>> THIS IS NOT THE TYPICAL SETUP FOR THE PODCAST,
SO YOU GUYS CAN JUST SAY WHO YOU ARE.
>> HI, I'M JONATHAN, REBECCA'S HUSBAND.
>> AND WE'RE ALSO JOINED WITH?
>> JOSEPH Z.
AND TOGETHER, WE ARE WILD STALLIONS.
>> THAT'S RIGHT.
>> THAT'S BILL AND TED'S HUMOR.
>> THAT'S ACTUALLY --
THAT'S THE NEW NAME OF THE PODCAST.
>> YEAH, YEAH.
>> I'M PASTOR BRIAN GIBSON.
GOOD TO BE HERE.
>> GREAT TO HAVE YOU.
>> IT'S FUNNY 'CAUSE PASTOR BRIAN WAS JUST SITTING
OVER WHILE WE'RE DOING SOME OTHER SHOWS
AND REBECCA TEXTED ME AND SHE'S LIKE,
I REALLY LIKE WHO JOSEPH BROUGHT.
OF COURSE, JOSEPH IS A LONGTIME FRIEND OF OURS.
SHE'S LIKE, DO YOU THINK HE'LL BE DOWN?
SO I WENT DOWN AND FOUND HIM.
AND I JUST WROTE HIM A NOTE ON MY PHONE,
I WAS LIKE,
HEY, WILL YOU BE ON THE SHOW WITH US TODAY?
HE'S LIKE, SURE.
>> HE HAD NO IDEA WHO YOU WERE.
>> I THOUGHT HE WAS SECURITY.
I'M LIKE, SO THE BOUNCER WANTS ME TO BE ON THE SHOW.
>> THE BOUNCER.
>> HIS HEART, HE WAS DOWN TO BE ON THE,
YOU KNOW, THE BOUNCER SHOW.
>> YEAH, I LOVE THAT SO MUCH.
OKAY.
SO FOR PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE ANY CONTEXT,
THEY DON'T KNOW WHO YOU ARE,
JUST SAY A LITTLE BIT OF WHAT YOU GUYS DO.
WE'LL START WITH YOU.
>> YEAH.
I'VE BEEN PASTORING OVER
20 YEARS NOW.
MARRIED 25 YEARS.
THREE KIDS.
THREE CHURCH CAMPUSES KENTUCKY, TEXAS.
FIGHT FOR FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHTS
AND TRAVEL SOME WITH THIS GUY PROPHESYING.
AND THAT'S WHAT I DO.
>> COME ON, BROTHER.
>> YEAH.
>> WELL, I'M JOSEPH Z.
I WORK IN THE CHURCH,
THE GOVERNMENT, AND THE MARKETPLACE.
I HAVE A VISION TO RAISE UP A MILLION
TO REACH A BILLION.
AND THAT'S A MILLION DISCIPLES
THAT'LL BE TRULY TRAINED, CLEAR-EYED, CLEAR-MINDED,
TO GO WIN A BILLION FOR JESUS.
I WANT TO LEAVE, YOU KNOW, A LEGACY THAT WAY
THAT WILL IMPACT A BILLION SOULS
THAT ARE SAVED FOR THE KINGDOM BEFORE I'M DONE.
AND, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE THINGS WE DO IS WE MAKE
DISCIPLES THROUGH MEDIA.
SOCIAL MEDIA.
OF COURSE, WE'RE A MAJOR PART OF DAYSTAR.
WE LOVE BEING A PART OF THIS,
AND WHAT GOD'S CALLED US TO DO HERE.
BUT, YEAH, THAT'S WHAT WE DO.
WE REACH OUT THROUGH MEDIA AND I BELIEVE
IN PROPHETIC JOURNALISM.
THAT'S ANOTHER THING WE DO
IN OUR MINISTRY.
WRITE BOOKS, ALL THE STUFF,
AND, YEAH, DO SOME PROPHESYING WITH THIS GUY.
>> AND HOW DID Y'ALL GET CONNECTED?
>> YEAH. THAT'S WHAT I WAS GOING TO ASK.
>> MET IN PRISON.
[ LAUGHTER ]
>> NO, WE HAD A MUTUAL,
WE GOT A MUTUAL FRIEND
THAT, UH, THIS GUY WASN'T --
THIS GUY WAS LIKE A BAPTIST GUY.
>> THEY KNOW HIM.
>> OKAY. YOU KNOW HIM.
IT'S PASTOR GREG LOCKE.
AND SO WHENEVER THE, YOU KNOW,
LIKE LOCKDOWNS AND STUFF HAPPENED,
LIKE I'M NOT CLOSING MY CHURCH DOWN FOR ANYBODY
BUT JESUS, RIGHT.
IT'S LIKE, I'M NOT DOING IT.
I'M NOT PLAYING YOUR GAME, RIGHT.
SO A LOT OF GUYS THAT WERE FROM MY FLOW OF CHURCH
WOULDN'T DO WHAT I WAS DOING.
BUT I KNEW ABOUT THIS CRAZY GUY FROM TENNESSEE, RIGHT,
AND I'M LIKE BRING ME THAT NUTTY INDEPENDENT
BAPTIST GUY FROM TENNESSEE.
HE'LL FIGHT WITH ME AGAINST THIS STUFF.
AND SO WE TRAVELED 30 STATES TOGETHER
PREACHING OPEN UP THE CHURCH.
AND HE WASN'T LIKE A SPIRIT-FILLED BELIEVER
AT THE TIME.
HE WAS CHRISTIAN, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN,
BUT DIDN'T BELIEVE IN THE GIFTS STILL OPERATING.
AND SO HE GOT FILLED WITH THE SPIRIT
DURING THAT TIME AND BECAME FRIENDS WITH Z.
>> WOW.
>> SO HE STARTED TELLING ME LIKE Z IS A REAL PROPHET,
YOU'LL LOVE HIM.
UM, BUT, YOU KNOW, YOU NEED TO MEET THIS GUY,
MEET THIS GUY.
AND SO I GOT HIS NUMBER ONE DAY
AND I SENT Z A PROPHETIC WORD.
AND THEN HE SENT ME ONE BACK.
AND LIKE THEY WERE BOTH RIGHT.
I'M LIKE, HEY, THIS GUY REALLY IS A PROPHET.
>> IT WAS REALLY COOL.
>> YES.
SO WE BECAME BUDDIES LIKE THAT.
>> THAT'S GREAT.
>> YEAH. IT'S LIKE PEN PALS.
>> WE'LL SEND EACH OTHER LIKE VOICE NOTES, YOU KNOW,
WHERE WE'RE PROPHESYING BACK AND FORTH.
AND IT'S LIKE, MAN,
THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT'S GOING ON.
THIS IS WHERE WE'RE HEADED.
AND LOCKE TOLD ME ABOUT YOU AS WELL.
I REMEMBER SEEING VIDEO CLIPS OF YOU
PROPHESYING TO PEOPLE AND YOU'RE LIKE EATING OR
SOMETHING AND YOU'RE MINISTERING TO PEOPLE.
IT DIDN'T MATTER.
AND PEOPLE ARE JUST LIKE FALLING OUT
IN THE POWER AND I ENJOY THAT STUFF.
AND UM, I LIKE PASTOR BRIAN
BECAUSE HE'S NOT RELIGIOUS, BUT THERE'S
A LOT OF POWER THAT COMES THROUGH HIS MINISTRY.
I MEAN PALPABLE RESULTS-BASED POWER.
IT'S NOT JUST FOR, YOU KNOW, THE SHOW AND ALL THAT STUFF.
NONE OF THAT IS A PART OF HIS MINISTRY
AND WHEN YOU GO TO HIS CHURCHES,
HE'S GOT THREE CAMPUSES.
THEY'RE -- THEY'RE JUST FILLED WITH POWER.
AND IT'S -- THERE'S STRONG MEN BEING RAISED UP
IN YOUR CHURCHES.
THAT'S ONE THING I NOTICED,
AND A HEALTHY FLOW OF THE PROPHETIC.
AS A MATTER OF FACT, HE, IN A CHURCH SETTING,
IS KIND OF LIKE A HEALTHY SHERIFF
WITH PROPHECY.
LIKE, HE KEEPS IT IN ORDER AND THEN ALSO HAS
HIGH-FUNCTIONING PROPHECY.
I'M TALKING THIS STUFF THAT'LL BLOW YOUR HAIR BACK,
LIKE REALLY POWERFUL THINGS HAPPEN IN HIS CHURCHES.
SO I JUST REALLY ENJOYED THE COMRADERY OF IT
AND THE, I GUESS, JUST THE PROPHETIC,
YOU KNOW, PARTNERSHIP OF IT WHERE WE CAN DO STUFF.
WE JUST GOT DONE WITH A CONFERENCE
I PUT ON IN DALLAS/FORT WORTH.
AND, YOU KNOW, IT WAS -- IT WAS SHOCKING.
WE PROMOTED IT FOR LIKE TWO DAYS,
AND IT PACKED OUT, LIKE OVERSOLD.
WE ACTUALLY QUIT PROMOTING IT.
ALL THIS STUFF HAPPENED AND PROPHET BRIAN CAME THERE
AND SMOKED IT.
LIKE, I'M TALKING HIS SESSION BLEW THE PLACE UP.
PEOPLE ARE STILL TALKING ABOUT IT.
AND SO IT'S FUN TO WORK WITH PEOPLE LIKE YOURSELVES,
THAT WHEN YOU GET TOGETHER AND BEGIN TO DO THINGS,
THAT IT REALLY IS A KINGDOM CONNECTION
THAT MAKES THE BODY OF CHRIST LIVE AND GO HIGHER.
>> DO YOU FEEL LIKE, PASTOR BRIAN,
THAT THERE WAS A MOMENT IN TIME WHERE YOU FELT
THE LORD CALL YOU INTO PROPHETIC MINISTRY,
OR DID IT JUST START OPERATING IN YOU
ORGANICALLY AS YOU'RE A PASTOR?
I'D LOVE TO HEAR HOW THAT CAME ABOUT.
>> YOU KNOW, I THINK AS A KID,
I WAS LIKE SENSITIVE, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?
YOU KNOW, LIKE THINGS, I FELT THINGS DEEPLY.
>> JONATHAN: YEAH.
>> IT'S LIKE LIKE MY OTHER BROTHERS WOULD BE LIKE
GET OVER IT ALREADY, WHERE I'M LIKE SUCK IT UP,
YOU KNOW, ALL MALE HOUSE, BUT I FELT THINGS DEEPLY.
>> WOW.
>> UH, BUT NOT TILL I GOT SPIRIT-FILLED.
I WASN'T RAISED IN THAT KIND OF ENVIRONMENT.
I GOT SAVED AT ABOUT 21.
AND I GOT SPIRIT-FILLED.
AND THEN WHEN I GOT SPIRIT-FILLED
THIS STUFF STARTED HAPPENING.
LIKE, I WALKED INTO THIS CLASS,
I HAD AN INTRO TO WORLD RELIGIONS CLASS, RIGHT,
I WALK IN, I'M LOOKING AROUND,
IT'S AT A SECULAR UNIVERSITY.
AND THIS GUY IS SITTING BY ME.
I LOOK OVER AT HIM
AND I THINK, THIS GUY IS HINDU.
AND THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN GOD SPEAKS LIKE
THUNDERS IN MY SPIRIT.
AND HE SAID, NO, HE'S A BUDDHIST.
AND I'M LIKE, WHAT IS THAT?
I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT IT WAS, RIGHT.
AND SO LIKE NOW I WOULD SAY SO YOU'RE A BUDDHIST?
AND THAT'S HOW YOU START LIKE PROPHETIC EVANGELISM
OR SOMETHING.
BUT THEN GOD WAS JUST TEACHING ME, AND THE NEXT
LIKE 30 MINUTES THE PROFESSOR SAYS,
WE HAVE A REAL TREAT.
THERE'S A GUY HERE THAT'S AN EPISCOPALIAN
AND A ZEN BUDDHIST,
WHICH YOU CAN'T BE AN EPISCOPALIAN AND A ZEN BUDDHIST.
THESE THINGS DON'T WORK.
THIS GUY THOUGHT HE WAS.
HE'S GOING TO TALK TO US TODAY.
AND I'M LIKE, THAT WAS GOD.
SO THAT STUFF STARTED AND THEN I HAD TO FIGURE OUT
HOW TO USE IT,
YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?
>> HOW DID YOU FIGURE IT OUT?
>> A LOT OF TRIAL AND ERROR.
RIGHT.
SOME MESSES ALONG THE WAY.
YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T START PROPHESYING PERFECTLY.
YOU DON'T START GIVING WORDS OF KNOWLEDGE PERFECTLY.
YOU'RE LIKE A KID LEARNING TO RIDE A BIKE,
AND YOU'VE GOTTA TRY.
SO IT WAS JUST MINISTRY.
AND SO I SAY WHEN PEOPLE FIRST START HAVING
THESE TYPE EXPERIENCES OR OCCURRENCES,
UM, THE KEY FACTOR'S LOVE.
FOLLOW AFTER LOVE.
PAUL SAID THIS, FOLLOW AFTER LOVE.
DESIRE SPIRITUAL GIFTS.
SO THERE'S LOVE, THEN THERE'S DESIRE,
ESPECIALLY THAT YOU MAY PROPHESY.
SO IF LOVE IS YOUR MOTIVATION,
IT'S NOT ABOUT YOU.
IT'S ABOUT THE PERSON
YOU'RE PROPHESYING TO.
>> JONATHAN: THAT'S GOOD.
>> IT'S NOT ABOUT GETTING ATTENTION OR BEING
A SPIRITUAL GIANT.
IT'S ABOUT HELPING PEOPLE.
>> JOSEPH: SO GOOD.
>> SO YOU GOTTA GET THAT POSTURE.
IF YOU WANT TO LEARN TO PROPHESY, GET THE POSTURE,
I'M HERE TO HELP THE PEOPLE, NOT ABOUT ME.
I DECREASE, HE INCREASES.
WE'RE GOING TO HELP THESE FOLK
AND LET LOVE FLOW THROUGH US.
SO IF YOU'RE STARTING THAT, MY ENCOURAGEMENT WOULD BE
TELL PEOPLE YOU'RE STARTING, RIGHT.
SO YOU DON'T SHOW UP LIKE I AM THE GREAT ELIJAH SENT.
YOU KNOW, I AM MOSES.
>> I AM THE GREAT OZ.
YOU SAY, HEY, I'M JUST, YOU KNOW,
I'M TRYING TO LEARN HOW TO OPERATE IN THE GIFTS
OF THE SPIRIT,
AND I SENSE AND I FEEL THIS.
WILL YOU HELP ME LEARN,
TELL ME WHAT'S UP, IF I'M RIGHT OR WRONG?
THAT WAY YOU'RE PROTECTING THEM
AND YOU'VE PROTECTED YOU.
