REBECCA LAMB WEISS: HEY, GUYS.
WELCOME BACK TO THE REBECCA WEISS PODCAST.
AND I AM JOINED TODAY WITH ALIA AZARIAH.
AND SHE IS THE AFTERCARE DEVELOPMENT DIRECTOR
FOR THE SAFE HOUSE PROJECT.
SHE'S LOCATED IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA.
STARTING OFF, WHAT IS THE SAFE HOUSE PROJECT?
ALIA AZARIAH: YEAH.
SO WE'RE A NATIONAL ORGANIZATION THAT WORKS TO
COMBAT TRAFFICKING BY PROVIDING OPPORTUNITIES
FOR HEALING FOR SURVIVORS AND RAISING AWARENESS
AND INCREASING THE IDENTIFICATION OF
SURVIVORS SO THEY CAN EXIT.
REBECCA: YEAH.
I WAS ON THE WEBSITE RIGHT BEFORE THE INTERVIEW
AND I WAS LIKE REALLY IMPRESSED WITH THAT ORGANIZATION.
I FEEL LIKE YOU GUYS ARE DOING A LOT.
IT'S LIKE ALL OVER.
IT'S NOT JUST ONE LOCATION.
ALIA: NO.
SO WE'RE A NATIONAL ORGANIZATION,
SO WE SERVE ALL 50 STATES.
REBECCA: THAT'S SO COOL.
ALIA: WE'VE SERVED - LAST YEAR,
WE SERVED 534 SURVIVORS, HELPING THEM EXIT.
YEAH.
534 SURVIVORS.
WE'VE TRAINED OVER 300,000 PEOPLE SINCE 2017 AND
HELPED ORGANIZATIONS OPEN I THINK 478 NEW BEDS
FOR SURVIVORS OF TRAFFICKING.
REBECCA: [ GASPS ] THAT'S SO AMAZING.
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: I LOVE THAT.
BECAUSE IT TAKES SPECIAL TRAINING.
ALIA: IT DOES.
REBECCA: YOU CAN'T JUST,
BECAUSE OF THE TRAUMA AND THE THINGS THAT THESE
SURVIVORS GO THROUGH, AND I GUESS THE POOL TO TRY TO
GET THE PEOPLE WHO ARE TRAFFICKING THEM,
TRYING TO GET THEM BACK INTO THAT WORLD,
YOU REALLY HAVE TO HAVE PEOPLE WHO KNOW WHAT
THEY'RE DOING.
ALIA: YEAH, VERY MUCH SO.
REBECCA: SO WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT YOUR STORY.
AND I LOVE THAT YOU'RE SHARING YOUR TESTIMONY.
THAT'S ACTUALLY HOW I FOUND YOU,
IS THROUGH YOUTUBE, BECAUSE THE THING THAT'S
CRAZY, I THINK FOR SOMEONE LIKE ME,
IS SEX TRAFFICKING HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR A REALLY
LONG TIME, BUT I FEEL LIKE IN THE LAST MAYBE FIVE OR
SO YEARS, PEOPLE ARE FINALLY REALLY TALKING
ABOUT IT AND STARTING TO GET, I THINK,
INTERNATIONAL EXPOSURE.
BUT WHAT'S CRAZY IS THAT WHEN PEOPLE TALK ABOUT
SEX TRAFFICKING, THEY SAY IT'S SO RAMPANT AND SO
WORLDWIDE, BUT IT'S SO UNDERGROUND THAT PEOPLE
LIKE ME, IT ALMOST - IT'S LIKE I DON'T DENY THAT
IT'S REAL, BUT IT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE IT'S REAL
BECAUSE IT'S LIKE I DON'T KNOW ANYONE,
I DON'T SEE ANYTHING, BUT IT'S GOING ON SO MUCH.
SO THAT'S WHY I APPRECIATE PEOPLE LIKE YOU WHO TELL
YOUR STORIES, BECAUSE IT HELPS THE PUBLIC KNOW
LIKE, THIS IS A REAL PROBLEM AND IT'S REALLY
GOING ON.
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: SO THANK YOU FOR I THINK BRINGING A FACE
TO THE REALIZATION THAT THIS DOES
HAPPEN TO PEOPLE.
SO LET'S START WITH YOU GROWING UP.
HOW YOU WERE EVEN CONCEIVED,
BECAUSE IT ADDS TO YOUR STORY.
ALIA: YEAH.
SO, UNFORTUNATELY MY MOM, WAS TRAFFICKED, AS WELL,
AND EXPLOITED.
AND SHE WAS POSING IN LIKE HUSTLER MAGAZINES
AND THINGS LIKE THAT AT THE TIME, AS WELL.
REBECCA: WHICH IS LIKE KIND OF LIKE PLAYBOY, RIGHT?
ALIA: YEAH, YEAH.
AND SO THAT WAS JUST PART OF HER EXPLOITATION.
BUT SHE TRIED TO GET A JOB OR SHE HAD A JOB
AT A BUSINESS, AND THOSE PICTURES WERE USED AGAINST HER.
