAT'S
WHAT I WAS THINKING.

01:04:50.734 --> 01:04:51.700
JONATHAN: TO THIS NEW LEVEL
THAT YOU'RE AT.

01:04:51.800 --> 01:04:53.601
YOU KNOW, YOU TOOK YOU
THROUGH ALL OF THAT, ALL

01:04:53.701 --> 01:04:54.834
OF THOSE TRIALS.


01:04:54.934 --> 01:04:56.367
BECAUSE NOW LOOK AT ALL
THE FRUIT THAT'S COME OF

01:04:56.467 --> 01:04:57.667
IT.


01:04:57.767 --> 01:04:58.767
AND WHAT'S BEEN...


01:04:58.867 --> 01:04:59.734
REBECCA: AND IF YOU


01:04:59.834 --> 01:05:00.800
HADN'T DEALT WITH
IT, IF YOU WOULD HAVE

01:05:00.900 --> 01:05:01.834
TRANSITIONED INTO YOUR
STUFF IN NEW YORK, YOU

01:05:01.934 --> 01:05:03.167
WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN
ABLE TO HANDLE IT.

01:05:03.267 --> 01:05:04.400
JULIE: NO, IT WOULD HAVE...


01:05:04.500 --> 01:05:05.667
JONATHAN: IT WOULD HAVE BROKEN.


01:05:05.767 --> 01:05:06.967
JULIE: IT WAS IT WOULD HAVE
BROKE US AND WOULD HAVE

01:05:07.067 --> 01:05:09.834
DAMAGED SO MANY PEOPLE.


01:05:09.934 --> 01:05:13.667
AND I'M SO THANKFUL THAT
THE LORD WE HAD THE THE

01:05:13.767 --> 01:05:19.100
BENEFIT OF WALKING THROUGH
THAT STUFF AND OBSCURITY.

01:05:19.200 --> 01:05:21.867
AND SO I THINK IF ANYBODY
HERE IS LISTENING AND THEY

01:05:21.967 --> 01:05:23.834
MAYBE THEY WANT TO DO
MINISTRY OR THEY WANT TO

01:05:23.934 --> 01:05:25.367
DO THAT, BUT THEY
HAVE A LOT GOING ON.

01:05:25.467 --> 01:05:27.067
WALK THROUGH YOUR
STUFF AND OBSCURITY.

01:05:27.167 --> 01:05:29.134
THAT IS A BLESSING.


01:05:29.234 --> 01:05:32.701
>> AND I'M SO THANKFUL
THAT LIKE, WE GET ENJOY

01:05:32.801 --> 01:05:34.834
OUR MARRIAGE AND WE WERE
ABLE TO STRUGGLE IN OUR

01:05:34.934 --> 01:05:37.301
MARRIAGE WHILE WE
WERE IN OBSCURITY.

01:05:37.401 --> 01:05:38.001
THAT WAS A BLESSING.


01:05:38.101 --> 01:05:38.900
MIKE: YEAH, IT WAS.


01:05:39.000 --> 01:05:39.467
JULIE: I'M REALLY


01:05:39.567 --> 01:05:40.667
GRATEFUL FOR THAT.


01:05:40.767 --> 01:05:41.867
JONATHAN: NOW YOU CAN JUST
MINISTER FROM ALL OF THAT,

01:05:41.967 --> 01:05:43.233
YOU KNOW, MINISTER TO PEOPLE,
BECAUSE THIS IS GOING TO

01:05:43.333 --> 01:05:44.700
TOUCH A LOT OF
PEOPLE'S LIVES.

01:05:44.800 --> 01:05:46.700
PEOPLE THAT ARE LISTENING,
THEY HEAR THE STRUGGLES,

01:05:46.800 --> 01:05:48.034
THEY HEAR THE STORY,
THEY HEAR THE PAIN, THE

01:05:48.134 --> 01:05:49.234
REALNESS OF IT.


01:05:49.334 --> 01:05:50.734
GOD'S GOING TO MEET
THEM WHERE THEY'RE AT.