AND HERE'S THE DEAL WITH PROPHECY.
I THINK THE GREATEST PROPHETS THERE ARE,
ARE RIGHT 90% OF THE TIME.
>> JOSEPH: I AGREE.
>> YOU AGREE WITH THAT, Z?
>> I REALLY DO.
WE SEE THROUGH A GLASS DIMLY, PAUL SAID THAT
AND LIKE THIS IS HIS ANOINTING.
HE'S A TEACHER AND A PROPHET.
I'M NOT.
BUT SO THE TEACH IS IN THE AIR, BUT THAT
GLASS IS ROMAN GLASS.
>> JOSEPH: YES, IT IS.
>> SO YOU GUYS, I MEAN YOU'VE BEEN TO ISRAEL.
YOU KNOW, WHAT'S UP.
YOU'VE SEEN THAT ROMAN GLASS SOLD AROUND.
IT'S NOT LIKE OUR GLASS, IS IT?
IT'S THICKER.
IT'S HARDER TO SEE THROUGH.
SO WE KNOW IN PART,
WE PROPHESY IN PART.
TAKE THAT KIND OF POSTURE, BE HUMBLE, AND YOU CAN GROW.
>> YEAH, THAT'S WHAT CAME TO ME WHEN YOU WERE
SAYING THAT IS,
SOMETIMES WE PROPHESY IN PART,
AND SO YOU MIGHT NOT EVEN KNOW THE FULL PICTURE.
THE PERSON THAT YOU'RE TALKING TO MIGHT NOT
EVEN KNOW EXACTLY WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT YET,
BUT IT'S A PIECE OF THE PUZZLE.
ONE THING I WAS GOING TO ASK IS,
DO YOU EVER FEEL LIKE THE LORD SHOWS YOU SOMETHING,
BUT YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO SAY IT
TO THAT PERSON, OR HAVE YOU EVER WALKED INTO IT
WHERE YOU DID SAY IT, BUT THE LORD IS SHOWING YOU THAT
MAYBE TO INTERCEDE INTO IT?
HOW HAVE YOU LEARNED TO DISCERN THE TWO?
>> ALL THE TIME.
YOU DON'T SAY EVERYTHING YOU SEE.
YOU SEE A LOT OF THINGS YOU NEVER SAY.
BECAUSE IF YOU SAY ALL YOU SEE,
YOU'LL DESTROY PEOPLE.
GOD'S TEACHING YOU TO SEE.
I MEAN, LIKE A LOT OF PEOPLE GET SCARED.
PROPHETIC MINISTRY AND LIKE THE PROPHETIC
MINISTRY IN OUR CHURCHES IS NEXT LEVEL.
AND IT'S NOT JUST ME.
IT IS NEXT LEVEL, ISN'T IT, Z?
>> IT REALLY IS.
>> WE'RE GONNA GO VISIT, I JUST DECIDED, REBECCA.
WE'RE GOING DOWN TO VISIT.
>> I'LL HAVE YOU OVER FOR LIKE A PROPHETIC CONFERENCE
WHERE I GOT SEVERAL OF MY PROPHETIC FRIENDS IN,
IF YOU WANT TO SEE LIKE --
>> ALL THE SCARY ONES?
>> I MIGHT JUST SNEAK IN ON LIKE A SUNDAY AND JUST --
>> YEAH, YEAH, YEAH, YEAH.
>> WELL, THE WORD --
SO THE WORD OF KNOWLEDGE GETS SO CRAZY.
LIKE SO CRAZY.
BUT, UM, I THINK --
>> JOSEPH: NOT CRAZY, THOUGH, JUST BY DEFINITION.
YOU MEAN LIKE NAMES.
>> RIGHT.
>> JOSEPH: DETAILS.
>> NAMES, WHERE YOU GREW UP.
STATE YOU'RE OUT OF, YOU KNOW.
LIKE WHAT SEX YOUR BABY.
I'M TALKING --
>> JOSEPH: THAT'S WHAT YOU MEAN BY CRAZY.
>> LIKE ACCURATE.
>> ACCURATE.
>> PRECISE MIGHT BE THE RIGHT WORD.
PRECISE. PRECISE PROPHETIC WORD.
SO YOU CAN -- THAT GIFT'S ALWAYS WORKING AND PEOPLE,
YOU CAN GROW A MINISTRY WITH THAT.
YOU CAN ALSO SHRINK A MINISTRY
BECAUSE PEOPLE GET TERRIFIED.
THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO DO
WITH THAT GIFT AND THEY THINK, YOU KNOW,
IT'S LIKE, YOU KNOW, IT'S LIKE --
YOU, THE LITTLE GIRL IN THE FOURTH ROW,
YOU KNOW, STAND UP, YOU KNOW.
IT'S LIKE THEY THINK YOU'RE GOING TO DO THAT
TO THEM.
WE DON'T DO THAT TO PEOPLE RIGHT.
WE HAVE -- WE'RE GOING TO PROTECT YOU
AND LOVE YOU.
AND IF GOD SHOWS US SOMETHING THAT NEEDS
TO BE DEALT WITH LIKE THAT, WE DO IT DISCREETLY
AND IN PRIVATE.
SO THERE'S JUST -- LOVE HAS TO BE
THE MOTIVATION.
>> AMEN.
AND THEN MY OTHER QUESTION WOULD BE FOR PEOPLE WHO
ARE LISTENING AND THEY HAVE PROPHETIC GIFTING,
WHAT ARE --
WHAT IS SOME OF YOUR ADVICE?
WHAT ARE SOME YESES AND MAYBE SOME NOS, LIKE DON'T
DO THAT, THAT YOU SEE KIND OF COMMON WITH YOUNGER PEOPLE
THAT ARE OPERATING IN THE GIFTS?
>> YEAH, YOU KNOW, Z'S LIKE A HIGH-LEVEL COACH
OF THE PROPHETS.
AND HAS THIS THING THAT BRINGS, I THINK, SANITY
AND STRUCTURE TO THE PROPHETIC COMMUNITY.
I THINK IT'S A LOT OF HIS CALL,
WHO HE IS.
WHAT WOULD YOU --
WHAT WOULD YOU SAY, Z?
I WANT TO BOUNCE THAT OFF OF HIM
BECAUSE I WANT TO HEAR WHAT HE SAYS.
>> I THINK PROTOCOLS IS A BIG PART OF IT
WHERE TRAINING IS IN ORDER.
THE ONLY THING WORSE THAN NO TEACHING
IS BAD TEACHING.
AND SO IF WE'RE GOING TO REALLY HELP PEOPLE DEVELOP,
YOU HAVE TO MODEL IT.
YOU HAVE TO TRAIN THEM.
AND SO THAT'S WHY THEY HAD --
YOU NEVER HEAR OF SCHOOLS OF THE TEACHERS.
YOU NEVER HEAR OF SCHOOLS OF THE APOSTLES.
YOU NEVER HEAR ABOUT SCHOOLS OF THE EVANGELISTS.
BUT THERE WERE SCHOOLS OF THE PROPHETS
AND THE REASON IS --
>> IN THE BIBLE?
>> YEAH, IN THE BIBLE. YEAH.
AND THE REASON THIS IS, IS BECAUSE PROPHECY IS
A POWER GIFT THAT ALTERS PEOPLE'S SOUL.
LIKE, IT REALLY --
YOU CAN USE A SURGICAL BLADE TO DO HEART SURGERY
AND SAVE SOMEONE'S LIFE,
OR YOU CAN USE THAT SAME SURGICAL BLADE
TO DO HORRENDOUS THINGS AND BE A MURDERER.
>> REBECCA: YEAH.
>> AND SO YOU GOTTA CONSIDER THE GIFTING.
AND SO I REALLY APPRECIATE WHAT PROPHET BRIAN'S SAYING
WHEN HE'S TALKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW,
YOU DON'T SHARE THINGS YOU SEE ALL THE TIME
AND ALL THAT BECAUSE YOU ALSO HAVE TO HAVE
A SET OF SKILLS THAT ARE DEVELOPED.
AND ONE OF THE BIGGEST ONES, BELIEVE IT OR NOT,
IS PEOPLE SKILLS FOR PROPHETS.
PROPHETS THAT CAN JUST STAND PEOPLE UP AND KNOCK THEM DOWN,
THEY CAN DO THAT AND I THINK IT'S WONDERFUL.
YOU KNOW, WE COULD BOTH PROBABLY JOKE ABOUT THIS,
BUT THERE'S, I CALL THEM OLD TESTAMENT PROPHETS,
LIKE GUYS THAT'LL, COME IN AND THEY'LL SAY
I DON'T NEED ANY MUSIC.
THAT MUSIC IS JUST --
>> WHAT THE --
>> YEAH.
>> THAT'S THE DEVIL.
[ LAUGHTER ]
[ OVERLAPPING TALK ]
>> I BIND YOU, GO BACK TO THE PIT.
>> REBECCA: THAT'S A FIRST.
>> BUT YOU RECOGNIZE
THAT IN THE PROPHETIC IS MANY TIMES
PEOPLE GET, YOU KNOW, THEY'LL BE LIKE
OLD TESTAMENT PROPHETS.
I'VE BEEN IN MEETINGS WHERE A GUY WILL SAY
I DON'T NEED ANY OF THAT MUSIC.
THAT'S JUST SOULISH.
I DON'T NEED THIS.
I DON'T NEED THAT.
AND THEN HE WILL READ PEOPLE'S MAIL TO THE BONE
LIKE WITH NO FILTER,
NO CARE FOR THEM, NO ANYTHING.
AND I'VE SEEN A FEW MEETINGS LIKE THAT AND I REALIZED
I DIDN'T WANT TO BE A PART OF THAT.
I DIDN'T WANT TO BE THAT WAY.
WHEN YOU LOOK, THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN
THE OLD TESTAMENT AND THE NEW TESTAMENT,
AND IT'S NOT A BLANK PAGE IN OUR BIBLE.
THERE'S THIS GUY WHO CAME NAMED JESUS,
AND HE CHANGED HOW WE ACCESS THE FATHER.
AND THAT APPLIES TO THE GIFTS.
THAT APPLIES TO PROPHETS AND ALL OF IT.
>> WAIT, CAN SOMEONE GET THAT THING OUT OF HERE?
>> IT NEEDS TO BE MINISTERED TO.
>> YEAH.
>> THAT THING IS OUT OF THE BOOK OF REVELATION.
>> SOMEONE KILL IT.
>> IT'S ON TOP OF THE LENS.
>> THIS IS GOING TO BE A GREAT OUTTAKE.
>> TV BLOOPERS, FOR SURE.
>> THIS IS THE BEST BLOOPER WE'VE EVER HAD.
>> THE REBECCA WEISS PODCAST, FOUR-WHEEL DRIVE.
>> I LIKED THE STALLIONS.
I WAS LIKE, THAT'S THE NEW NAME.
[ LAUGHTER ]
>> WE'LL SEND A GROUP TEXT AFTER WITH THAT NAME.
[ LAUGHTER ]
>> ALL RIGHT, ESTER, JUST COUNT US IN WHEN WE'RE GOOD.
YOU JUST CONTINUE WITH YOUR THOUGHTS.
>> OKAY. GREAT.
>> I WANT TO MAKE SURE EVERYTHING'S CLEAR.
>> THAT WAS THE BEST PART OF THE PODCAST.
>> I KNOW. YEAH.
>> I WOULD LEAVE IT ALL IN.
>> I LOVE THAT KIND OF STUFF, TOO.
ARE WE GOOD?
ALL RIGHT.
JUST COUNT HIM BACK IN,
AND THEN YOU CAN JUST TAKE IT AWAY
FROM WHEREVER YOU WERE.
>> OKAY.
AND SO WHAT NEEDS TO BE MODELED IS THE NEW TESTAMENT,
NEW COVENANT VERSION.
YOU KNOW, IT SAYS IN HEBREWS, LIKE CHAPTER 7,
IF THE PRIESTHOOD CHANGES,
THEN THE LAW HAS TO CHANGE.
AND SO WHAT HAS HAPPENED IS WE'RE UNDER
A DIFFERENT COVENANT TODAY.
AND SO WHAT THAT MEANS IS EVEN THE GIFTS,
THE WAY WE FUNCTION, SAME HOLY SPIRIT,
SAME GOD ALMIGHTY.
BUT NOW CHRIST JESUS IS HERE AND WHEN WE PROPHESY,
WE NEED TO CARE FOR HIS BODY.
WE NEED TO CARE FOR PEOPLE.
YOU KNOW, AND PEOPLE THINK THAT PROPHECY
IS JUST ALL ABOUT, YOU KNOW,
GOING AT PEOPLE AND REALLY JUST
SHARP, ACCURATE AND DOING THINGS,
BUT REALLY, EPHESIANS 4:11 AND 12,
IT GETS INTO IT AND IT SAYS IT'S FOR EDIFYING
AND EQUIPPING.
THAT IS WHAT WE'RE REALLY HERE FOR,
AS OFFICE GIFTS.
SO ANYWAY, I'M SAYING ALL THAT TO SAY
TRAINING PEOPLE, TO GO BACK TO YOUR ORIGINAL QUESTION, REBECCA,
TRAINING PEOPLE IS SO NEEDED RIGHT NOW,
SO THAT'S SOMETHING I'M DEVELOPING.
I'VE BEEN TALKING WITH PROPHET BRIAN ABOUT IT,
DEVELOPING A SCHOOL OF THE PROPHETS;
REALLY GETTING PEOPLE SO THEY CAN HAVE
HEALTHY PROPHECY WITH GLARING ACCURACY,
JUST WIELDING THAT WEAPON PROPERLY.
AND I'LL JUST ADD A LITTLE MORE TO THIS
AND THEN WE CAN KEEP GOING,
BUT ONE OF THE THINGS YOU RECOGNIZE IS
IN THE NEW TESTAMENT,
AGABUS MISSED A POINT.
HE DID.
AND PEOPLE SAY IN THE NEW TESTAMENT
YOU DON'T MISS IF YOU'RE A PROPHET.
AGABUS TOLD PAUL, YOU WILL BE BOUND BY THE JEWS,
BUT HE WAS BOUND BY THE ROMANS.
BUT THIS IS THE SAME GUY THAT PREDICTED
A FAMINE WAS COMING IN ACTS CHAPTER 11.
HE SAID A FAMINE IS COMING, AND THE CHURCH
RESPONDED TO THAT, SO HE'S VERY ACCURATE.
AND THEY RESPONDED IN FAITH.
BUT THE POINT I'M MAKING IS REALIZING
THE OLD TESTAMENT IS DIFFERENT THAN THE NEW.
AND THE WAY PROPHECY WORKS IN THE OLD TESTAMENT,
SAME SPIRIT, NEW APPLICATION.
>> NEW COVENANT.