IT'S LIKE IF YOU DON'T HAVE SEX WITH ME,
I'M GOING TO SHOW EVERYBODY EVERYTHING
THAT YOU'VE DONE AND TELL EVERYBODY.
AND SO THAT'S HOW SHE GOT PREGNANT WITH ME,
WAS THROUGH THAT, SOMEBODY EXPLOITING HER.
AND SO SHE WAS SEXUALLY ASSAULTED BY HER BOSS.
AND SO THAT, I REALLY BELIEVE LIKE PLACED
A STRONGHOLD ON MY LIFE RIGHT AWAY.
AND IT ALSO REALLY COMPLICATED OUR RELATIONSHIP.
AND SO MY MOM LOVES ME AND SHE'S ALWAYS LOVED ME,
BUT SHE WAS DEALING - SHE WAS VERY YOUNG,
SHE'S LIKE 20 YEARS OLD, SHE'S DEALING WITH
HER OWN SIGNIFICANT TRAUMA, AND I CAN ONLY IMAGINE
A COMPLICATED RELATIONSHIP WITH ME,
EVEN AS A LITTLE CHILD OR WITH HER OWN NOT -
NEVER RECEIVING HELP FOR HER OWN ASSAULT.
AND SO SHE WAS NOT INTO A PLACE TO CARE FOR ME WELL.
AND SO I GREW UP MOST OF THE TIME WITH MY GRANDMA,
BUT WOULD STILL SEE MY MOM,
AND LIKE EVERY LITTLE GIRL LIKE, I IDOLIZED HER,
AND I THOUGHT SHE WAS SO COOL AND HER BEING YOUNG,
SHE ALSO FELT JUST LIKE A BIG SISTER,
AND I THOUGHT THAT EVERYTHING SHE DID WAS AMAZING.
REBECCA: AW.
ALIA: AND, UNFORTUNATELY LIKE THAT
LED TO IDOLIZING A LOT OF THINGS THAT WEREN'T SAFE
AND HAVING A REALLY DISTORTED VIEW OF WHAT
WOMANHOOD LOOKED LIKE AND SEXUALITY LOOKS LIKE.
AND WITH MY MOM WHERE SHE WAS AT THE TIME,
SHE HAD LIKE ONE OF THOSE PRINTOUTS OF LIKE
HER CENTERFOLDS LIKE HANGING ABOVE HER BED,
LIKE LIFE-SIZE.
AND SO I GREW UP -
REBECCA: OH, MY GOSH.
ALIA: YEAH, I GREW UP WITH THAT IMAGE AND
THINKING LIKE THAT THAT IS FEMININITY
AND THAT THAT'S LIKE WHAT - A NORMAL THING.
AND THEN ON TOP OF THAT, BECAUSE OF HER PAIN,
SHE WASN'T PICKING GOOD MEN TO BE IN HER LIFE.
AND ONE OF HER BOYFRIENDS STARTED SEXUALLY ABUSING ME
WHEN I WAS 4.
AND SO ALL OF THESE THINGS CAME TOGETHER TO, REALLY,
A PERFECT STORM OF VICTIMIZATION.
AND LIKE I REALLY BELIEVED THAT THAT WAS A NORMAL THING
IN THE WORLD, THAT THAT'S HOW WOMEN WERE
SUPPOSED TO BEHAVE, THAT'S WHAT RELATIONSHIPS
WITH MEN LOOKED LIKE.
AND, YEAH, SO IT LED TO SOME REALLY DISTORTED
WORLDVIEW FOR ME.
REBECCA: YEAH.
AND YOU WERE EXPOSED TO SEX AT WAY TOO YOUNG OF AN AGE,
BECAUSE THAT'S A WHOLE 'NOTHER THING
IN AND OF ITSELF IS CHILDREN BEING SEXUALIZED
BEFORE THEY'RE READY.
DID THAT AFFECT, BEING ABUSED AND DEALING WITH YOUR MOM,
DID THAT ONLY - IT NOT ONLY AFFECTED YOUR WORLDVIEW,
BUT DID IT AFFECT YOUR SENSE OF
SELF-WORTH AND IDENTITY?
ALIA: YEAH.
ABSOLUTELY.
AND I FELT LIKE I ONLY GOT SELF-WORTH WHEN SOMEBODY
GAVE IT TO ME, RIGHT.
AND SPECIFICALLY LIKE MY - THE PERSON WHO STARTED
ABUSING ME WHEN I WAS REALLY YOUNG WOULD TELL ME
LIKE, WELL, THIS IS BECAUSE YOU'RE SO PRETTY,
RIGHT, AND I'M 4.
AND SO I REALLY THOUGHT LIKE, OKAY,
LIKE THESE THINGS HAPPEN TO PRETTY GIRLS.
LIKE THAT'S WHAT - THE MESSAGE THAT I RECEIVED
WAS, ONLY PRETTY GIRLS GET ABUSED.
SO IT'S ALMOST LIKE IT WAS A PRIVILEGE
FOR YOU, RIGHT.
AND SO I FELT LIKE THERE WERE THINGS -
REBECCA: SO YOU HAD ALL THIS MIXED MESSAGING
BEING PUT IN YOUR MIND.