01:05:50.834 --> 01:05:52.200
AND I'M EXCITED TO COME
CHECK OUT Y'ALL'S CHURCH

01:05:52.300 --> 01:05:53.234
YOU HAVE.


01:05:53.334 --> 01:05:54.667
WE HAVE FOUR DIFFERENT
STATES WE CAN GO TO.

01:05:54.767 --> 01:05:56.033
REBECCA:
TAKE YOUR PICK.

01:05:56.133 --> 01:05:56.867
JONATHAN: NEW YORK, NEW JERSEY.


01:05:56.967 --> 01:05:58.100
[ LAUGHING ]
MIKE: PLEASE COME.

01:05:58.200 --> 01:05:58.634
JONATHAN: WE CAN PICK ALL THESE


01:05:58.734 --> 01:05:59.167
CAMPUSES.


01:05:59.267 --> 01:06:00.233
MIKE: DO A FREE


01:06:00.333 --> 01:06:01.034
TOUR WITH IT
AND EVERYTHING.

01:06:01.134 --> 01:06:02.167
REBECCA: GO SOMEWHERE WARM.


01:06:02.267 --> 01:06:03.101
JONATHAN: YEAH, THAT'S
A GOOD POINT.

01:06:03.201 --> 01:06:04.401
JULIE: WE'RE LIKE, MIAMI.


01:06:04.501 --> 01:06:06.300
[ LAUGHING ]
MIKE: YEAH, YEAH, YEAH.

01:06:06.400 --> 01:06:07.433
REBECCA: I DO WANT TO,


01:06:07.533 --> 01:06:09.600
BEFORE WE WRAP, I DO WANT
YOU TO TOUCH A LITTLE BIT

01:06:09.700 --> 01:06:14.233
ON THE BOOK AND KIND OF
SHARE WITH PEOPLE WHAT GOT

01:06:14.333 --> 01:06:17.433
YOU TO WRITE IT AND WHO
SHOULD BE READING IT.

01:06:17.533 --> 01:06:18.600
MIKE: YEAH.


01:06:18.700 --> 01:06:20.867
SO A LOT OF PEOPLE ASK ME,
LIKE, YOU KNOW, RETRACE

01:06:20.967 --> 01:06:21.867
YOUR STEPS.


01:06:21.967 --> 01:06:23.800
LIKE, TELL ME, LIKE,
GIVE ME THE FORMULA.

01:06:23.900 --> 01:06:25.667
WHAT DID YOU DO THAT WORKS?


01:06:25.767 --> 01:06:26.334
REBECCA: PEOPLE ALWAYS
WANT A FORMULA.

01:06:26.434 --> 01:06:27.067
MIKE: THEY DO.


01:06:27.167 --> 01:06:28.367
THEY DO.


01:06:28.467 --> 01:06:31.033
SO IT WAS LIKE, AND OF
COURSE WE PASTOR A LOT OF

01:06:31.133 --> 01:06:31.867
PEOPLE.


01:06:31.967 --> 01:06:33.567
ACROSS ALL OF
THESE CAMPUSES.

01:06:33.667 --> 01:06:36.200
AND I SAID, IF I WERE TO
SIT DOWN AND TAKE SOMEBODY

01:06:36.300 --> 01:06:38.567
THROUGH A JOURNEY ONE ON
ONE, BECAUSE IN THE EARLY

01:06:38.667 --> 01:06:40.567
DAYS OF OUR CHURCH, WE
STARTED WITH ONLY 18

01:06:40.667 --> 01:06:44.467
PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, AND IT
WAS LIKE AT ONE POINT, I --

01:06:44.567 --> 01:06:45.734
JONATHAN: HEBREW NUMBER
FOR LIFE.

01:06:45.834 --> 01:06:49.167
MIKE: REALLY?


01:06:49.267 --> 01:06:50.234
REBECCA: WELL, TO LIFE.


01:06:50.334 --> 01:06:50.867
JONATHAN: NO.


01:06:50.967 --> 01:06:51.733
REBECCA: EDIT THAT OUT.