AND WHEN WE HAVE THAT FOUNDATION RIGHT,
THEN WE'RE GOING TO TREAT PEOPLE
THE WAY JESUS TREATS THEM.
WE'RE GOING TO TREAT PEOPLE
THE WAY THAT GOD ALMIGHTY WOULD TREAT PEOPLE,
AND WE'RE GOING TO DO IT FROM THE SPIRIT OF FAITH.
AND, YES, IF YOU GET A REBUKE OR CALL THINGS OUT AND DO THAT,
YES, THERE IS A PLACE FOR THAT.
BUT REALLY IT IS TO BUILD UP AND EDIFY,
AND THAT'S THE ETIQUETTE WE HAVE TO TEACH
UPCOMING PEOPLE THAT WANT TO HEAR
THE VOICE OF GOD.
>> AND THE ONLY WAY THAT YOU CAN RECEIVE THAT
IS YOU HAVE TO SPEND TIME WITH GOD.
>> JOSEPH: YES.
>> IN THAT PLACE OF PRAYER
YOU RECEIVE HIS HEART FOR PEOPLE.
>> JOSEPH: YES.
>> AND IF YOU DON'T HAVE THAT YOU ARE GOING
TO DO MORE DAMAGE THAN GOOD.
>> JOSEPH: TRUE. YEAH.
>> HOW DO YOU KNOW LIKE WHEN TO SHARE SOMETHING
VERSUS NOT TO SHARE SOMETHING?
DO YOU FEEL THAT UNCTION LIKE IN YOUR SPIRIT,
LIKE, JUST HOLD OFF?
LIKE, WHAT DO YOU -- HOW DO YOU KNOW?
>> YOU KNOW, THE BIBLE SAYS
THE SPIRIT OF THE PROPHETS
IS SUBJECT TO THE PROPHETS.
SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO SAY ANYTHING, RIGHT?
PEOPLE WILL BE LIKE, GOD MADE ME DO THIS.
I'M LIKE, YEAH, THE SPIRIT OF THE PROPHET
IS SUBJECT TO THE PROPHET.
>> JOSEPH: YES.
>> RIGHT?
YOU CAN RELEASE OR HOLD ON TO WHAT YOU HAVE,
BUT YOU KNOW.
LIKE I GO BACK TO FOLLOW
AFTER LOVE ALL THE TIME, RIGHT?
WHENEVER I KNOW I'M TO PROPHESY, I'LL FEEL.
THAT'S THE WAY IT WORKS WITH ME.
I FEEL A DIVINE FLOW OF LOVE.
IT'S LIKE THERE'S LOVE GOING TOWARDS THIS PERSON
OR THIS PERSON STICKS OUT
IN A SPECIAL WAY.
UH, SOMETIMES I'LL SEE LIKE, I DON'T KNOW,
I'LL SEE LIGHT ON THEM.
I JUST KNOW.
AND THEN SOMETIMES I SEE THINGS
AND I KNOW THAT I DON'T HAVE A FULL REVELATION
OF WHAT I'M SEEING YET.
SO I TRY TO WAIT TILL I KNOW EXACTLY WHAT I'M TO SAY.
NOW THERE ARE TIMES I KNOW NOTHING
EXCEPT I'M TO PROPHESY TO THIS PERSON
AND I GO BY FAITH.
>> JOSEPH: YES.
>> AND I'LL SAY STAND UP, I HAVE A WORD FOR YOU,
AND WHEN THEY STAND UP, THE WORD COMES.
SO YOU PROPHESY IN PROPORTION TO YOUR FAITH.
ALL RIGHT. THE WAY YOU BUILD YOUR FAITH UP
IS THE -- IT REALLY IS THE WRITTEN WORD OF GOD.
ALL RIGHT.
MY PROPHETIC FLOW,
THE MORE I READ THE BIBLE,
THE MORE I LISTEN TO THE BIBLE,
THE MORE I'M AROUND STRAIGHT BIBLE,
THE STRONGER AND THE CRAZIER, THE WORD OF KNOWLEDGE
COMES IN MY LIFE.
BECAUSE FAITH STARTS WHERE THE WORD IS
AND IF YOU DON'T HAVE THAT, YOU CAN'T PROPHESY.
>> JOSEPH: THAT'S RIGHT.
>> OR YOU MIGHT JUST BE FLOWING OUT OF
A RAW GIFT, BUT THE WORD WON'T BE BEHIND IT.
>> JOSEPH: OH.
>> YOU KNOW? A RAW GIFT WILL WORK AND A RAW GIFT,
EVEN A WRONG SPIRIT CAN COME UPON A WRONG --
A RAW PROPHETIC GIFTING.
>> JOSEPH: YES.
>> WHICH IS AN ODD WAY TO EXPLAIN IT,
BUT LIKE THE MEDIUMS AND THE PSYCHICS, THEY PROBABLY ARE
BENT WITH SOME NATURAL BEND TOWARDS PROPHECY,
RIGHT, AND A DEMONIC SPIRIT FILLS.
>> EXACTLY.
>> I LOVE WHAT HE WAS SAYING EARLIER ABOUT
JESUS BEING THE PERSON.
IT'S NOT A PAGE BETWEEN THE OLD AND THE NEW TESTAMENT.
IT'S A PERSON.
>> COME ON.
>> THAT'S A GREAT WAY TO SAY IT.
>> JOSEPH: THAT'S SO TRUE.
>> I'M LEARNING STUFF WHEN Z'S TALKING.
OH, I REMEMBER I WAS LIKE TICKED OFF.
I WAS IN MY 20S.
YOU EVER BEEN ANGRY?
>> OH, YEAH.
>> NO, NEVER.
>> VERY ANGRY LIKE --
>> YES, I'VE BEEN ANGRY.
[ LAUGHTER ]
>> KIND OF A YOUNG MAN, RIGHT, AND I WAS
TALKING TO MY PASTOR AND I'M LIKE JOHN THE BAPTIST
WOULDN'T PUT UP WITH THIS CRAP, YOU KNOW.
AND HE'S LIKE, BRIAN --
I DON'T KNOW I CAN SAY THAT ON HERE, I'M SORRY.
>> REBECCA: NO, YOU CAN.
>> OKAY.
SO BRIAN IS LIKE -- OR HE'S LIKE, BRIAN,
DO YOU WANT TO BE JOHN THE BAPTIST
OR DO YOU WANT TO BE JESUS?
>> SO GOOD.
>> AND I'M LIKE, I WANT TO BE JOHN THE BAPTIST
RIGHT NOW. NO.
I'M LIKE, BUT HE WAS SAYING YOU DO IT,
BUT YOU DO IT WITH A SPIRIT OF JESUS, RIGHT.
LIKE WHENEVER YOU'RE CORRECTING,
WHENEVER YOU'RE PROPHESYING,
WHATEVER YOU'RE DOING, NEEDS TO COME TO THE PERSON.
>> AND I THINK A GREAT FILTER TOO FOR PEOPLE THAT
ARE WATCHING THAT ARE WONDERING IS WHAT
JOSEPH JUST SAID, IS THIS GOING TO
EDIFY AND EQUIP, BECAUSE IF IT'S NOT
GOING TO DO ONE OF THOSE THINGS,
MAYBE YOU JUST SHOULDN'T SAY IT.
MAYBE THE LORD IS SHOWING YOU SOMETHING TO PRAY INTO
OR TO STEWARD.
>> YEAH.
>> WELL, THIS HAS HAPPENED TO US.
THIS IS WHY I THINK WE'RE ASKING IT IS BECAUSE
WE'VE HAD MOMENTS WHEN WE'VE MADE THIS MISTAKE
WHERE GOD HAS SHOWED US SOMETHING.
>> JONATHAN: DON'T BE THIS VULNERABLE, REBECCA.
>> WE'VE ALL BEEN. NOBODY WANTS TO HEAR IT.
>> IN OUR PASSION WE WERE LIKE, DO, DO, DO, DO,
AND IT JUST DAMAGES THE PERSON OR THE SITUATION.
AND YOU'RE LIKE, OOH.
>> OH, WAIT.
BUT GOD SHOWED ME THAT.
BUT THEN WE HAD LEARNED THE LESSON,
IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO DELIVER IT.
>> YOU GUYS, LIKE
I WAS PASTORING, BELIEVE IT OR NOT AT ONE TIME --
>> THAT'S TERRIBLE.
>> YEAH, YEAH.
[ LAUGHTER ]
>> IT'S A SPECIAL GRACE FOR PROPHETS WHO PASTOR,
BUT I WAS DOING SOME COUNSELING
WITH THIS COUPLE ONE TIME,
AND THEY CAME IN AND THEY WERE LIKE,
YOU KNOW, YOU ALWAYS SAY YOU HOLD STUFF BACK.
AND THEY SAID, WOULD YOU PLEASE?
NO, NO, REALLY.
THEY WERE PLEADING WITH ME.
PLEASE, TELL US EVERYTHING.
AND I WAS YOUNG AND DUMB ENOUGH TO GO,
OH, ALL RIGHT.
AND SO I GOT A WHITEBOARD OUT
AND I DREW THEIR WHOLE LIFE ON THE WHITEBOARD.
AND, I MEAN, I LIKE PEELED THEM LIKE AN ONION.
AND WHEN I WAS DONE I WAS LIKE,
SO, YOU KNOW, YOU GOOD?
AND THEY WERE LIKE WEEPING.
AND THEY WERE REALLY DAMAGED.
>> OH, NO.
>> AND I LEARNED AND THERE'S A NUMBER OF TIMES
LIKE THAT I'VE LEARNED
YOU DON'T -- YOU DON'T DO THAT.
AND THERE'S A SAYING, YOU KNOW,
MATURITY IS RESTRAINT.
THAT'S A GOOD POINT.
JUST BECAUSE YOU CAN, DOESN'T MEAN YOU SHOULD, RIGHT?
AND SO WHEN YOU'RE IN THESE SPACES,
THE BEST THING WE CAN DO TO HELP PEOPLE
IS LEAD THEM TO THE BIBLE,
YOU KNOW, KEEP RAISING THEM UP.
THE BEST FORM OF DELIVERANCE
IS ONGOING HEALTHY TEACHING.
SO YOU GET THAT FOUNDATION THERE, BUT WITH PROPHECY,
YOU KNOW, I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE WANT TO DO
THE PULL A BUNNY OUT OF A HAT TRICK FOR PEOPLE,
AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, AND PROPHET BRIAN
COULD REALLY PROBABLY DOVETAIL ON THIS,
BUT WHEN YOU BEGIN TO GET IN THAT SPACE OF
I WANT TO WOW THE PEOPLE,
OR I WANT TO WOW PEOPLE WITH MY GIFT,
THAT IS, I THINK, SOMETHING THAT THE LORD NEEDS TO
GRIND OUT OF A PROPHET OR SOMEBODY IN THAT SPACE.
BECAUSE THEN HE CAN REALLY TRUST YOU WITH IT,
WHERE IF YOU'RE TRYING TO PULL BUNNIES OUT OF A HAT
TO SAY LOOK WHAT I CAN DO,
LOOK WHAT I CAN DO, LOOK WHAT I CAN DO,
AND NOT THAT THAT'S EVIL OR WRONG,
BUT IF THAT STARTS TO MOVE YOU, YOU KNOW,
BECAUSE YOU WANT THE ROAR OF THE PEOPLE,
IT WILL, UM -- I KNOW THAT THE LORD SENT ME
TO THE BACK 40 FOR TWO AND A HALF YEARS,
AND JUST CHISELED ON ME.
AND I REALLY MEAN THAT SINCERELY LIKE
HE'S LIKE, YOU SIT DOWN.
IF YOU CAN HEAR MY VOICE,
YOU KNOW, I'M TELLING YOU TO SIT DOWN.
AND I DID.
I SAT FOR TWO AND A HALF YEARS
JUST NOT KNOWING WHAT HE WANTED ME TO DO NEXT.
AND I HAD TO SIT.
AND I WATCHED ALL OF OUR LIKE FOLLOWERS
AND PARTNERS, EVERYTHING JUST WENT AWAY.
AND I WAS NOT ALLOWED TO ACTIVATE THAT
AND I JUST SAT AND SAT AND SAT.
>> AND TRUSTED GOD.
>> OH.
>> YOU HAD TO TRUST GOD.
>> OH.
AND WE WENT THROUGH ALL KINDS OF TRIALS
THAT ARE JUST EXCEEDINGLY PAINFUL THINGS
THAT WE WENT THROUGH.
I KNOW PROPHET BRIAN'S BEEN THROUGH THE MEAT GRINDER,
BUT THE REASON THAT GOD DOES THAT,
NOT BECAUSE HE'S TRYING TO PUNISH YOU, HURT YOU, ALL THAT,
BUT IF THERE'S A TRUE PROPHETIC ANOINTING ON YOU,
THERE IS GOING TO BE SOME VERY SERIOUS REFINING.
SO WHEN THE VOICE OF GOD COMES OUT OF YOU
WITH THAT SPIRIT OF FAITH,
AND YOU'RE SPEAKING FOR GOD,
YOU BETTER BE ON POINT AND IT BETTER BE ABOUT
LOVING THE PEOPLE, AND I'LL SHARE THIS ONE LITTLE POINT.
YEARS AND YEARS AGO,
I WAS IN MEETINGS WHERE I WAS
YOU KNOW, JUST PROPHESYING ONE AFTER ANOTHER,
HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE, RIGHT, ONE AFTER ANOTHER.
BOOM, BOOM, BOOM, BOOM, BOOM, BOOM.
AND I HAD PEOPLE COME TO ME AND SAY, I'VE NEVER SEEN
ANYTHING LIKE THAT, LIKE THAT'S JUST SO AMAZING.
HOW DO YOU DO THAT STUFF, YOU KNOW.
AND I THOUGHT, MAN, THAT'S PRETTY GOOD.
THAT'S PRETTY GOOD.
AND THEN THE SPIRITUAL FATHER LOOKED AT ME
AND HE'S LIKE, BUT I'M SO NOT IMPRESSED WITH YOU.
I WAS LIKE, WHAT?
AND I THOUGHT I WAS DOING GOOD,
LIKE YOU LIKE, HUG ME AND THEN SLAP ME.
WHAT IS THIS?
AND WHEN IT WAS OVER WITH HE SAID, YOU ARE NO GOOD AT THIS
UNTIL YOU LET GOD LOVE PEOPLE THROUGH YOU,
YOU KNOW, AS IF YOU ARE JESUS,
YOU KNOW, LOVING THEM.
OF COURSE WE'RE NOT JESUS.
I'M JUST SAYING WE LET THE SPIRIT OF GOD LOVE THROUGH US
AND THAT IS THE POINT THAT YOU HAVE TO GET TO.
AND THAT INCLUDES WHEN YOU REBUKE.