ALIA: SO MIXED.
REBECCA: WAY TOO YOUNG TO KNOW ANY DIFFERENT.
ALIA: AND I THOUGHT, JUST BECAUSE I WAS,
I HAD FAMILY THAT LOVED ME,
BUT THEN I ALSO HAD FAMILY THAT HURT ME.
AND THERE WAS BIG, LIKE, HOLES IN MY LIFE FROM NOT
HAVING A DAD AND MY GRANDPA LEFT TOO,
AND IT WAS LIKE ALL OF THESE LIKE MAN-TYPE HOLES
IN MY LIFE.
REBECCA: YEAH, FATHER WOUNDS.
ALIA: FATHER WOUNDS, DEEP FATHER WOUNDS THAT I
FELT LIKE THE ONLY TIME THAT I COULD GET LIKE
MALE AFFECTION, IT WAS SEXUALIZED.
AND SO I JUST DIDN'T SEE HOW,
I THOUGHT THAT I WAS DIFFERENT THAN OTHER GIRLS.
LIKE BECAUSE OF ABUSE, BECAUSE OF LACK OF A FATHER,
LIKE THERE WERE THINGS THAT OTHER PEOPLE
COULD LIVE LIKE.
THERE WERE OPPORTUNITIES FOR OTHER GIRLS
THAT I DIDN'T HAVE.
AND IT WASN'T LIKE A, OH, WELL MAYBE IF I WORK HARD
ENOUGH, THERE WAS - IT WAS JUST LIKE,
THIS IS JUST THE WAY IT IS FOR YOU.
THAT WAS THE MESSAGE THAT I'D RECEIVED ABOUT MYSELF
AND MY PLACE IN THE WORLD.
REBECCA: AND FATHER WOUNDS,
WHEN YOU DON'T HAVE THE AFFECTION AND LOVE
OF YOUR FATHER,
THAT'S A VERY BIG HOLE THAT'S LEFT BEHIND.
AND YOU DIDN'T EVEN REALLY, A HUNDRED PERCENT,
HAVE YOUR MOM BECAUSE YOUR MOM, LIKE YOU SAID,
WAS NOT IN 5 A GOOD PLACE.
SHE HAD SO MUCH HURTING.
YOUR MOM DID THE BEST SHE COULD.
ALIA: SHE DID THE BEST SHE COULD.
AND SHE'S APOLOGIZED AND SHE WOULD SAY HER BEST
WASN'T GOOD ENOUGH.
LIKE I WANT TO ALWAYS BE REALLY HONORING OF THE
WORK THAT SHE'S DONE AND WE HAVE A REALLY GOOD
RELATIONSHIP NOW, BUT IT WAS NOT THAT WAY.
AND SHE WAS NOT A GOOD MOM AT THE TIME.
AND SO, YEAH, IT WAS LIKE DOUBLE-PAIN.
REBECCA: DOUBLE-HOLES.
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: YEAH.
AND SO WHEN YOU DON'T HAVE THAT LOVE OF A FATHER,
THAT WILL PUT SUCH A STRONG HUNGER WITHIN YOUR
SOUL TO GO LOOKING FOR THAT AND GETTING THAT
PRETTY MUCH ANY WAY YOU CAN.
DID YOU EVER - DID YOUR MOM EVER KNOW THE ABUSE -
DID YOU EVER TELL HER ABOUT IT WHEN YOU WERE A KID
OR DID YOU NOT EVEN -
ALIA: NOT WHEN I WAS A KID.
REBECCA: BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T EVEN PROBABLY REALIZE?
ALIA: NO, I DIDN'T.
I DIDN'T KNOW.
I REMEMBER BEING IN LIKE FIFTH GRADE AND HAVING
A GIRL TALK ABOUT LIKE, I CAN'T REMEMBER WHY
SHE BROUGHT IT UP, BUT SHE'S - WE'RE ON A FIELD TRIP,
AND SHE TALKED ABOUT LIKE BEING MOLESTED OR SOMETHING,
AND I'M LIKE, WHAT DOES THAT WORD MEAN?
AND SHE TOLD ME, AND I WAS LIKE,
OH, THAT - LIKE THAT HAPPENED TO ME.
IT HAD ALWAYS JUST BEEN LIKE,
THIS IS A THING THAT HAPPENS.
I DIDN'T REALIZE THERE WAS EVEN A WORD FOR IT.
REBECCA: AND YOU JUST THOUGHT IT WAS NORMAL.
ALIA: I DID.
I REALLY THOUGHT IT WAS NORMAL.
I KNEW THAT IT DIDN'T HAPPEN TO EVERYBODY,
BUT I KNEW LIKE THERE'S JUST SOME KIDS
THAT THIS HAPPENS TO.
AND SO I DIDN'T.
I TOLD HER WHEN I WAS AN ADULT, ACTUALLY,
RIGHT BEFORE I STARTED SPEAKING LIKE MORE PUBLICALLY,
I WAS LIKE, I NEED TO TELL MY MOM.
AND SHE HAD ALREADY KNOWN.