01:06:51.833 --> 01:06:52.367
NO, JUST KIDDING.


01:06:52.467 --> 01:06:53.401
[ LAUGHING ]
OKAY.

01:06:53.501 --> 01:06:54.433
JONATHAN: SHE'S SO PROUD.


01:06:54.533 --> 01:06:56.667
MIKE: I LOVE THAT.
IS 18 THE NUMBER...?

01:06:56.767 --> 01:06:58.167
JONATHAN: 18 IS THE NUMBER OF
LIFE.

01:06:58.267 --> 01:06:59.867
AND IT'S LIKE REALLY,


01:06:59.967 --> 01:07:01.100
YOU COULD ASK THE RABBI
ABOUT IT WHEN YOU SEE HIM

01:07:01.200 --> 01:07:01.867
ON SUNDAY.


01:07:01.967 --> 01:07:02.267
REBECCA: YEAH.


01:07:02.367 --> 01:07:02.934
HE SHOULD.


01:07:03.034 --> 01:07:04.034
JONATHAN: JUST TELL HIM,


01:07:04.134 --> 01:07:06.401
I STARTED WITH MY CHURCH
WITH 18 MEN, 18 PEOPLE.

01:07:06.501 --> 01:07:07.601
IS THAT
SIGNIFICANT AT ALL?

01:07:07.701 --> 01:07:08.967
AND HE'LL JUST UNPACK IT.


01:07:09.067 --> 01:07:10.800
IT'S SUCH AN IMPORTANT
NUMBER ANYWAYS.

01:07:10.900 --> 01:07:12.534
MIKE: OH, YOU'RE ABOUT
TO MAKE ME CRY.

01:07:12.634 --> 01:07:13.333
JULIE: WE'RE GOING TO BE...


01:07:13.433 --> 01:07:13.767
REBECCA: I DID NOT


01:07:13.867 --> 01:07:14.634
KNOW THAT.


01:07:14.734 --> 01:07:16.034
WOW.


01:07:16.134 --> 01:07:17.267
REBECCA: THAT'S WHY I BRING
HIM ON THE PODCAST,

01:07:17.367 --> 01:07:17.867
JUST FOR LITTLE


01:07:17.967 --> 01:07:18.934
MORSELS LIKE THAT.


01:07:19.034 --> 01:07:19.801
MIKE: THAT'S AWESOME.


01:07:19.901 --> 01:07:20.301
OKAY, I'LL ASK HIM.


01:07:20.401 --> 01:07:20.734
JONATHAN: YEAH,


01:07:20.834 --> 01:07:21.400
YOU WILL.


01:07:21.500 --> 01:07:22.300
MIKE: OH, THAT'S CRAZY.


01:07:22.400 --> 01:07:23.467
YEAH.


01:07:23.567 --> 01:07:24.867
WE STARTED WITH 18 PEOPLE,
AND WHAT I WAS SAYING WAS

01:07:24.967 --> 01:07:27.434
I WOULD MEET WITH EVEN UP
TO THE POINT WHERE OUR

01:07:27.534 --> 01:07:28.834
CHURCH WAS A COUPLE
HUNDRED PEOPLE.

01:07:28.934 --> 01:07:32.067
I PERSONALLY MET WITH
EVERY SINGLE PERSON.

01:07:32.167 --> 01:07:33.967
AND I WOULD WALK THEM
THROUGH JOURNEYS AND, YOU

01:07:34.067 --> 01:07:37.734
KNOW, JUST VERY DEEP
PASTORAL COUNSELING.

01:07:37.834 --> 01:07:39.833
AND SO AS OUR CHURCH BEGAN
TO GROW AND EXPAND, I

01:07:39.933 --> 01:07:42.534
RAISED UP PASTORS,
SHEPHERDS AND TRY TO

01:07:42.634 --> 01:07:44.733
DOWNLOAD MY HEART INTO
THEIR HEART AND, YOU KNOW,

01:07:44.833 --> 01:07:46.801
THE CULTURE AND THE
DNA OF OUR CHURCH.