BECAUSE THERE'S BEEN TIMES I'VE POINTED AT PEOPLE
ON A BALCONY AND THE LORD WILL SAY
YOU TELL THIS MAN STOP WHAT HE'S DOING RIGHT NOW
OR HE'S GOING TO DIE.
AND THOSE THINGS COME, THOUGH OUT OF A PLACE OF LOVE
RATHER THAN A PLACE OF I'M GOING TO REALLY,
YOU KNOW, SAY THIS.
SO ANYWAY, I THOUGHT I'D JUST SHARE.
>> YEAH.
THE TEMPTATION IS ALWAYS THERE
IF A PROPHET HAS A STRONG GIFT,
TO WOW THE PEOPLE WITH IT.
>> JOSEPH: AND THERE'S A PLACE FOR IT.
>> WELL, THE WORD OF KNOWLEDGE GETS THEIR ATTENTION, RIGHT?
AND SO PAUL WROTE IT,
THAT THEY'LL COME IN THE CHURCH, BE ALL PROPHECY.
THE UNBELIEVER WILL COME IN AND BE CONVINCED
>> SAY TRULY GOD IS AMONG YOU.
>> JOSEPH: THAT'S RIGHT.
>> HE'S TALKING ABOUT WORD OF KNOWLEDGE.
IT'LL PEEL THE PAINT OFF THE WALLS.
THERE'S A PLACE FOR IT.
YOU'VE GOT TO BE CAREFUL BECAUSE LIKE ANYTHING,
WHEN YOU START HAVING SUCCESS IN IT, RIGHT,
THERE'S A FLESHLY APPETITE THAT WANTS TO DO THAT.
AND YOU CAN WANT TO DO THAT ALL THE TIME.
AND IF YOU HAVE THAT GIFT, YOU CAN WALK UP
AND WANT TO JUST LOOSE IT
EVERY TIME YOU TAKE A MIC OR A PULPIT
WHERE MAYBE GOD'S TRYING TO TEACH PEOPLE SOMETHING.
HE'S GOT THIS LITTLE THING CALLED THE BIBLE
HE LIKES TO OPEN UP, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN,
INSTRUCT PEOPLE WITH.
SO YOU REALLY HAVE TO KEEP THAT CRUCIFIED.
>> JOSEPH: SO GOOD.
>> ESPECIALLY AS IT GROWS, PEOPLE ALWAYS WANT TO KNOW
WHEN THEY SEE PROPHETS OPERATING LIKE THAT,
MY PROPHETIC MENTOR PROBABLY HAS
THE STRONGEST WORD OF KNOWLEDGE GIFT
I'VE EVER SEEN ANYWHERE.
>> JOSEPH: LEGENDARY, ACTUALLY.
>> LEGENDARY WORD OF KNOWLEDGE GIFT.
SO I'LL BE TRAVELING WITH HIM AND LIKE HE'LL BE THIRSTY.
WE CAN'T GET A STEWARDESS' ATTENTION AND HE'LL BE LIKE,
MARIA, DAUGHTER OF REBECCA MARRIED TO ALFONSO,
BRING ME A WATER.
AND THEY'LL BE LIKE, WHO ARE YOU?
HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT?
IT'S LIKE, IT DOES NOT MATTER.
I'M THIRSTY.
BRING ME THE WATER.
AND THEN HE'LL MINISTER TO THEM LATER.
BUT HE OPERATES LIKE THAT.
SO IT'S SUCH A CRAZY GIFT AND NOW Z GETS
LIKE THAT AT TIMES.
A LOT OF US CAN GET LIKE THAT AT TIMES
THIS GUY LIVES THERE ALL DAY EVERY DAY.
ALL DAY EVERY DAY.
AND SO TO TURN IT OFF
YOU HAVE TO LIKE TURN IT OFF.
HE WATCHES MOVIES BECAUSE HE'S JUST SEEING, HEARING,
ALL THE TIME.
HE'S IN THE -- YOU KNOW,
HE'S ALWAYS IN THE HEAVENS.
IT'S LIKE COME, COME PLAY, AND THE PLANE IS FLYING AWAY.
THEY'RE NOT GONNA WAIT ON US.
IT'S LIKE, COME.
YOU KNOW, HE'S LOST ALL THE TIME.
SO PEOPLE WANT TO KNOW ABOUT THAT.
THAT'S THE THING THAT THEY WANT TO KNOW ABOUT
ALL THE TIME.
AND HE'LL ALWAYS STOP.
AND THIS IS HIS FAMOUS, YOU KNOW,
HE'S FROM COLOMBIA, BUT IT'S ALWAYS LIKE THIS.
IT'S LIKE, WHAT IS YOUR --
WHAT IS YOUR MOTIVATION?
WHY DO YOU WANT TO DO THAT?
WHAT IS THE PURPOSE?
WHAT IS THE MOTIVATION?
WHY DO YOU WANT TO KNOW THEIR NAMES?
RIGHT?
WHY DO YOU WANT TO KNOW THEIR ADDRESSES?
BECAUSE IT'S ABOUT MINISTERING TO THEM
AND LOVING THEM,
NOT WOWING SOMEONE.
>> NOT SOMETHING YOU POCKET GLORY FOR YOURSELF,
BUT GIVING GLORY TO GOD.
>> JOSEPH: SO GOOD.
>> BRIAN: THAT'S RIGHT.
>> SO THAT'S WHY GOD BRINGS YOU THROUGH THAT CHISELING
BECAUSE HE WANTS YOUR HEART TO BE IN THE RIGHT PLACE.
NOT ONLY JUST FOR THE PEOPLE, BUT FOR YOURSELF.
>> AND HERE'S THE THING WITH GIFTS, UNLESS YOU'RE
THE MOST SEASONED PROPHET OR WORD OF KNOWLEDGE GUY,
A STRONG GIFT THAT'S ALWAYS OPERATING.
THEY STILL MAY OPERATE IN THAT VERY HIGH
AND IT'LL BE THERE FOR A WHILE, AND FOR SOME PEOPLE,
THEN IT'S NOT OPERATING.
>> JOSEPH: THAT'S RIGHT.
>> AND SO THEY START DOING SOME KIND OF SHENANIGANS.
>> REBECCA: YEAH.
>> THAT'S THE ONLY TIME -- I WOULD CALL THAT A FALSE PROPHET.
THAT'S THE FIRST FALSE PROPHET
I'VE EVER MET.
>> KNOWING WHAT THEY'RE DOING.
>> AND I'VE MET A LOT OF WRONG PROPHETS.
>> YEAH.
>> RIGHT? IT'S ONE THING TO BE A WRONG PROPHET,
YOU GOT SOMETHING WRONG.
A FALSE PROPHET, I THINK, IS SOMEONE THAT
INTENTIONALLY DECEIVES.
>> JOSEPH: YES.
>> VERY DIFFERENT, RIGHT?
THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT ARE WRONG
GIVING A PROPHETIC WORD,
GOOD PEOPLE TRYING TO HELP SOMEBODY.
YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?
>> JONATHAN: IT HAPPENS.
>> IT HAPPENS THEY'RE LEARNING.
WHATEVER, IT HAPPENS. IT'S LIFE.
ALL RIGHT.
THAT'S WHY IT'S WRITTEN IN THE NEW TESTAMENT
LET ONE PROPHESY, TWO OR THREE JUDGE FOR SAFETY.
UM, BUT THAT'S A WRONG PROPHET.
A FALSE PROPHET IS SOMEONE THAT COMES TO MANIPULATE,
TO GET GLORY FOR THEMSELVES, OR MONEY OR SOMETHING SLEAZY,
OR THEY JUST -- YOU KNOW, THE GIFT ISN'T WORKING
AND THEY'RE MANUFACTURING IT.
SO THAT'S A PAINFUL THING, BUT THAT
UNWHOLESOME APPETITE FOR ATTENTION GOT THEM THERE.
YOU GOT TO KILL THAT APPETITE.
>> AND THE CHURCH IS SO QUICK TO JUDGE,
BUT JUST BECAUSE SOMEONE ISN'T ALWAYS
100% ACCURATE DOESN'T MEAN YOU NEED TO
THROW THEM OUT COMPLETELY,
AND THAT'S WHERE PEOPLE MAKE THAT MISTAKE.
>> THEY THREW AGABUS OUT FOR PROPHESYING
THAT PAUL WOULD BE BOUND BY THE JEWS,
WHEN HE WAS BOUND BY THE ROMANS.
AND I KNOW IT'S A MINOR THING,
BUT IF WE'RE GOING TO HOLD THAT STANDARD
THE WAY A LOT OF PEOPLE DO,
THEN AGABUS WAS A FALSE PROPHET --
>> REBECCA YEAH.
>> IN THE NEW TESTAMENT.
>> AND THAT'S WE HAVE TO BE LIKE SOMEONE WHO'S JUST
MADE A MISTAKE VERSUS SOMEONE WHO'S FALSE.
>> YES.
>> YEAH.
I DON'T KNOW WHY PEOPLE LOVE TO -- AND LISTEN,
I'VE MET A WHOLE LOT MORE FALSE PEOPLE THAN I'VE
EVER MET FALSE PROPHETS.
>> YEAH.
>> GOOD WORD.
>> THEY'RE LIKE WHY DID MY WORD NOT COME TO PASS?
THE PROPHET SAID IT.
I'M LIKE, WELL, YOU GOT HIGH FOR THE LAST THREE YEARS.
[ LAUGHTER ]
>> HE JUST WANTED BIG MINISTRY AND ALL THAT.
YOU'VE BEEN HIGH AND DRUNK EVERY WEEKEND.
>> THAT'S A GOOD THING, TOO,
IS THAT SOME PEOPLE WILL GET A WORD AND THEN
THINK THAT IT'S JUST GONNA AUTOMATICALLY HAPPEN,
BUT IT'S LIKE YOU HAVE TO STEWARD THE WORD
OVER YOUR LIFE.
YOU DON'T JUST LIKE HIDE IT AWAY AND JUST CROSS YOUR FINGERS
AND WAIT FOR IT TO HAPPEN.
>> YEAH.
WELL, EVEN ELIJAH WAS CALLED BY GOD
TO FINISH A FEW THINGS.
HE DIDN'T IN HIS LIFETIME.
AND HE HAD THE WORD OF THE LORD TO DO CERTAIN THINGS.
BUT IT TURNED OVER TO JEHU, AND IT TURNED OVER TO ELISHA
BECAUSE HE DIDN'T DO IT.
SO THAT, AGAIN, JUST GIVES THE PRECEDENT
THAT JUST BECAUSE YOU GET A WORD FROM GOD,
IT DOESN'T MEAN IT'S AUTOMATICALLY GOING TO
COME TO PASS.
HE NEEDS COOPERATION AND FAITH TO WORK WITH THAT.
THAT'S A GOOD POINT, REBECCA.
>> THERE'S TWO THINGS I WANT TO COVER
BEFORE WE END TODAY.
SO I'M GOING TO JUMP IN --
>> REBECCA: WE'RE ENDING?
>> NO, BUT YOU KNOW, RELATIVELY SPEAKING.
I WANT TO HEAR WHAT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT BEFORE
WE STARTED ROLLING.
>> JOSEPH: OKAY.
>> AND THEN I ALSO WANT TO GET INTO THE PROPHETIC TIME
THAT WE'RE LIVING IN RIGHT NOW.
>> OKAY, JONATHAN.
>> AS IT PERTAINS TO ISRAEL BECAUSE REALLY
THAT'S GOD'S TIME PEACE AND AS WE LOOK AT ISRAEL,
WE COULD SEE THE WORLD EVENTS UNFOLD.
>> BRIAN: YEAH.
>> SO REMIND ME WHAT THE THING IS.
>> JOSEPH: YEAH, YEAH.
I WROTE A BOOK CALLED, SPIRIT OF ELIJAH.
THE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH.
AND WHAT THE WHOLE TOPIC ABOUT IT IS,
IS REALLY GENERATIONAL MERGING,
BRINGING THE YOUNG AND THE OLD TOGETHER;
TURNING THE HEARTS OF THE FATHERS TO THE CHILDREN.
BUT THE REASON IS BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, I TALKED WITH A GUY
NAMED GEORGE BARNA, RIGHT, WE'RE HAVING THIS --
>> BRIAN: YEAH.
I'M DOING AN INTERVIEW WITH HIM,
I'M TALKING, AND I STARTED ASKING HIM ABOUT
GENERATIONAL CHANGES OR MOVES OF GOD AND HOW
THINGS START OUT GOOD, AND THEN THEY KIND OF
DON'T END GOOD.
WHAT'S THAT ABOUT?
>> IT HAPPENS A LOT.
>> IT DOES. IT DOES.
AND THERE'S SUCH A LACK OF
PASSING THINGS ON PROPERLY TO THE NEXT GENERATION,
AND THERE'S A WHOLE LOT I COULD GET INTO WITH THAT,
BUT THE SIMPLE VERSION IS THIS.
EVERY MOVEMENT OR MINISTRY OR WHATEVER,
STARTS OUT IN A BIRTHING PHASE.
SUPER EXCITING, THEY'RE FIGURING STUFF OUT,
AND THEN IT MOVES FROM THERE TO A DEVELOPMENT PHASE,
WHERE SUDDENLY THEY'RE KIND OF FIGURING STUFF OUT,
THEY'RE GROWING, THEY'RE DOING STUFF.
THEY'RE WALKING IN A NEW REVELATION,
LIKE A NEW WINESKIN TYPE OF SCENARIO,
SOMETHING NEW FOR THEIR GENERATION.
YOU KNOW, IT'S --
YOU KNOW, WAVES THAT COME HIT THE SHORE
MIGHT BE A NEW FORM OF A WAVE, BUT IT'S ALL
THE SAME WATER, RIGHT?
IT'S THE HOLY GHOST.
BUT WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT THIS,
IT GOES FROM THAT,
THEN IT FINALLY GETS TO A POINT WHERE
IT'S THE MATURE PHASE.
SO YOU GO FROM BIRTHING, INFANCY, TO DEVELOPMENT
WHERE A REVELATION IS REALLY GROWING,
AND SUDDENLY YOU GET TO A MATURE PHASE.
NOW THE MATURE PHASE IS THE MOST DANGEROUS PHASE
FOR ANY MOVEMENT BECAUSE NOW THEY HAVE THE TEMPTATION TO
RATHER THAN LOOK TO THE FUTURE, TO EMPHASIZE THE PAST
MORE THAN THE FUTURE.
THEY LOOK AND THEY TELL STORIES ABOUT THE PAST
MORE THAN THEY DO WHERE THEY'RE GOING.
WHEN THAT BEGINS TO HAPPEN,
IT STARTS TO ARC INTO DECLINE.
AND WHEN IT GOES INTO DECLINE,
WHAT HAPPENS IS TYPICALLY THE REVELATION THAT WAS
FOUGHT FOR AND BUILT, COMES TO THIS MATURE PHASE
AND IT BECOMES INSTITUTIONALIZED.