I HAD TOLD MY GRANDMA YEARS BEFORE,
AND MY GRANDMA, I GUESS, HAD TOLD HER.
AND SO SHE HAD ALREADY KNOWN,
SO THAT MADE IT A LITTLE EASIER,
BUT WE NEVER REALLY TALKED ABOUT IT AT ALL.
AND SHE GAVE ME JUST SOME MORE CONTEXT TO LIKE,
YOU'LL ONLY REMEMBER THINGS THE WAY THAT YOU DO
WHEN YOU'RE LITTLE, RIGHT.
AND SO SHE FILLED IN SOME HOLES THAT I HAD
IN MY MEMORY THAT I HAD QUESTIONS ABOUT, AND JUST,
OF COURSE, TOLD ME THAT SHE WAS SORRY,
AND ALL OF THAT.
BUT IT'S HARD FOR BOTH OF US.
LIKE, I KNOW THAT IT'S NOT EASY FOR HER TO CARRY
THAT THOUGHT THAT SHE BROUGHT SOMEBODY INTO MY LIFE
THAT HURT ME, ISN'T AN EASY THING FOR HER, EITHER.
REBECCA: YEAH.
AND WE BOTH HAVE KIDS, SO IT'S LIKE,
WE CAN'T EVEN IMAGINE.
THAT WOULD BE SO HARD.
ALIA: I CAN'T, I REALLY CAN'T IMAGINE.
REBECCA: YOU GROW UP IN THIS HOUSEHOLD WHERE
WE TALK ABOUT HOW YOU HAVE THESE WOUNDS,
YOU HAVE THESE HOLES WITHIN YOUR SOUL,
YOU'RE LOOKING FOR LOVE, YOU'RE LOOKING FOR AFFECTION,
YOU'VE ALREADY BEEN PROGRAMMED INTO YOUR MIND
TO NOT REALLY HAVE THE BEST SELF-WORTH
BECAUSE OF ALL OF THE DIFFERENT
LIFE EXPERIENCES YOU HAD.
SO THIS LEADS TO YOU BEING A TEENAGER
AND YOU'RE ON MYSPACE.
I WAS THE EXACT SAME AGE,
AND WE WERE PROBABLY BORN AROUND THE SAME TIME,
BECAUSE I REMEMBER THE MYSPACE AGE,
AND I WAS THE EXACT SAME AGE, TOO.
AND THAT WAS SUCH A WILD PLACE.
ALIA: IT WAS.
REBECCA: BECAUSE MYSPACE WAS SO SKETCHY,
IN MY OPINION.
ALIA: IT REALLY WAS SKETCHY.
REBECCA: THERE WAS SOMETHING EXTRA SKETCHY
ABOUT MYSPACE, AND I THINK IT MIGHT BE JUST
BECAUSE, I DON'T KNOW, LIKE PEOPLE CAN FAKE
THEIR PROFILES EVEN MORE.
I DON'T KNOW.
ALIA: THERE WAS ALSO LIKE THE SEARCH ON MYSPACE.
REBECCA: YEAH.
I KNEW THERE WAS SOMETHING - IT'S BEEN SO LONG,
BUT I REMEMBER LIKE YOU COULD CONNECT TO SUCH
RANDOM PEOPLE.
SO I'M JUST LIKE, UGH, MYSPACE WAS SUCH A BAD THING.
ALIA: IT WAS A BAD THING.
REBECCA: FOR US, OUR AGE,
AND I WAS LIKE THE SAME AGE AS YOU, I WAS LIKE 13, 12.
UGH, IT JUST - IT HONESTLY KILLS ME A LITTLE BIT.
SO YOU'RE ON MYSPACE, AND WHAT HAPPENS?
ALIA: SO I HAD GOTTEN, LIKE I HAD HAD EXPERIENCES
LEADING UP TO THIS THAT CONTINUED TO CONFIRM
THOSE THINGS THAT I HAD EXPERIENCED WHEN I WAS
VERY LITTLE, SO I HAD LIKE, STARTING AROUND 12,
I STARTED - I DO THINK THAT THERE'S SOMETHING
THAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU'VE BEEN VICTIMIZED
AND IT'S BEEN KEPT IN THE DARK
WHEN YOU DO HAVE LIKE VICTIM
WRITTEN ACROSS YOUR FOREHEAD.
AND PEOPLE THAT WANT TO HURT YOU OR EXPLOIT YOU,
THEY CAN SEE THAT, WHEN YOU HAVEN'T GOTTEN THE HELP.
REBECCA: I THINK THAT, TOO.
ALIA: THERE IS.
REBECCA: I ACTUALLY THINK THERE'S - THIS MIGHT
SOUND WEIRD - BUT I THINK THERE'S A SPIRITUAL COMPONENT
TO IT AS WELL.
ALIA: ABSOLUTELY, YEAH.
REBECCA: WE'RE IN THE SPIRIT REALM,
THIS MIGHT SOUND CRAZY TO OTHER PEOPLE,
BUT I'VE HEARD OTHER PEOPLE TALK ABOUT THIS,
WHERE DEMONICALLY, IT ATTRACTS THOSE KIND OF PEOPLE
TO YOU, BECAUSE THEY KNOW, YEAH.