01:07:46.901 --> 01:07:50.134
BUT THEN I WAS LIKE, IF I
COULD PERSONALLY SIT WITH

01:07:50.234 --> 01:07:53.467
SOMEONE, WHAT WOULD I HOW
WOULD I TAKE THEM ON THIS

01:07:53.567 --> 01:07:54.267
JOURNEY?


01:07:54.367 --> 01:07:55.367
AND THAT'S WHAT
THE BOOK IS.

01:07:55.467 --> 01:07:57.733
IT'S 12 CHAPTERS,
AND I MEAN, IT'S VERY

01:07:57.833 --> 01:07:58.833
INTERACTIVE.


01:07:58.933 --> 01:08:00.567
THERE'S QR CODES IN THERE
WHERE YOU SCAN IT AND GO

01:08:00.667 --> 01:08:03.267
TO VIDEOS THAT ARE LIKE
THAT, YOU KNOW, JUST THAT

01:08:03.367 --> 01:08:05.167
AREN'T ONLINE
ANYWHERE ELSE.

01:08:05.267 --> 01:08:06.467
THERE'S THINGS TO FILL IN.


01:08:06.567 --> 01:08:08.367
AS A MATTER OF FACT, THIS
IS A QUICK SIDE NOTE.

01:08:08.467 --> 01:08:10.833
I HAD A WOMAN WHO IS JUST
GETTING HER DOCTORATE

01:08:10.933 --> 01:08:14.400
RIGHT NOW IN PSYCHOLOGY,
AND SHE READ THE BOOK AND

01:08:14.500 --> 01:08:16.300
SHE WAS LIKE, WHERE DID
YOU GET SOME OF THESE

01:08:16.400 --> 01:08:18.567
DIAGRAMS AND THINGS
THAT YOU HAVE IN THERE?

01:08:18.667 --> 01:08:20.867
AND I SAID, I JUST
GOT THEM IN PRAYER.

01:08:20.967 --> 01:08:22.867
AS I WAS PREPARING FOR THE
BOOK, SHE WAS LIKE, I'M

01:08:22.967 --> 01:08:25.134
JUST GETTING MY DOCTORATE
NOW, AND THIS IS CUTTING

01:08:25.234 --> 01:08:26.934
EDGE PSYCHOLOGY.


01:08:27.034 --> 01:08:27.967
AND YOU DIDN'T.


01:08:28.067 --> 01:08:30.167
AND SHE WAS SHOCKED
THAT I DIDN'T KNOW THAT.

01:08:30.267 --> 01:08:31.933
AND I WAS LIKE, I FEEL
LIKE I RECEIVED IT IN

01:08:32.033 --> 01:08:34.767
PRAYER AND JUST KIND OF
PUT IN THE BOOK WHAT I.

01:08:34.867 --> 01:08:36.834
SO THE BOOK IS VERY
UNIQUE IN THAT WAY.

01:08:36.934 --> 01:08:39.567
IT DEALS WITH THE DEMONIC,
BUT IT ALSO DEALS WITH THE

01:08:39.667 --> 01:08:42.434
BIOLOGICAL, BUT IT ALSO
DEALS WITH THE HEREDITARY.

01:08:42.534 --> 01:08:45.134
SO IT'S LIKE MORE I TRY TO
BE LIKE A WHOLE COMPLETE

01:08:45.234 --> 01:08:46.400
PICTURE.


01:08:46.500 --> 01:08:48.700
AND I THINK A LOT OF
PEOPLE WILL BE HELPED BY

01:08:48.800 --> 01:08:49.301
IT.


01:08:49.401 --> 01:08:50.434
JONATHAN: YEAH.


01:08:50.534 --> 01:08:51.400
AND I SAW YESTERDAY YOU
SIGNED A COUPLE COPIES IN

01:08:51.500 --> 01:08:53.300
BARNES AND NOBLE IN
SOUTHLAKE, TEXAS.

01:08:53.400 --> 01:08:55.067
SO GO TO YOUR BARNES AND
NOBLE IN SOUTHLAKE,

01:08:55.167 --> 01:08:56.067
TEXAS.