WHAT DO I MEAN BY THAT?
I MEAN WHAT WAS ONCE A LIVING, MOVING THING
THAT GOD CALLED TO HAVE IN THE EARTH
TURNS INTO AN INSTITUTION,
AND SAY WE HAVE ALL OF OUR RULES.
THIS IS WHY WE DO WHAT WE DO,
AND THAT'S NOT WRONG OR EVIL.
BUT SUDDENLY IT JUST BECOMES KIND OF CONCRETED THAT WAY.
WHEN THAT HAPPENS TYPICALLY DECLINE STARTS
BECAUSE ALL OF IT GETS TURNED OVER TO
BOY INSTRUCTORS.
I THINK 1 CORINTHIANS 4 TALKS ABOUT
THOUGH YOU HAVE 10,000 BOY INSTRUCTORS,
YOU HAVE NOT MANY FATHERS.
THE GREEK CALLS THEM BOY INSTRUCTORS.
SO WHAT I'M GETTING AT IS,
I BELIEVE GOD IS SAYING IN THIS GENERATION
WHAT WE NEED TO LOOK AT AND BECOME STUDENTS OF,
WHICH IS THE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH,
HOW DO WE MAINTAIN A MOVEMENT,
KEEP THE REVELATION ALIVE AND DELIVER TO THE NEXT
GENERATION WITHOUT SEEING IT GO TO DECLINE
AND COMPLETELY LOSING EVERYTHING
EVERYBODY FOUGHT FOR?
AND THAT'S WHERE THE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH
COMES IN TO TURN THE HEARTS OF THE FATHERS
BACK TO THE CHILDREN AND THE CHILDREN
BACK TO THE FATHERS.
SO IN THAT MOMENT RIGHT AS YOU'RE GOING TO
BEGIN TO DECLINE,
THERE'S A SCRIPTURE IN PROVERBS 20, VERSE 29,
AND IT SAYS THIS:
IT SAYS THAT THE GLORY OF YOUNG MEN
IS THEIR STRENGTH.
THE GLORY OF OLD MEN IS THEIR GRAY HAIR.
OKAY, I LIKE TO SAY WHAT ABOUT NO HAIR?
YEAH, YEAH.
AND SO YOU ASKED THE QUESTION,
WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?
WHAT DOES IT MEAN FOR YOUNG MEN STRENGTH,
OLD MEN GRAY HAIR?
IT MEANS STRENGTH IS EXCHANGED FOR WISDOM;
WISDOM IS EXCHANGED FOR STRENGTH AND ABILITY.
AND WHEN WE GET THIS FIGURED OUT AND THE HEARTS OF THE
FATHERS ARE THE CHILDREN, THE HEARTS OF THE CHILDREN
OF THE FATHERS,
THIS DECLINE WILL NOT BE A DECLINE.
IT WILL MAINTAIN A REVELATION.
IT MAY NOT LOOK LIKE THE FATHERS
WHO PLANTED IT,
BUT IT WILL BE TURNED OVER TO ANOTHER WINESKIN
THAT WILL CARRY WHAT THEY STARTED.
YOU KNOW. LIKE BIBLE NUMBERS ARE 30, 60, HUNDREDFOLD.
YOU HEAR THAT IN SCRIPTURE OF GROWTH.
A LOT OF PEOPLE PLATEAU OUT OF THEIR HUNDREDFOLD.
AND THEN JUST LET IT GO.
AND THEN PEOPLE START FROM GROUND LEVEL AGAIN
AT THIRTYFOLD.
WHEN WE SHOULD HAND OFF OUR HUNDREDFOLD TO MAKE
THAT THE NEXT GENERATION'S THIRTYFOLD.
>> YEP.
>> DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?
>> YEAH, STAND ON THEIR SHOULDERS.
>> I CAN THINK OF A FEW DIFFERENT MOVEMENTS,
I THINK WE ALL CAN, OR ORGANIZATIONS,
THAT HAVE FALLEN TO THE SIDE OF
NOT PASSING IT ON CORRECTLY.
>> JOSEPH: YEAH.
>> SO CAN YOU GIVE AN EXAMPLE OF ONE THAT HAS?
>> THERE'S SO FEW OF THEM AND THAT'S THE ISSUE.
AND I'M NOT BEING CRITICAL OR ANYTHING.
>> NO, THERE IS SO FEW.
A LOT OF TIMES SOMETHING WILL LIVE AND DIE
WITH THE PERSON AND THEN THERE'S NO --
AND I THINK NOW EVEN WE KEEP HAVING THESE CONVERSATIONS
IS, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU FIRST GET CALLED,
YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT WHAT AM I GOING TO DO.
AND AS YOU MOVE ON,
IT'S WHAT AM I GOING TO LEAVE FOR MY CHILDREN.
>> YES.
SO THAT IS WHERE THE PROPHETS COME IN
BECAUSE THE PROPHETS STEP ONTO THE STAGE OF THIS.
THEY STEP INTO THE ARENA.
AND THAT'S HOW KINGDOMS LAST.
THAT'S WHY DAVID, ALL OF THEM HAD PROPHETS.
NATHAN CAME IN AND, YOU KNOW, YANKED THE SLACK
OUT OF DAVID, THAT KIND OF STUFF.
BECAUSE WITHOUT THE TRUE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH
OR PROPHETS THAT COME IN AND SPEAK TO THESE THINGS,
YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE APOSTOLIC MOVEMENTS,
THEY DO STUFF, BUT THEY KIND OF HIT THEIR ZENITH.
AND THEN THEY DECLINE, THEY'RE OVER.
BUT I BELIEVE THAT IS WHY GOD'S RESTORING
THE FIVEFOLD MINISTRY IN A HEALTHY FLOW
WITH A NEW TESTAMENT UNDERSTANDING,
SO WE CAN SEE PEOPLE LIVE, MOVE,
AND HAVE THEIR BEING GENERATIONALLY.
IF YOU HAVE GENERATIONAL PURPOSE,
YOU'LL HAVE GENERATIONAL WEALTH.
YOU'LL HAVE LEGACY.
YOU'LL HAVE SPIRITUAL INSIGHTS THAT KEEP GOING.
AND SO SEEING ONE, I'M SURE I COULD THINK OF ONE,
BUT OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD,
I CAN'T SAY THERE'S THE MODEL.
>> WELL, THERE'S ONE THING THAT YOU SAID, TOO,
TO JUST EXPOUND ON THAT POINT, WAS HOW PEOPLE HAVE THIS
REVELATION, IT WILL MATURE AND THEN IT BECOMES
INSTITUTIONALIZED.
I THINK WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS PEOPLE GET
TRAPPED IN TRADITION.
>> THAT'S EXACTLY IT.
>> THE WAY WE DID IT.
THIS IS THE WAY WE'RE ALWAYS DOING IT.
AND I REMEMBER MY MOM TELLING ME ABOUT
THE DIFFERENT CHARISMATIC MOVEMENTS.
THEY WERE ALL KIND OF DIFFERENT,
AND THEY ALL KIND OF JUDGED THE OTHER.
BUT THE THING IS GOD MOVES IN DIFFERENT WAYS
AND YOU CAN'T GET PIGEONHOLED,
AND THIS IS THE WAY IT IS, BECAUSE THINGS DO CHANGE.
>> JOSEPH: YEAH.
>> AND I MEAN GOD NEVER CHANGES.
I'M NOT SAYING THAT, BUT I'M SAYING THAT THERE'LL BE
NEW STRATEGIES FOR THE NEW GENERATION
AND SO YOU GOT TO BE FLEX.
YOU CAN'T GET STUCK IN THIS IS THE WAY IT IS,
THIS IS THE WAY IT'S ALWAYS GOING TO BE.
>> THERE'S A PROPHETIC WORD
WE'VE WALKED IN FOR A LONG TIME CALLED
THE OAKS ARE LEAVING, OR THE OAKS ARE TRANSITIONING,
AND THE REDWOODS ARE COMING.
AND WHAT THAT MEANS IS OAKS, OR RIGHTEOUSNESS,
HAD TO STAND ALONE AND BUILD STUFF WITH NOBODY.
NO SUPPORT.
LIKE YOU SAID, EVERYBODY'S FIGHTING EACH OTHER.
>> MM-HMM.
>> BUT I BELIEVE THE OAKS ARE LEAVING, AND SOME OF
THOSE FATHERS OF THE FAITH ARE TRANSITIONING,
EITHER THEY'RE JUST, YOU KNOW,
BASICALLY RETIRING OR THEY'RE GRADUATING TO HEAVEN.
>> THAT WAS LIKE MY DAD.
HE WAS LIKE BY HIMSELF.
>> YEAH, HE WAS.
>> THAT GENERATION OF GUYS, A LOT OF THEM WERE.
I MEAN, THEY WERE BY THEMSELVES.
THEY STARTED THAT STUFF, A LOT OF THEM HAVE BEEN
KICKED OUT OF MAINSTREAM STUFF,
CHARISMATIC MOVEMENT HAPPENED,
OR THEY CAME OUT OF SOME SMALL PENTECOSTAL MOVEMENT
THAT DIDN'T LIKE THEIR BIG VISION.
>> REBECCA: TOTALLY.
>> AND THEN THEY'RE ALL ON THEIR OWN
AND SO THEY HAD TO DEAL WITH THAT.
>> THEY DID.
>> YEAH.
>> THEY DID.
AND I THINK THE NEXT MOVE WILL BE WHAT I CALL
THE REDWOODS, WHERE YOU HAVE
MANY VERY LARGE POWERFUL TREES THAT STAND TOGETHER
WITH A ROOT SYSTEM THAT'S INTERCONNECTED,
AND THAT SPIRIT OF, YOU KNOW,
STEPPING ON THE OTHER ONE TO GET WHERE
YOU'RE GOING TO GO AND ALL THAT STUFF,
I BELIEVE THE LORD IS WATCHING VERY CLOSELY
RIGHT NOW HOW WE TREAT OUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS
AND HOW WE'RE GOING TO RISE TOGETHER.
BECAUSE THE REDWOODS AS A UNITED FRONT,
OAKS ARE POWERFUL, BUT REDWOODS ARE BIGGER,
TALLER, STRONGER AND THERE'S JUST SOMETHING IN THAT.
AND I KNOW IT'S JUST SYMBOLIC IMAGERY,
BUT I BELIEVE THAT IS THE NEXT MOVE.
WHERE WE STAND AS A UNITED FRONT AGAINST THE GATES OF HELL,
RATHER THAN WE'RE SILOING EVERYWHERE
AND SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO SILO BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE
ARE JUST OFF, PERIOD.
THEY'RE JUST OFF.
AND I'M NOT SAYING WE JUST EMBRACE EVERYTHING
AND ANYONE.
I AM SAYING, THOUGH,
WE'VE GOT TO FIND OUR TRIBAL ALIGNMENT AND BEGIN
TO BUILD BIGGER FOR THE SAKE OF THE KINGDOM.
>> RIGHT NOW THERE IS SO MUCH ACCUSING
GOING ON IN THE BODY OF CHRIST
AND SO MUCH DIVISION BECAUSE YOU'RE
TALKING ABOUT HOW WE NEED TO STAND TOGETHER AND
WE'RE THE WEAKEST AND IT'S A PLAYBOOK OUT OF THE
ENEMY'S HAND, BUT A LOT OF TIMES THE CHURCH
LACKS THE WISDOM AND THE UNDERSTANDING THAT THEY
DON'T SEE IT FOR WHAT IT IS,
AND THEY'RE DECEIVED INTO THINKING
THAT THEY'RE UPHOLDING JUSTICE
AND TRUTH AND RIGHTEOUSNESS.
BUT DO YOU THINK THAT'S PART OF THE REASON WHY
THIS IS GOING ON IN THE BODY OF CHRIST RIGHT NOW?
>> WELL, I THINK THE DEVIL HATES THE CHURCH.
>> YES.
>> AND IF YOU CAN DIVIDE, YOU CAN CONQUER.
>> JONATHAN: RIGHT.
>> IF I CAN SPLIT YOU OFF OF YOUR TRIBE,
I CAN TAKE YOU OUT.
>> JONATHAN: THAT'S RIGHT.
>> IT'S ONE THING TO FIGHT
FIVE GUYS IN A DARK ALLEY BY YOURSELF.
IT'S ANOTHER THING TO FIGHT
FIVE GUYS WITH FIVE OF YOUR FRIENDS, RIGHT?
>> JONATHAN: YEAH.
>> SO THIS IS THE STRATEGY OF THE DEVIL,
AND WE LIVE IN AN HOUR WHERE PLATFORM
CAN SO EASILY BE ACQUIRED.
SO THANK GOD WE'RE PODCASTING.
THIS WILL BE ON SOCIAL EVERYWHERE.
RIGHT, IT'S THE INFORMATION AGE.
I'M THANKFUL FOR THAT, BUT IT IS A BLESSING
AND A CURSE.
>> REBECCA: YEAH.
>> USED TO, TO GET A VOICE OR HAVE A PLATFORM
YOU HAD TO FIGHT HELL, RIGHT?
YOU HAD TO TAKE CARE OF A FAMILY.
YOU HAD TO BE A GROWN MAN WITH A JOB, AND YOU HAD TO BE
ABOUT THE FATHER'S BUSINESS.
NOW TO GET A PLATFORM I CAN BUY ONE OF THESE MICS
AND I GOT A PHONE,
AND, YOU KNOW, I CAN DUB MYSELF PROPHET OR CRUSADER
TO THE NATION.
AND YOU GET A PLATFORM THAT REQUIRES
NO PERSEVERANCE.
>> AND NO ACCOUNTABILITY.
>> NO ACCOUNTABILITY.
SO YOU GOT A BUNCH OF -- AND SOMETIMES THEY'RE --
THEY MAY EVEN LOOK GOOD ON CAMERA, RIGHT?
ALL IT TAKES IS -- AND I'M SO GLAD Y'ALL ARE
GOOD-LOOKING, RIGHT,
BUT ALL IT TAKES IS LIKE A GOOD-LOOKING PERSON.
GIVE THEM A CAMERA.
THEY LOOK GOOD.
PEOPLE WILL LISTEN TO THEM AND THINK,
YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING?
IT'S LIKE IT'S INSANITY.
THE ONLY THING THEY'VE BEEN FAITHFUL TO
IS THEIR OWN GRAVEN IMAGE ON SOCIAL MEDIA.
SO IT'S DANGEROUS.
YOU KNOW, AS A PASTOR, IT BOTHERS ME, RIGHT,
BECAUSE I WANT MY PEOPLE TO HEAR FROM THE RIGHT VOICES.