ALIA: I'M SURE.
I'M SURE THERE IS.
AND SO THAT WAS DEFINITELY HAPPENING, ESSENTIALLY,
IN MY LIFE.
AND THERE WERE LIKE OLDER -
REBECCA: BECAUSE THINGS KEPT HAPPENING.
ALIA: YEAH.
AND SO LIKE I HAD A LITTLE JOB AT MY MOM'S,
WHEN I WOULD GO VISIT HER LIKE HOSTESSING
AT A LITTLE TINY RESTAURANT, AND THERE WAS LIKE
A 21-YEAR-OLD BOY WHO WORKED IN THE KITCHEN WHO TOOK
ADVANTAGE OF - LIKE LITTLE THINGS LIKE THAT -
LITTLE THINGS - IN MY LIFE, THEY WERE LITTLE THINGS.
IT HAPPENED SO OFTEN THAT IT DID FEEL LIKE
LITTLE THINGS.
SO I WAS REALLY KIND OF THE LIKE CHILD AND ADULT
SEXUAL RELATIONSHIP WAS REALLY NORMALIZED FOR ME
BY THAT POINT.
AND SO WHAT I REALIZED WAS, OKAY, WELL,
THERE ARE THESE MEN, THERE'S ADULT MEN OUT THERE
THAT WANT TO HAVE SEX WITH ME,
AND THEY WILL, A LOT OF TIME,
GIVE ME ALCOHOL OR THEY'LL LIKE HAVE ME SMOKE WEED,
AND THOSE KINDS OF THINGS NUMB A LOT OF THIS PAIN.
THAT NUMBS THIS PAIN.
AND THAT WAS REALLY NORMAL FOR ME,
TO LIKE HAVE ADULTS THAT WERE INTERESTED IN ME.
AND SO I WAS RUNNING AWAY A LOT.
AND MYSPACE WAS LIKE AN AID IN THAT.
AND WHAT YOU COULD DO ON MYSPACE WAS YOU COULD SEARCH.
AND SO I WOULD DO LIKE, WITHIN A 30-MILE RADIUS,
WITHIN A 60-MILE RADIUS, MEN BETWEEN THE AGES
OF 25 AND 35.
AND IN THE SAME WAY THAT I COULD SEARCH FOR THAT,
MEN COULD SEARCH FOR KIDS THAT WAY, TOO,
AT THAT POINT.
AND SO I WOULD SEARCH THAT,
AND I COULD GET A VIBE JUST BASED ON MYSPACE
OF LIKE WHO WOULD WANT TO COME PICK ME UP.
AND IT'S SICKENING TO THINK OF HOW MANY TIMES
PEOPLE RESPONDED TO THE MESSAGES THAT I SENT OUT
AS A 12, 13-YEAR-OLD GIRL.
LIKE, DO YOU WANT TO HANG OUT?
LIKE COME PICK ME UP.
LIKE I WAS LOOKING TO RUN AWAY.
AND SO I WOULD.
I WOULD RUN AWAY AND I WOULD NUMB,
AND IT WAS LIKE A BAND-AID.
SOMEBODY TOLD ME THAT I WAS BEAUTIFUL,
SOMEBODY WOULD TELL ME THAT I WAS VALUABLE.
AND LIKE - AND IT FELT REAL FOR A MOMENT, RIGHT.
IT WAS THE ONLY PLACE THAT I REALLY FELT LIKE
THAT WAS TRUE.
AND SO ONE DAY, I SENT A MESSAGE,
AND I ALWAYS SAY LIKE WHEN I TELL THIS STORY THAT I'M
SURE TO HIM, THIS WAS LIKE CHRISTMAS MORNING,
BECAUSE HE HAD A HISTORY OF TRAFFICKING YOUNG GIRLS.
AND HE HAPPENED TO BE ONE OF THE PEOPLE
THAT I WAS LIKE, OH, THIS GUY WILL PROBABLY
COME PICK ME UP.
AND SO I SENT HIM A MESSAGE, AND HE DID.
HE CAME AND PICKED ME UP.
AND LIKE THE THING THAT PEOPLE DON'T UNDERSTAND
ABOUT TRAFFICKING IS, I THINK THEY THINK LIKE THE
NEXT THING SHE'S GOING TO SAY IS HE DIDN'T BRING HER
BACK HOME, RIGHT?
THAT'S NOT WHAT HAPPENED.
LIKE HE BROUGHT ME BACK HOME.
AND FOR SIX MONTHS, LIKE EVERY COUPLE OF NIGHTS,
HE WOULD COME AND PICK ME UP,
AND THEN HE WOULD BRING ME BACK HOME LIKE LATER
IN THE EVENING, LIKE I WOULD SNEAK OUT WITH -
OUT THE SLIDING GLASS DOOR WHEN MY GRANDMA WAS ASLEEP
AND SNEAK BACK IN BEFORE SHE WOULD WAKE UP.
REBECCA: DID SHE HAVE ANY IDEA THAT YOU WERE GONE?