01:08:56.167 --> 01:08:57.934
YOU MIGHT GET A SIGNED
COPY BY PAPA SIGS.

01:08:58.034 --> 01:08:59.400
MIKE: I PUT A LITTLE MESSAGE
IN THERE IN EACH ONE, TWO

01:08:59.500 --> 01:09:00.900
LITTLE SECRET MESSAGES.


01:09:01.000 --> 01:09:03.000
ANYWHERE I GO, I GO
TO THE BARNES AND NOBLE

01:09:03.100 --> 01:09:05.233
IF THEY IF THEY HAVE
COPIES AND I DO THAT.

01:09:05.333 --> 01:09:06.067
YEAH.


01:09:06.167 --> 01:09:06.934
JULIE: YEAH, I FORCE HIM TO.


01:09:07.034 --> 01:09:08.000
I'M LIKE, WE'RE
GOING IN THERE.

01:09:08.100 --> 01:09:09.034
WE'RE FINDING
YOUR BOOK.

01:09:09.134 --> 01:09:11.300
MIKE: AGAIN, IT'S CRINGEY
TO ME, YOU KNOW?

01:09:11.400 --> 01:09:13.134
BUT SHE WAS LIKE,
SHE'S THE ONE WHO

01:09:13.234 --> 01:09:14.334
FORCED ME TO GO.


01:09:14.434 --> 01:09:15.334
JULIE: IT'S A BIG DEAL.
I'M A PROUD WIFE.

01:09:15.434 --> 01:09:17.334
I GAVE MY WHOLE
LIFE FOR THAT BOOK.

01:09:17.434 --> 01:09:18.633
[ LAUGHING ]
JONATHAN: YEAH, EXACTLY.

01:09:18.733 --> 01:09:19.367
PEOPLE NEED


01:09:19.467 --> 01:09:20.533
TO READ IT.


01:09:20.633 --> 01:09:21.033
REBECCA: IT'S LIKE Y'ALL'S BOOK,


01:09:21.133 --> 01:09:21.767
REALLY.


01:09:21.867 --> 01:09:23.501
MIKE: THAT IS SO TRUE.


01:09:23.601 --> 01:09:24.600
JULIE: JUST KIDDING.


01:09:24.700 --> 01:09:25.133
REBECCA: THAT'S SO COOL.


01:09:25.233 --> 01:09:26.200
JULIE: I LOVE IT.


01:09:26.300 --> 01:09:27.567
REBECCA: WELL, THANK YOU
SO MUCH FOR BEING ON.

01:09:27.667 --> 01:09:30.000
AND I THINK FOR ANYONE WHO
WANTS TO GET CONNECTED,

01:09:30.100 --> 01:09:32.067
WHAT IS THE BEST WAY
TO GET CONNECTED?

01:09:32.167 --> 01:09:34.867
MIKE: I WOULD SAY IF THEY
GO TO MIKESIGNORELLI.COM.

01:09:34.967 --> 01:09:36.634
BECAUSE EVERYTHING'S
LINKED THERE.

01:09:36.734 --> 01:09:37.901
REBECCA: ALL RIGHT.


01:09:38.001 --> 01:09:38.867
AWESOME.


01:09:38.967 --> 01:09:39.367
DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING YOU
WANT TO END ON?

01:09:39.467 --> 01:09:40.000
JONATHAN: NO.


01:09:40.100 --> 01:09:41.067
JUST APPRECIATE Y'ALL.


01:09:41.167 --> 01:09:41.433
MIKE: YEAH.


01:09:41.533 --> 01:09:42.234
SAME.


01:09:42.334 --> 01:09:42.967
JULIE: THANK YOU
FOR HAVING US.

01:09:43.067 --> 01:09:43.633
MIKE: YOU GUYS ARE AMAZING.


01:09:43.733 --> 01:09:44.400
THIS WAS AWESOME.


01:09:44.500 --> 01:09:45.567
JULIE: SO GOOD.
THANK YOU.