>> AND FOR SOME REASON, IT DOESN'T REALLY BOTHER ME.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS, BUT LIKE WE HAVE BEEN IN IT
FOR SO MANY YEARS TOGETHER AND I SEE ALL
THESE PEOPLE, PROBABLY BECAUSE I'M NOT A PASTOR,
AND I'M JUST LIKE, ALL I THINK ABOUT IS
HOW WE'RE CALLED TO STORE UP TREASURES IN HEAVEN,
NOT ON EARTH, AND HOW WE'RE
LIVING FOR ETERNITY, NOT FOR A PLATFORM HERE.
AND SO FOR ME,
I HAVE A GENUINE FEAR OF THE LORD OF WHAT AM I DOING
FOR THAT PURPOSE AND TO THAT END.
AND WHEN I SEE SOMEBODY WHO IS SLANDERING PEOPLE PUBLICLY
OR BUILDING A PLATFORM AROUND --
>> REBECCA: I'M NERVOUS FOR THEM.
>> YEAH.
THAT'S HOW I FEEL IS LIKE, YIKES, BECAUSE THAT'S NOT --
>> BECAUSE WE HAVE TO STAND BEFORE GOD.
>> THAT'S NOT A GOOD THING TO BE SOWING.
>> IT'S NOT.
THERE IS A, I'LL USE THIS WORD,
YOU KNOW, MANY PEOPLE GET, AS SOON AS YOU SAY THIS WORD,
IT PUTS AN IMAGE, BUT THAT'S NOT THE IMAGE I'M CREATING,
BUT THERE'S A SEDUCTION TO ACCUSATION.
THERE IS THAT TYPE OF THING WHERE YOU --
>> JONATHAN: THAT'S SO TRUE.
>> WHERE YOU SUDDENLY, IF YOU HEAR THAT,
THERE'S SOMETHING THAT'S VERY --
>> YOU WANT TO KNOW MORE.
AND PEOPLE WANT TO BE A PART OF THAT.
THEY WANT TO GO DOWN THAT ROAD.
AND, YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES A STORY IS SO GOOD
THAT NOBODY REALLY CARES ABOUT WHAT'S TRUE.
>> REBECCA: YEAH.
>> AND SO, YOU KNOW, IN SOME CASES
THE STORY IS TRUE AND THINGS ARE TERRIBLE
AND IT'S ALL THAT.
BUT EVEN THEN, EVEN THEN, YOU CAN'T GIVE INTO
THE SEDUCTION OF GOING AFTER, SLANDERING ANOTHER
MEMBER OF THE BODY OF CHRIST.
AND YOU KNOW GOD DIDN'T MAKE
ALL KINDS OF PEOPLE THE, YOU KNOW,
POLICE OF THE BODY.
HE HAS A SYSTEM AND A STRUCTURE FOR DOING THAT,
AND THAT IS WHERE THE BODY OF CHRIST,
YOU KNOW, I SAY IT ALL THE TIME,
THE DEVIL CAN'T BEAT THE CHURCH
SO HE DOES THE NEXT BEST THING, HE JOINS IT.
HE JOINS IT THROUGH THAT TYPE OF BEHAVIOR.
YOU KNOW, BITING AND DEVOURING ONE ANOTHER,
ALL THAT KIND OF STUFF.
AND SO IF WE CAN BEGIN TO RIGHTSIZE THAT,
I BELIEVE THE BLESSING WILL FLOW LIKE WATER.
AND I'M NOT SAYING IN ANY WAY
WE DON'T DEAL WITH SIN.
I'M NOT SAYING IN ANY WAY
WE DON'T GO DOWN THE ROAD AND CORRECT STUFF AND
RIGHTSIZE THINGS AND MAKE IT RIGHT.
BUT THE WAY IT'S BEING DEALT WITH IN MANY WAYS
IS JUST KIND OF AN OFFSHOOT OF LIKE A --
IT'S JUST A SEDUCTIVE THING.
PEOPLE WANT TO JUMP INTO THAT
AND THEY WANT TO PARTICIPATE.
>> YEAH, AND THEY MONETIZE IT.
YOU KNOW, THEY MAKE MONEY ON IT RIGHT NOW.
>> JOSEPH: YEAH.
>> IT'S WORKING FOR SOME OF THESE PEOPLE
AND THAT'S ALL THEY HAVE.
THEY HAVE NO MINISTRY, THEY HAVE NO GIFT.
THEY'RE LOOKING FOR CRACKS IN OTHER PEOPLE.
AND IF YOU LOOK LONG ENOUGH, YOU'LL FIND OUR
CRACKS, RIGHT, BECAUSE WE'RE WE'RE PEOPLE, TOO.
THIS IS SOME OF THE SEDUCTION OF PLATFORM.
I TEACH IT, AND I THINK ABOUT IT LIKE THIS.
JAMES' AND JOHN'S MOM CAME TO JESUS.
RIGHT?
>> HERE WE GO.
>> SHE'S MAMA, RIGHT?
WHAT WOMEN WILL DO FOR THEIR SONS IS INSANE,
RIGHT, YOU KNOW.
SO HERE COMES MOM.
JESUS, CAN MY BOYS, WHEN YOU COME INTO YOUR KINGDOM,
YOU'RE THE MESSIAH.
YOU'RE GOING TO OVERTHROW ISRAEL.
YOU'RE GOING TO TAKE EVERYTHING OVER,
OVERTHROW ROME FOR ISRAEL.
WHEN YOU COME INTO YOUR KINGDOM,
CAN MY BOYS SIT ONE AT YOUR RIGHT HAND,
ONE AT YOUR LEFT IN THE KINGDOM TO COME, RIGHT.
AND HE'S LIKE THIS WOMAN WANTS THE HIGHEST PLATFORM
IN THE WORLD FOR HER CHILDREN AND HE'S LIKE
YOU HAVE NO IDEA --
>> YEAH.
>> WHAT YOU'RE ASKING FOR RIGHT NOW.
BECAUSE MOST OF THE TIME THE PLATFORM'S WHAT SETS YOU UP
FOR LIKE MARTYRDOM, RIGHT,
FOR DECAPITATION FOR FALSE ACCUSATION.
AN ELEVATION IN PLATFORM
ALWAYS MEANS A TEST IS COMING.
>> JOSEPH: AND IT DID FOR JAMES.
>> IT DID FOR JAMES.
>> JOSEPH: IT TOOK HIS LIFE.
>> IT TOOK HIS LIFE.
JOHN GETS, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT JOHN,
WHERE DID HE END AT?
THAT'S NOT JOHN --
>> JOHN --
>> JAMES GETS BEHEADED.
>> JOHN GOT BOILED IN OIL.
BUT ANYWAY, THE WHOLE THING WITH THIS,
JOHN KNEW HOW MUCH GOD LOVED HIM.
>> BRIAN: YEAH.
>> AND HE OUTLIVED THE OIL, BUT BOTH OF THEM DRANK --
>> BRIAN: BOILED IN OIL AND PUT ON -- YEAH.
>> DRANK THAT CUP.
>> JESUS LOOKS AT THEM AND SAYS YOU HAVE
NO IDEA WHAT YOU'RE ASKING.
CAN YOU DRINK THE CUP AND BE BAPTIZED
WITH THE BAPTISM I'LL BE BAPTIZED IN.
AND IT'S LIKE THE CUP OF MY -- GOD'S WRATH,
YOU KNOW, IS WHAT'S COMING, CUP OF WRATH IS COMING.
>> JOSEPH: PERSECUTION.
>> YEAH, PERSECUTION, ALL THAT.
AND THEN HE TURNS AROUND AND SAYS,
NO, YOU WILL.
YOU'LL BE BAPTIZED WITH THE BAPTISM
I'M BAPTIZED IN,
BUT HE SAYS BUT FOR ME TO GIVE YOU A PLATFORM,
IT'S NOT MINE.
>> SO GOOD, BRIAN.
>> HE SAID, IT'S THE FATHER'S, RIGHT, TO SAY
WHO WILL SIT IT THE RIGHT AND THE LEFT.
SO I THINK YOU FOCUS ON REAL JESUS MINISTRY.
THIS IS HOW WE PROTECT OURSELVES
FROM NOT PEOPLE ACCUSING US,
BUT FROM US BECOMING AN ACCUSER, RIGHT,
FROM US GETTING, BECOMING, THE PEOPLE WE'RE
TALKING ABOUT RIGHT NOW.
WE PROTECT OURSELVES BY DOING
THE MINISTRY OF JESUS AND LEAVING THAT
PLATFORM-SEEKING THING IN THE HANDS OF GOD, RIGHT?
IF GOD DOESN'T WANT ME TO HAVE A PLATFORM,
I DON'T WANT IT.
>> JOSEPH: AMEN.
>> BECAUSE A PLATFORM, MORE PLATFORMS, MORE PROBLEMS.
AND IF YOU DON'T HAVE A GRACE FOR IT,
IT'LL DESTROY YOU.
>> AND I THINK ALSO I THINK THERE'S PEOPLE
WHO ARE WELL-MEANING AND HAVE GOOD MOTIVATIONS
THAT ARE EVEN JUMPING INTO THE FIGHT AND THEY DON'T
REALIZE THAT, A, THEY DON'T HAVE
THE AUTHORITY TO DO WHAT THEY'RE DOING,
THEY'RE NOT CALLED TO DO WHAT THEY'RE DOING,
AND THEY DON'T REALIZE THAT THEY'RE NOT ACTUALLY
HELPING, THEY'RE HURTING.
BUT THEY FALL INTO THIS NARRATIVE,
THIS DECEPTION, THEY'RE LIKE,
WELL, I'M JUST BEING LIKE JESUS.
I'M JUST TURNING OVER THE TABLES IN THE TEMPLE.
WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO THAT?
>> I'D SAY JESUS IS HEAD OF THE CHURCH.
AND, YOU KNOW, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT
THAT BEFORE, YOU KNOW,
HAD THAT CONVERSATION, BUT JESUS IS HEAD OF THE CHURCH.
AND WHEN YOU PUT YOURSELF IN THAT POSITION
YOU KNOW, THERE'S A SEVERITY THAT COMES WITH
A LOT OF THESE THINGS THAT PEOPLE DON'T REALIZE.
EVERYTHING WE DO IS SEED.
WHAT YOU'RE SOWING, YOU'RE GOING TO REAP IN SPADES.
THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.
NOW OR LATER, YOU CANNOT MESS WITH THE FABRIC REALITY.
YOU CAN'T DO THESE THINGS, VIOLATE THE RULES OF GOD,
THE LAWS OF GOD, AND NOT SEE THE REAPING COME.
SO THERE'S PEOPLE, IF THEY'RE BUILDING THEIR PLATFORMS
BASED ON WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT,
WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN,
THERE'LL BE A DAY THAT THAT REAPING COMES AND IT
WILL COME TO ROOST AND GOD'S NOT EVEN DOING IT.
PEOPLE ARE LIKE, GOD'S GOING TO GET THEM.
GOD'S NOT GETTING THEM.
THEIR SEED IS GETTING THEM.
AND THAT PRINCIPLE OF SEEDTIME,
HARVEST TIME, IS COMING FOR THEM.
AND WHAT WILL HAPPEN IS THERE WILL BE SUCH A
DRAMATIC THING THAT TAKES PLACE WITH HOW THEY'VE JUDGED
AND DONE THINGS, THAT UNLESS THEY REPENT
AND TURN FROM IT,
IT WILL BE VERY CATASTROPHIC.
AND YOU SEE THAT OVER AND OVER AGAIN IN MINISTRIES.
AND I THINK THAT'S HOW I'D ANSWER IT.
>> I THINK THAT'S GOOD.
>> I WANT TO, BEFORE WE MOVE PAST
WHAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT WITH LEGACY
AND TRANSITION, AND I LOVED HOW YOU ACTUALLY
BROKE THAT DOWN AND EXPLAINED IT.
YOU MENTIONED THE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH BEING THE THING
THAT WE NEED TO EMBRACE AND WALK IN.
>> JOSEPH: YES.
>> CAN YOU UNPACK THAT A LITTLE BIT?
>> SURE, JONATHAN.
YEAH.
SO THE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH IN THE OLD TESTAMENT,
WE REALIZE THAT HE WENT TOE-TO-TOE WITH
JEZEBEL, AHAB, ALL THE THINGS HE DID.
HE'S THE PROPHET OF FIRE, CALLS IT DOWN, YOU KNOW,
SLAUGHTERS ALL THOSE FALSE PROPHETS.
THERE WAS 850 TOTAL, BECAUSE YOU HAD THE ONES
THAT WERE FROM ASHERAH, THEY ATE AT JEZEBEL'S TABLE.
THAT WAS 400 OF THEM.
THEN 450 MORE PROPHETS OF BAAL WERE ON THE MOUNTAIN,
MOUNT CARMEL, AND WHEN THE CONFRONTATION HAPPENED,
WHEN THE FIRE'S CALLED DOWN,
THEY DO IT,
HE DRAGS THEM DOWN INTO THE VALLEY OF MEGIDDO.
AND THAT'S WHERE HE SLAUGHTERS THEM,
WHERE ARMAGEDDON IS GOING TO HAPPEN.
SO THERE'S A WHOLE BIG TYPE AND SHADOW THERE,
BUT THE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH CONFRONTS THE CULTURE,
IT DEALS WITH THAT STUFF.
YOU SEE IT THEN LIFT OFF.
IT GOES, AND IT'S GENERATIONAL.
THAT'S THE THING ABOUT THE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH,
IT IS TO GO TO THE NEXT GENERATION.
IT WENT TO ELISHA.
ELISHA WAS GOING TO GIVE IT TO GEHAZI, I BELIEVE,
BUT GEHAZI FORFEITED THAT BY GOING AFTER GOLD, RIGHT?
ALL THAT STUFF HAPPENS.
BUT THEN YOU SEE IT SHOW UP IN JOHN THE BAPTIST.
OKAY.
SO JOHN THE BAPTIST COMES ON THE SCENE AND HE'S
THERE TO USHER IN JESUS.
YOU KNOW, BEHOLD THE LAMB OF GOD WHO TAKES AWAY
THE SIN OF THE WORLD.
HE WAS LIKE -- HE WAS THE FORERUNNER.
HE WAS THE WAYMAKER FOR JESUS, AND HE WAS THERE
TO ANNOUNCE HIS COMING THE FIRST TIME.
NOW, JOHN THE BAPTIST IS THE GREATEST
OF ALL PROPHETS.
HE WAS THE GREATEST, BUT HE WHO'S LEAST
IN THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN IS GREATER THAN JOHN THE BAPTIST.
THAT MEANS WE'RE IN THE NEW COVENANT.
SO THE LEAST OF US IS GREATER THAN JOHN THE BAPTIST.
THAT MEANS ALL OF US BECAUSE 1 JOHN 4:17 SAYS
AS HE IS, SO ARE WE, CORPORATELY, IN THIS WORLD.
SO WHEN WE'RE THAT WAY,
AND THEN I THINK IT'S 1 JOHN 5 STARTS TALKING ABOUT
THAT OUR FAITH IS THE POWER
THAT BRINGS THE WORLD TO ITS KNEES.