ALIA: SOMETIMES.
SOMETIMES SHE DID.
REBECCA: SO SHE DIDN'T KNOW WHAT WAS GOING ON?
ALIA: SHE DID LATER ON.
LATER ON, SHE KNEW.
THERE JUST WASN'T RESOURCES TO HELP HER HELP ME.
BUT LATE - SO I MET THIS GUY THERE,
AND IT TOOK HIM ABOUT SIX MONTHS BEFORE HE ACTUALLY
TRAFFICKED ME, BUT HE SPENT A LOT OF TIME
NORMALIZING TRAFFICKING AND NORMALIZING LIKE
BUYING AND SELLING SEX AND EXPOSING ME TO OTHER PEOPLE
THAT DID THAT.
LIKE HE TOOK HIS TIME TO PICK UP WHERE EVERYONE ELSE
WHO HAD ABUSED ME LEFT OFF,
SO THAT WHEN HE WOULD PUT ME IN A SITUATION WHERE HE
WAS ACTUALLY GOING TO BE TRAFFICKING ME INSTEAD OF
JUST ABUSING ME HIMSELF, IT FELT NORMAL,
LIKE IT DIDN'T FEEL LIKE THIS BIG,
CRAZY THING THAT WAS HAPPENING.
IT JUST FELT LIKE, THIS FITS WITH EVERYTHING ELSE
I KNOW ABOUT LIFE.
REBECCA: HE WAS GROOMING YOU.
ALIA: YEAH, HE WAS GROOMING ME.
REBECCA: AND SO HE TREATED YOU - DID HE TREAT
YOU PRETTY WELL IN HIS FIRST SIX MONTHS?
ALIA: YEAH.
IT'S ALL RELATIVE, RIGHT.
NOT LIKE, YEAH, HE JUST TOLD ME HOW BEAUTIFUL I WAS
AND HOW LOVED I WAS, AND JUST THAT HE MADE ME -
AND IT'S -
REBECCA: LOVE BOMBING.
ALIA: YEAH, LOVE BOMBED ME.
AND IT'S CRAZY TO THINK LIKE, I WAS 13 YEARS OLD,
LIKE HOW DID I -
REBECCA: YOU'RE SO YOUNG.
ALIA: SO YOUNG.
REBECCA: YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON.
ALIA: AND JUST - BUT HE TOLD ME LIKE,
WE'RE GOING TO BE A FAMILY,
ALL THESE THINGS THAT -
REBECCA: WERE YOU LIKE - DID YOU FEEL LIKE
YOU WERE IN LOVE WITH HIM?
ALIA: OH, ABSOLUTELY.
REBECCA: OH, MY GOSH.
ALIA: I DID. I DID.
REBECCA: SO HE WAS LIKE SAYING LIKE YOU'RE MINE,
WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A FAMILY?
ALIA: YEAH.
ALL OF THESE THINGS.
REBECCA: HOW OLD WAS HE?
ALIA: HE WAS 28.
REBECCA: EW.
ALIA: AND I - BUT I WAS SO STARVED FOR FAMILY,
YEAH, SUPER GROSS.
I WAS SO STARVED FOR A FAMILY.
REBECCA: YEAH, THAT'S WHAT YOU WANTED.
ALIA: THAT'S WHAT I WANTED.
REBECCA: SO YOU WERE THINKING HE WAS GOING TO
GIVE YOU LIKE YOUR - IT'S LIKE WHAT THEY DO IN
DISNEY MOVIES, YOU THINK YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE
YOUR HAPPILY EVER AFTER?
ALIA: TOTALLY, A HUNDRED PERCENT.
REBECCA: HE WAS LIKE THE GUY COMING TO SAVE YOU
BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE THAT'S WHAT GIRLS WANT SO BAD.
ALIA: YEAH, A HUNDRED PERCENT, THAT'S WHAT IT WAS.
AND HE TOLD ME LIKE,
THE WAYS - THE THINGS THAT HE SAID TO GROOM ME,
LIKE HE TOLD ME THAT HE'D BEEN SEXUALLY ABUSED
WHEN HE WAS LITTLE.
LIKE, HE MADE ME FEEL LIKE I WASN'T ALONE.
REBECCA: YEAH.
THAT'S LIKE, REALLY GRADE-A MANIPULATION
RIGHT THERE.
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: SO WHEN DID IT FLIP?
ALIA: LIKE WHEN DID HE START ACTUALLY TRAFFICKING ME?
REBECCA: YEAH.
ALIA: YEAH.
SO IT WAS ABOUT SIX MONTHS AFTER THAT.
SO I WAS ABOUT TO BE 14.
AND HE HAD ALREADY MADE IT SEEM REALLY NORMAL.
HE ACTUALLY TOLD ME - SO I WOULD RUN AWAY AND WE
WOULD GET HOTEL ROOMS, AND THINGS LIKE THAT,
AND THEN I WOULD COME HOME.
BUT HE TOLD ME THAT - IT ACTUALLY TOOK ME YEARS TO
REALIZE THAT THIS WAS A LIE - HE TOLD ME THAT HE
WAS GETTING A LOT OF THIS MONEY FROM SLEEPING WITH
OLDER WOMEN, AND THAT THEY WOULD GIVE HIM MONEY
TO DO THIS.
AND SO I LIKE - HE TOLD ME LIKE, YOU KNOW,
I'VE BEEN DOING THIS FOR YOU.
I NEED YOU TO DO THIS FOR ME.
AND I HAVE THIS FRIEND, RIGHT,
WHO'S WILLING TO PAY THIS MUCH MONEY
TO HAVE SEX WITH YOU.
AND HE ALREADY MADE THAT SEEM NORMAL,
HE HAD BROUGHT ME AROUND ADULT WOMEN WHO WORKED IN
STRIP CLUBS, LIKE HE MADE IT SEEM LIKE EVERYBODY
ELSE WAS DOING THIS, AND,
WELL, YOU WERE ALREADY DOING THIS BEFORE,
LIKE YOU WERE HAVING SEX WITH PEOPLE TO GET ALCOHOL
OR TO HAVE A PLACE TO STAY FOR THE NIGHT.
YOU'RE ALREADY DOING THAT.
SO WHEN HE ASKED ME TO DO THAT,
IT WAS LIKE - AND I'M 13, AGAIN,
AT THIS - LIKE MY MIND WAS SO MANIPULATED.
BUT IT WAS LIKE, OH, OKAY.
I GUESS I COULD DO THAT FOR YOU.
AND THERE WAS STILL THIS FATHER WOUND.
SO EVEN THOUGH I THOUGHT I WAS IN LOVE WITH HIM AND
THAT HE WAS LIKE MY BOYFRIEND, AT THAT AGE,
I WAS STILL LIKE MIXING THOSE THINGS
WITH FATHERING, RIGHT.
SO I ALSO LIKE -
REBECCA: BECAUSE HE WAS OLDER.
ALIA: HE WAS OLDER.
REBECCA: BUT HE WAS LIKE,
I'M TAKING CARE OF YOU.
SO THAT WAS LIKE A FATHER, MM-HM.
ALIA: IT WAS.
YEAH.
AND SO THERE WAS THIS DESIRE TO LIKE MAKE HIM HAPPY.
AND THEN TO KEEP ALL OF THAT VALIDATION AND TO KEEP -
REBECCA: YOU DIDN'T WANT TO LOSE THAT.
ALIA: NO.
IT FELT LIKE, I'M GOING TO BE COMPLETELY ALONE
IN THIS WORLD, AGAIN, IF I DON'T HAVE HIM.
AND SO HE TRAFFICKED ME TO THAT ONE PERSON THAT ONE NIGHT,
AND JUST SHOWERED ME WITH PRAISE AFTERWARDS.
AND JUST TOLD ME LIKE, YOU DID SO GOOD
AND I'M SO PROUD OF YOU.
IT'S SICK!
REBECCA: UGH, IT'S SO MESSED UP.
ALIA: IT'S SICK.
REBECCA: DID YOU FEEL LIKE - DID YOU IN THE MOMENT
FEEL LIKE SOMETHING WAS OFF OR WERE YOU SO LIKE
IN A CLOUD OF CONFUSION THAT YOU DIDN'T
EVEN PROBABLY PUT TWO AND TWO TOGETHER?
ALIA: I KNEW THAT IT LIKE HURT INTERNALLY,
THAT IT LIKE HURT MY HEART.
BUT SO DID EVERY OTHER TIME THAT I WAS ABUSED.
REBECCA: YEAH.
IT WAS LIKE A SIMILAR FEELING.
ALIA: YEAH.
IT WAS LIKE, WELL, THIS ISN'T REALLY ANY DIFFERENT.
AND AT LEAST LIKE HE - LOOK AT HOW HAPPY HE IS, RIGHT.
IT WAS ENOUGH TO LIKE MAKE THOSE THINGS BE QUIETER
AND JUST CONTINUE TO BELIEVE LIKE,
THIS IS JUST WHAT MY LIFE IS LIKE.
OTHER PEOPLE'S LIVES ARE DIFFERENT,
AND THIS IS WHAT IT'S LIKE FOR ME.
REBECCA: BUT HE WAS NOT - SO THE LIE WAS,
HE WAS NOT SLEEPING WITH ANYONE TO GET MONEY?
ALIA: YEAH, HE WAS NOT.
REBECCA: WAS HE TRAFFICKING OTHER WOMEN?
ALIA: I DON'T THINK AT THE SAME TIME AS ME.
I REALLY DON'T KNOW.
WE LOOK BACK AT LIKE THAT YOUNG TEENAGE MIND,
AND I KNOW THAT I REMEMBER THINGS DIFFERENT
THAN WHAT THEY WERE IN SOME SITUATIONS.
SO I DON'T KNOW.
NOT THAT I KNEW OF, BUT HE WAS INVOLVED WITH OTHER PEOPLE
THAT WERE TRAFFICKING PEOPLE.
REBECCA: BUT HE WAS NOT SELLING HIMSELF,
THAT WAS THE LIE.