SO CORPORATELY,
I BELIEVE THAT WE AS THE BODY OF CHRIST,
CARRY THE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH THE WAY JOHN THE BAPTIST DID,
AND WE'RE GOING TO USHER
JESUS IN THE SECOND TIME.
>> REBECCA: WOW.
>> AND SO WITH THAT,
WHAT THAT MEANS IS,
WE HAVE AN ANOINTING TO TURN THE HEARTS OF THE FATHERS
TO THE CHILDREN, CHILDREN OF THE FATHERS,
SO WE CAN AVOID THE CURSE.
SO THE MORE THE CHURCH GETS BUSY
ABOUT THIS GENERATIONAL IMPARTATION,
THE MORE WE GET BUSY REPRODUCING OURSELF.
AND REALLY WHAT I'M SAYING IS DISCIPLESHIP.
THE MORE WE DO THAT, THE MORE WE'RE GOING TO BEGIN
TO STOP THE CURSE IN THE LAND,
STOP THIS NONSENSE
THAT WANTS TO COME OUT ON THE CULTURE,
AND WE'RE GOING TO SEE A LONGEVITY OF THIS SEASON.
BUT THE MORE WE BITE AND DEVOUR AND DO ALL THAT,
THAT'S THE OPPOSITE OF THE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH.
THAT'S WHAT JEZEBEL DID AGAINST THE PROPHETS.
THAT'S WHAT THEY ALL DID ALL THROUGHOUT
THE WHOLE DEAL.
YOU SEE THAT EVEN IN THE BOOK OF REVELATION,
WHERE THAT WOMAN JEZEBEL WAS IN THE CHURCH
CALLING HERSELF A TEACHER,
CALLING HERSELF A PROPHETESS,
TEACHING PEOPLE SEXUAL IMMORALITY,
TEACHING ALL THESE VULGAR THINGS.
AND YOU SEE THAT SPIRIT THERE,
BUT AGAIN THE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH CUTS THAT STUFF DOWN
AND IT REALLY JUST, SIMPLY PUT, IS THE CHURCH.
IT'S THE CHURCH DOING THE GREAT COMMISSION,
MAKING DISCIPLES AND PREPARING THE WAY FOR THE LORD'S RETURN
THE SECOND TIME.
>> THAT'S SO GOOD.
>> YEAH.
IT'S THE RESTORATION OF FAMILY THAT SOUNDS LIKE.
>> JOSEPH: IT REALLY IS. YEAH.
AND SPIRITUAL FAMILY.
>> YEAH, SPIRITUAL FAMILY.
>> JOSEPH: YOU KNOW, RAISING UP THE HOUSEHOLD OF FAITH.
>> SHALOM HOUSE, WERE YOU THINKING THAT?
>> YEAH, I WAS.
>> ALL RIGHT.
DO YOU WANT TO WRAP OR DO YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT ISRAEL?
BECAUSE WE COULD DO THAT.
>> WE NEED TO TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT ISRAEL.
>> LET'S GO.
>> IT'S TOO IMPORTANT.
>> JONATHAN: WHAT'S ON YOUR MIND?
>> NO, I WANNA DEFER TO YOU.
>> I THINK THE BEST THING TO DO IS FOR YOU TO ASK
A QUESTION THAT YOU'VE SEEN ON SOCIAL MEDIA OR --
>> OKAY, I'LL GO WITH A QUESTION THEN
THAT'S BEEN ON MY HEART WHICH I'VE PROBABLY
BROUGHT TO YOUR ATTENTION A MILLION TIMES.
>> I KNEW SHE HAD A QUESTION.
>> I KNEW IT.
>> SOMETHING THAT'S BEEN BOTHERING ME AND IT'S THE RISE
YOU KNOW, WHEN OCTOBER 7TH HAPPENED, WEIRDISHLY,
WHICH I SAY IT'S WEIRD BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, ISRAEL
GOT HORRENDOUSLY ATTACKED, PEOPLE GOT KIDNAPPED AND
PUT IN TUNNELS UNDERGROUND, AND THERE ARE STILL HOSTAGES
DOWN THERE AND THERE WAS A RISE OF ANTI-SEMITISM,
WHICH WAS WILD TO ME.
IT'S ONLY GOTTEN WORSE AND WHERE I'M COMING FROM IS
I'VE TALKED TO HIM ABOUT THIS, IS THERE'S BEEN
PEOPLE IN MOVEMENTS AND PEOPLE I'VE LISTENED TO
THAT HAVE BECOME ANTISEMITIC.
>> WHY IS THAT HAPPENING?
>> YEAH, I THINK IT'S WE DON'T RUSTLE AGAINST
FLESH AND BLOOD, RIGHT, BUT AGAINST PRINCIPALITIES,
POWERS, SPIRITUAL WICKEDNESS.
I THINK THERE'S A SPIRIT
THAT'S ALWAYS HATED THE JEWS BECAUSE THE JEWS
ARE BRINGING FORTH MESSIAH, RIGHT,
AND MESSIAH CAME, HIS NAME'S JESUS.
HE'S COMING BACK.
A JEW IS COMING BACK TO RULE THE WORLD AND --
>> SO THEY ARE LIKE THE GREATEST THREAT TO THE --
IN A WAY, TO THE ENEMY, BECAUSE THEY WILL HELP
BRING THAT ABOUT?
>> YEAH. I MEAN, THEY --
THAT'S WHERE THE COVENANTS CAME FROM.
THAT'S WHERE THE SCRIPTURES CAME FROM.
IT'S WHERE THE PROPHETS CAME FROM.
THE 23RD PSALM CAME FROM THEM, RIGHT?
MATTHEW, MARK, LUKE AND JOHN.
ALL OF THESE THINGS WRITTEN,
YOU KNOW, THIS IS ALL JEWISH
MATERIAL THAT'S RELEASED TO THE EARTH.
AND SO THERE IS THIS ANTI-SEMITIC SPIRIT
AND IT'S BEEN STRANGE TO WATCH HAMAS
LIKE YOU SAY, ATTACK ISRAEL, AND FOR THE WHOLE WORLD
TO GET MAD AT THE JEWS ABOUT IT.
AND IT'S LIKE, OF COURSE, YOU PUNCH ME IN THE MOUTH,
I PUNCH BACK, RIGHT?
OH, JESUS, TURNS THE OTHER CHEEK.
I DON'T YET.
SO THEY SMACKED, YOU KNOW,
THEY SMACKED THEM.
AND, OF COURSE,
YOU GO POKING THE BEAR, RIGHT,
YOU GET THE TEETH.
AND NOW YOU WATCH EVEN SOME
CONSERVATIVE INFLUENCERS THAT I LIKE,
AND I HAVE LIKED, ALL OF A SUDDEN,
IT'S LIKE THEY GOT ALL THIS ON THEIR BODY
WITH THEIR SPIRIT.
THEY SOUND LIKE ADOLF HITLER.
AND I'M LIKE, DID YOU JUST COME OUT OF
SOME NEO-NAZI MOVEMENT?
>> REBECCA: IT'S SO WEIRD.
>> IT'S CRAZY.
I THINK THAT THEY'RE --
THERE'S SOME PEOPLE PULLING THE STRINGS BACK THERE.
UM, I THINK SOME OF THESE PEOPLE HAVE A HARD TIME
SEPARATING -- ALL RIGHT, I'LL SAY IT LIKE THIS.
I AM PRO-AMERICA.
I'M AN AMERICAN, RED, WHITE AND BLUE.
A HUNDRED PERCENT, I'M ALL IN.
BUT I ALSO KNOW THAT AMERICA,
WE'VE DONE SOME SHADY STUFF.
>> REBECCA: OH, YEAH, THE GOVERNMENT.
>> WOULD Y'ALL AGREE WITH ME, WE'VE DONE
SOME SHADY STUFF?
>> ALL: YEAH.
>> WE'VE DONE SOME HORRIFIC THINGS.
BUT JUST BECAUSE WE'VE DONE SOME HORRIFIC THINGS
DOESN'T MEAN I THINK THE WHOLE OF AMERICA IS TERRIBLE.
I THINK THEY'RE -- I THINK HAS ISRAEL DONE SOME
SHADY STUFF AT SOME TIME? ABSOLUTELY.
100 PERCENT.
>> TOTALLY.
>> EVERYBODY'S INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES HAVE DONE
CRAZY STUFF.
SO THEY'LL TAKE A STORY THAT THEY GET
WHERE SOMETHING TERRIBLE HAPPENED.
THEY MAGNIFY IT.
THEY POUR FUEL ON IT.
AND THEY TAKE THAT ONE EVIL, WICKED ACTION
AND MAKE IT REPRESENT A WHOLE PEOPLE
IN A NATION.
WE HAVE TO SEE PAST THAT.
THESE ARE PEOPLE THAT GOD MADE A COVENANT WITH,
VIEW IT THROUGH THE BIBLICAL LENS.
ARE THEY PERFECT? NO.
ARE THEIR LEADERSHIP PERFECT? NO.
ARE WE PERFECT? NO.
OR IS OUR LEADERSHIP PERFECT? NO.
YOU HAVE TO SEE IT THROUGH THAT LENS.
IF NOT, THE DEVIL CAN TAKE SOMETHING AND TURN IT,
TURN IT IN YOUR HEART.
I THINK THAT'S WHAT'S HAPPENING
WITH SOME OF THESE PEOPLE.
>> IT IS. AND I FEEL LIKE BECAUSE GOD'S
COVENANT LAND AND COVENANT PEOPLE ARE TANGIBLE
AND THEY'RE HERE,
THE ENEMY HAS A WAY TO AN ACTUAL TARGET
THAT HE CAN GO AFTER.
AND IF HE CAN STIR UP ENOUGH HATE
TO WIPE OUT THE JEWISH PEOPLE, THAT THWARTS THE PLAN.
BECAUSE IT SAYS, YOU KNOW, WHEN ALL OF ISRAEL SAYS...
[ SPEAKING HEBREW ]
BLESSED IS HE WHO COMES IN THE NAME OF THE LORD,
THAT'S WHEN JESUS LANDS ON THE MOUNT OF OLIVES
AND THEN GOES TO THE EASTERN GATE.
I MEAN, WE SEE LIKE THE MUSLIMS HAVE BUILT A CEMETERY
IN FRONT OF IT TO TRY AND BLOCK HIM,
BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, JEWISH PEOPLE
DON'T WALK NEAR THE DEAD.
BUT IT'S LIKE, HE'S GOING TO BLAST THROUGH THAT.
SO, YOU KNOW, THAT DOESN'T EVEN MATTER.
BUT ALL THAT TO SAY, THERE IS AN ATTACK AND IT'S SPIRITUAL.
AND SO THE PART THAT REALLY GRIEVES ME IS WHEN I SEE
CHRISTIANS THAT AREN'T WALKING IN THE FULLNESS OF
THEIR IDENTITY KNOWING THAT THEY ARE PART OF
THE ONE NEW MAN, PART OF GOD'S ONE ETERNAL PLAN,
THAT IS RESTORING THE NATION OF ISRAEL TO HIMSELF.
JESUS COMES, HE SAYS,
I'M HERE FOR THE HOUSE OF?
>> ISRAEL.
>> YEAH, ISRAEL.
SO HE'S HERE FOR THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL, RIGHT,
SO WE KNOW THAT.
WE KNOW THAT WE NEED TO WALK WITH
THE JEWISH PEOPLE AND STAND WITH GOD'S COVENANT
FOR THEM BECAUSE ULTIMATELY IT'S US AS BELIEVERS
THAT ARE SHOWING THEM THE LOVE OF YESHUA,
THE LOVE OF JESUS,
THAT'S GOING TO TURN THEM TO THE LORD;
THAT'S GOING TO HAVE THEM CRY OUT...
[ SPEAKING HEBREW ]
THAT'S GOING TO USHER BACK IN,
YOU KNOW, JESUS' RETURN.
SO I JUST THINK THAT THE WHOLE THING IS SO SPIRITUAL.
>> IT IS.
>> YOU CAN'T EVEN RATIONALIZE IT.
YOU KNOW, THE HATRED OF THE JEWS IS LIKE --
>> OH, IT'S --
>> IT'S BEEN AROUND FOREVER.
>> WELL, ROMANS 11 SAYS THAT IF THE JEWS -- IF THE JEWS
REJECTION OF JESUS MEANT THAT THE GENTILES
WOULD RECEIVE, YOU KNOW, THE GOOD NEWS,
THEIR ACCEPTANCE OF YESHUA
WOULD MEAN RESURRECTION FROM THE DEAD.
AND SO WE KNOW THAT WHEN THAT HAPPENS, THAT END TIME,
YOU KNOW, AND SO OF COURSE THE ENEMY IS GOING TO WANT TO
TRY TO EITHER SLOW THAT OR STOP THAT.
HE CAN'T STOP GOD, BUT HE'LL TRY TO DO WHATEVER HE CAN
TO MESS WITH THAT PURPOSE AND THAT CALLING AND THAT'S WHERE
THE CHURCH -- YOU CAN'T BE MORE INFLUENCED BY THE NEWS,
OR PEOPLE'S OPINION, OR CULTURE, THAN THE WORD
OF GOD, BUT A LOT OF CHRISTIANS AREN'T DISCIPLED
AND THEY DON'T HAVE THIS REVELATION OF ISRAEL.
AND SO THAT'S WHY SOMETIMES THEY STAND
AGAINST ISRAEL, THINKING THAT THEY'RE DOING
SOMETHING GOOD, BUT IT'S NOT.
>> INTERESTING POINT, TOO,
WE WERE DOING A PANEL WITH GENE BAILEY,
AND GENE BROUGHT UP THIS REALLY INTERESTING THING.
HE SAID, YOU KNOW EVERYTHING YOU SEE ON X
OBVIOUSLY IS NOT TRUE.
AND WE GO, OH, YEAH, OF COURSE,
BUT HE STARTED BRINGING UP VIDEOS
SHOWING THINGS ISRAEL HAD DONE SUPPOSEDLY,
OR, YOU KNOW, EXPLOSIONS IN AN AREA AND HE SAID
THAT WASN'T ISRAEL.
THAT WAS A VIDEO OF ANOTHER NATION.
SOMETHING HAPPENING AND EVERYBODY GOES,
OH, LOOK AT WHAT'S TAKING PLACE.
LOOK AT THIS NARRATIVE.
AND SO THIS GENERATION IS BEING SOLD A BILL OF GOODS
ABOUT ISRAEL, BEING SOLD A BILL OF GOODS
ABOUT EVERYTHING THAT'S HAPPENING,
BUT THAT ALSO IS PART OF THE GREAT DECEPTION.
THERE'S A MECHANISM THAT WANTS THAT, AND THERE'S
NEVER BEEN A PEOPLE GROUP HATED LIKE THE JEWS.
>> I KNOW. I TOLD HER WHEN WE WERE GETTING MARRIED,
I WAS LIKE, WATCH OUT, BECAUSE I'M JEWISH AND NOW
THAT YOU'RE MARRYING A JEW, YOU'RE GOING TO GET HATED ON.
AND HAVEN'T YOU GOTTEN HATED ON?
>> YEAH. THERE'S BEEN A SHIFT.
>> CRAZY.
>> I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW,
WE'RE IN THIS UNIQUE TIME PERIOD RIGHT NOW.
I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHEN THIS EPISODE'S GOING TO DROP,
BUT WE'RE IN THIS ISRAEL IS AT AN ACTIVE WAR WITH IRAN.
>> JOSEPH: AT THIS TIME, YEAH.
>> AT THIS TIME.
SO WE DON'T KNOW EXACTLY
WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN IN 3 OR 4 WEEKS WHEN THIS
EPISODE DROPS, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF HATE ON NEWS OUTLETS,
SOCIAL MEDIA INFLUENCERS, EVEN SOME
CONSERVATIVE ONES THAT ALL OF US, YOU KNOW, READ
AND LISTEN TO, AND I JUST THINK THAT IT'S IMPORTANT
TO PUT INTO CONTEXT WHY THIS IS HAPPENING BECAUSE
IT'S NOT LIKE ISRAEL WOKE UP AND SAID NOW WOULD BE A
GREAT DAY TO FIRE ROCKETS AND DESTROY ANOTHER
NATION'S MILITARY INFRASTRUCTURE, NO.
IN FACT, WHAT'S ACTUALLY HAPPENING IS WE'RE LOOKING
AT FIVE DECADES OF AN IRANIAN REGIME THAT HAS
TORMENTED THEIR OWN PEOPLE, BASICALLY BINDED THEM
FROM HAVING ANY SORT OF FREEDOM AND FUNDED TERROR
GROUPS AROUND THE WORLD FOR THE DESTRUCTION OF ISRAEL
AND ULTIMATELY DESTRUCTION OF THE UNITED STATES.
THEY CALL ISRAEL THE LITTLE SATAN.
THE USA IS THE BIG SATAN.
THEY WANT US, YOU KNOW,
BING, BANG, BOOM.
YOU KNOW, ISRAEL, JUST IS CLOSER TO THEM.
SO IT'S JUST A MATTER OF TIME BEFORE THEY,
YOU KNOW, WORK THEIR WAY OVER TO THEM.
I THINK THAT THE REASON WHY ISRAEL
DID THIS STRIKE NOW ISN'T SO MUCH ABOUT
KILLING OR DISMANTLING,
IT'S ABOUT THE PRESIDENT THAT THE U.S. HAS
THAT GIVES THEM THE BACKING
TO NOW CHANGE THE LAND INFRASTRUCTURE,
CHANGE THE LAND, THE REGIME WITHIN THE MIDDLE EAST,
THAT WILL SET UP THE NEXT PHASE OF THE END TIMES.
SO I MEAN GOING INTO LIKE WHAT DO WE SEE HAPPENING
AT THE END OF THE END?
THERE'S A RESTRUCTION OF A TEMPLE.
>> YEAH.
PEOPLE RIGHT NOW
WILL BE LOOKING AND SAYING,
HEY, IS THIS,
IS THIS THE BEGINNING OF THE FORMATION
OF THESE NATIONS AND ARE WE HEADED THIS DIRECTION?
I DON'T THINK WE'RE -- WE'RE TOWARDS THE END,
BUT THE END IS NOT YET.
I'LL SAY IT LIKE THAT.
>> JOSEPH: YEAH.
>> I DO BELIEVE RIGHT NOW
AND WHAT I SEE PROPHETICALLY
AND I SAID IT EARLIER TODAY, AS I SEE A POTTER
WITH AN IRON ROD AND HE'S SMASHING VESSELS, RIGHT,
AND HE'S PICKING UP THE PIECES AND HE'S BEGINNING TO
ASSEMBLE NEW POTTERY.
AND THAT PEOPLE SHOULD LOOK FOR NEW ALLIANCES
AND STRANGE CONNECTIONS BETWEEN GOVERNMENTS
COMING IN THE NEXT EIGHT WEEKS OR SO.
AND GOD'S COMING AND HE'S SAYING
I'M GOING TO SET UP MY CHESSBOARD, RIGHT.
HE'S THE ULTIMATE CHESS MASTER AND HE'S SETTING UP
HIS BATTLEFIELD AND HE'S THE ULTIMATE LORD OF WAR.
BUT WE DO KNOW SOME THINGS HAVE TO HAPPEN, RIGHT?
DAMASCUS HAS TO BE DESTROYED.
THERE'S A TEMPLE
I BELIEVE THAT HAS TO BE BUILT BACK UP THERE
IN THE MIDST OF THE TEMPLE MOUNT.
>> JONATHAN: RIGHT.
>> IT'S GOT TO BE PUT BACK UP THERE IN THE MOUNTAIN.
I MEAN, WE ALL BELIEVE THESE THINGS.
WE BELIEVE ARMAGEDDON IS COMING AT A CERTAIN TIME.
UH, SO WE KNOW THESE THINGS ARE IMMINENT.
BUT WHEN I SEE WARS AND RUMORS OF WARS,
AND TROUBLE LIKE THIS,
ESPECIALLY IN THE LAND OF THE BIBLE,
A LOT OF PEOPLE GET TRIPPED OUT.
I GET EXCITED.
I'M LIKE, COME ON, MAN.
JESUS IS COMING.
>> JOSEPH: OH, HE'S COMING.
>> AND I SAY COME QUICKLY, LORD JESUS.
AND, YOU KNOW, I DON'T CARE WHAT PEOPLE'S
END-TIMES THEOLOGY IS.
I WOULD LIKE TO STAY AND RAISE A LITTLE MORE HELL
FOR HEAVEN.
I'M FOR A RAPTURE THEOLOGY.
WHATEVER YOU BELIEVE, BUT I'M LIKE CAN'T WE STAY HERE
AND JUST CAUSE PROBLEMS FOR THE DEVIL?
>> THAT'S HOW I FEEL.
>> THAT'S HIS MINDSET.
>> DON'T COUNT ME OUT.
>> WHY DON'T WE JUST HANG AROUND AND, YOU KNOW, MAKE HIM --
WE'LL CONTROL A PART OF THE EARTH
AND THEY CAN MURDER US, RIGHT?
>> FOR ETERNITY, YEAH.
>> IF THEY KILL US WE'LL WAKE UP.
IT'S LIKE --
>> YOU KNOW THE WHOLE THING ABOUT END-TIME THEOLOGY
EVERYBODY ARGUES ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WE'VE BEEN HERE FOR
LIKE, WHAT, 6,000 YEARS DEPENDING ON WHAT
YOU BELIEVE THAT WAY?
>> REBECCA: YEAH.
>> AND THEN GOING FORWARD AND I LIKE OLDER THEORY,
BUT I'LL JUST LEAVE THAT ALONE.
>> YOU GET INTO THAT.
YEAH, PODCAST NUMBER TWO.
BUT WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THIS, EVERYBODY'S ARGUING
ABOUT SEVEN YEARS.
>> YEAH.
>> ALL THE END-TIME THEOLOGY IS OVER SEVEN YEARS.
>> THAT'S INTERESTING.
>> YEAH, SEVEN YEARS.
THAT'S THE WHOLE THING.
NO, IT'S FASCINATING WHEN WE LOOK AT
THE WHOLE PICTURE,
IRAN, ISRAEL, THE THINGS THAT ARE
TRANSPIRING WITH IT, AND AT THE END OF THE DAY
YOU KNOW, JESUS IS GOING TO BE MADE LORD.
THESE THINGS ARE GOING TO HAPPEN.
I DON'T BELIEVE WE'RE RIGHT AT THE END EITHER.
I THINK WE'RE GETTING CLOSE. I KNOW THERE'S --
>> THAT'S WHAT YOU THINK, TOO.
>> YOU FEEL IT IN THE SPIRIT.
IT'S INTERESTING BECAUSE --
>> YOU FEEL IT IN THE SPIRIT.
>> YES.
>> THE END IS NOT YET.
>> WHERE THE EARLY CHURCH,
THEY THOUGHT IT'S HAPPENING ANY DAY.
>> SO YOU KNOW THE FIRST TIME JESUS CAME
THEY GOT IT ALL MESSED UP.
>> REBECCA: YEAH.
>> WE'LL JUST SEE.
>> YEAH.
>> NO MAN KNOWS THE HOUR.
NO MAN KNOWS THE DAY.
WE JUST HAVE TO DISCERN THE TIMES
WE'RE LIVING IN.
>> JOSEPH: HERE'S AN INTERESTING SCRIPTURE
AND THIS IS SOMETHING I'D LIKE TO
JUST THROW ON THE TABLE, MATTHEW 24, VERSE 20, RIGHT,
JESUS GETS TO PROPHESYING, WHEN YOU SEE THE WARS
AND RUMORS OF WARS AND ALL THE THINGS THAT ARE
COMING ON THE EARTH,
AND THEN HE TALKS ABOUT THE PROPHETIC WORD ABOUT
THE DESTRUCTION OF JERUSALEM AT THAT TIME
AND IT HAPPENED IN 70 A.D., RIGHT, TITUS CAME
AND LEVELED THE PLACE.
HE TOLD THE BELIEVERS WHEN YOU SEE THIS HAPPENING,
RIGHT, GET DOWN FROM THE ROOFTOPS.
DON'T EVEN GO BACK INSIDE.
RUN FOR YOUR LIFE.
GET OUT OF DODGE.
THAT'S WHY SO MANY CHRISTIANS
DID NOT DIE IN THAT SIEGE.
SO HERE'S WHAT HE SAYS NEXT THOUGH IN VERSE 20,
HE SAID PRAY THAT THESE THINGS DO NOT HAPPEN
IN THE WINTERTIME OR ON A SABBATH.
PRAY, IT'S COMING,
BUT PRAY IT DOESN'T HAPPEN IN THE WINTERTIME
OR ON A SABBATH.
AND I THINK OF THAT, WHY DID HE TELL THEM TO PRAY
IT WOULDN'T HAPPEN THEN?
WELL, BECAUSE I BELIEVE WE CAN ALTER IT.
I BELIEVE WHEN WE PRAY AND WHAT WE DO THROUGH
OUR HOLY LIVING RIGHT NOW,
I THINK WE CAN ALTER THE TIMELINE OF SOME OF THESE THINGS
IF GOD HASN'T SET A TIME AND HE HASN'T SAID
THIS IS WHEN IT'S GOING TO HAPPEN, BETWEEN NOW
AND THAT APPOINTED TIME,
I BELIEVE THAT WE CAN HAVE SEASONS OF MERCY,
LENGTHEN TIME, SEE THINGS HAPPEN.
AND THERE'S ALL THESE INNUENDOS
BY THE SPIRIT OF THE LORD
YOU SEE IN LIKE 1 PETER, YOU SEE THESE
THINGS WHERE IT SAYS WE THROUGH OUR HOLY LIVING
CAN HASTEN THE RETURN OF THE LORD.
BUT THEN HE SAYS PRAY THAT THESE THINGS
DON'T HAPPEN AT THIS TIME.
THERE'S MOMENTS THAT I BELIEVE WITH OUR ACTIONS
AND WHAT WE DO RIGHT NOW, THAT WE CAN STAY OFF
THE RUSHING OF THE END TIMES.
THAT'S JUST MY THOUGHT.
>> WELL, I ACTUALLY LIKE IT.
>> YEAH. YEAH.
IT'S LIKE --
IT'S NOT A FATALISTIC APPROACH.
>> JOSEPH: NO.
>> RIGHT? YOU CAN PRAY AND CHANGE THE NARRATIVE,
CHANGE THE TIMES, AND WE ARE SALT AND LIGHT
AND I THINK YOU CAN BOTH --
OBVIOUSLY WE CAN SPEED UP THE COMING OF THE LORD.
>> JOSEPH: YES, HASTEN.
>> YOU CAN HASTEN THE WORK.
THE BIBLE SAYS THIS GOSPEL SHALL BE PREACHED
IN EVERY LIKE ETHNIC TONGUE.
AND THEN THE END WILL COME.
>> YES.
>> SO THERE'S SOME THING WHERE IT ALMOST FEELS LIKE
IF THE CHURCH HIT EVERY PEOPLE GROUP,
EVERY TONGUE, RIGHT, THAT'S THE TIME.
THE STAGE IS SET.
CHRIST CAN COME BACK.
WE CAN BE LAZY ABOUT THAT.
IT WOULD TAKE FOREVER.
WE CAN GET AFTER IT, GET THE KING BACK.
AND THAT'S WHAT THE SPIRIT OF ELIJAH DOES.
JOHN THE BAPTIST PREPARES THE WAY OF THE LORD.
>> JOSEPH: YEAH. COME ON.
>> AND IT GOES RIGHT WITH WHAT YOUR BOOK'S ABOUT,
RIGHT WITH WHAT THE HEART OF GOD IS ABOUT.
WE'RE GOING TO BRING BACK THE KING
AND WE DO IT THROUGH --
>> GONNA BRING BACK THE KING.
>> RIGHT. PROPHETIC ACTION AND DOING WHAT
WE'RE TOLD TO DO.
>> THAT'S GOOD.
>> PUT A RIBBON ON IT, REBECCA.
>> I WANT TO SAY THIS REAL QUICK.
THIS PODCAST IS AWESOME.
AND FOR EVERYBODY WHO'S WATCHING,
YOU'RE WATCHING THE REBECCA WEISS PODCAST.
I JUST WANT TO SAY SUBSCRIBE TO THIS.
FOLLOW REBECCA.
SHE HAS THE BEST GUESTS ON HERE.
IT'S JUST THE GREATEST INTERVIEWS.
I ENJOY YOUR PODCASTS SO MUCH,
LIKE, WE WATCH THEM,
WE LISTEN TO THEM.
AND I JUST THINK YOU DO AN EXCELLENT JOB.
AND SO, JONATHAN, REBECCA, THANK YOU.
SO IF YOU'RE WATCHING THIS, SUBSCRIBE TO
THE REBECCA WEISS PODCAST.
YOU REALLY WANT TO DO THIS.
GET ALL THE NOTIFICATIONS.
GO TO YOUTUBE.
FIND THE PAGE, SUBSCRIBE, LIKE, HIT A LITTLE BELL.
DO ALL THE THINGS BECAUSE I'M TELLING YOU
YOU'RE GOING TO GET MORE AND MORE GREAT DATA
WITH REAL-TIME CONVERSATION LIKE THIS.
SO I JUST ENCOURAGE YOU TO DO THAT.
THIS IS A WONDERFUL MINISTRY.
>> WELL, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THAT.
AND THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING HERE.