HE WAS TRYING TO NORMALIZE IT TO YOU AND HE'S LIKE,
LOOK, I DO THIS.
YOU CAN DO IT, TOO.
ALIA: MM-HM, YEAH.
REBECCA: OKAY.
ALIA: AND I DIDN'T - IT TOOK ME YEARS TO EVEN
BELIEVE OR UNDERSTAND THAT,
BECAUSE IT FELT SO TRUE.
AND IT WAS WHEN I FIRST STARTED SHARING MY STORY.
MY BEST FRIEND WAS IN THE ROOM WITH ME AS I WAS
DOING AN INTERVIEW, LIKE ONLINE, AND I SAID THAT,
WELL, HE WAS SELLING HIMSELF,
AND SHE LOOKED AT ME FROM THE OTHER ROOM
AND WAS LIKE...
REBECCA: NO, HE WASN'T.
ALIA: AND IT CLICKED. ALL OF A SUDDEN,
IT CLICKED LIKE, OH, MY GOSH,
THAT WAS THE GROOMING, ALSO.
YEAH.
REBECCA: OH, DANG.
OKAY. SO WHAT HAPPENS FROM THERE?
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: SO YOU'RE 14.
ALIA: I WAS 14 AT THIS POINT,
AND IT JUST KEPT GOING.
REBECCA: HOW LONG WERE YOU WITH HIM FOR?
ALIA: UNTIL I WAS 18.
AND THERE WAS LIKE A PERIOD OF TIME -
REBECCA: WERE YOU STILL GOING TO SCHOOL AND STUFF?
ALIA: SOMETIMES.
I DIDN'T GRADUATE TENTH GRADE.
REBECCA: OKAY.
ALIA: SO THERE WAS A PERIOD -
WELL, MAYBE TENTH - I THINK I STOPPED WHEN I WAS GOING
INTO 11TH GRADE, SO I GRADUATED TENTH GRADE.
REBECCA: DID YOU RUN AWAY WITH HIM?
ALIA: I WOULD RUN AWAY WITH HIM.
YEAH.
OR WITH BUYERS THAT HE HAD SET UP FOR ME.
AND THERE WAS A PERIOD OF TIME WHERE
HE WENT TO JAIL FOR SIX MONTHS,
AND I STARTED GETTING BACK INTO SCHOOL AND THINGS
WERE GOING WELL.
AND THEN HE GOT OUT OF JAIL,
AND THINGS WENT RIGHT BACK TO THE WAY THEY WERE
BECAUSE I WAS SO BONDED TO LIKE THE AFFIRMATION
AND AFFECTION.
REBECCA: YEAH, LIKE A SOUL TIE.
ALIA: IT WAS.
AND A TRAUMA BOND.
REBECCA: YEAH, TRAUMA BOND.
ALIA: A REALLY COMPLICATED RELATIONSHIP
AND BELIEF IN MY HEAD.
AND SO THIS KEPT HAPPENING UNTIL I WAS 18.
AND MY FAMILY HAD PUT ME IN A PROGRAM IN UTAH,
WHICH WAS JUST HORRENDOUS.
LIKE THE TROUBLED TEEN INDUSTRY -
REBECCA: WAIT, WAS IT ONE OF THOSE WEIRD PROGRAMS
WHERE THEY LIKE - I WAS JUST WATCHING
DOCUMENTARIES ABOUT THAT.
OH, NO.
SO IT JUST ADDED TO IT.
ALIA: IT DID, UNFORTUNATELY.
REBECCA: UGH.
I THINK THOSE PARENTS WERE TOLD THAT IT WAS GOING TO HELP,
BUT THEY DIDN'T REALIZE THAT THOSE -
THEY'RE ALWAYS IN UTAH.
ANYWAYS, I'M GOING OFF ON A SIDE NOTE.
SO WHAT WAS IT LIKE?
WAS IT LIKE - DID THEY CAPTURE YOU
IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT?
ALIA: YEP.
REBECCA: YOU DID ONE OF THOSE?
ALIA: THEY CAPTURED ME IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT,
AND HANDCUFFED ME IN A CAR.
REBECCA: NO!
ALIA: AND DROVE ME TO UTAH.
REBECCA: OF COURSE.
ALIA: AND LIKE, LORD, BLESS MY FAMILY, THEY,
MY GRANDMA, SHE HAD BEEN TOLD THAT IT WAS GOING TO HELP
AND THAT I WAS GOING TO GET ALL THIS CARE,
AND THEY SPENT - THEY'RE NOT CHEAP.
REBECCA: NO, THEY'RE EXPENSIVE.
ALIA: THEY SPENT THEIR ENTIRE LIFE SAVINGS.
THEY GATHERED MONEY FROM FRIENDS.
LIKE THEY DID ALL THESE THINGS TO TRY AND HELP ME.
AND IT WAS HORRENDOUS.
IT WAS ABSOLUTELY HORRENDOUS.
REBECCA: HOW OLD WERE YOU WHEN THEY CAME FOR YOU?
ALIA: I WAS 17.
REBECCA: OH, GOSH.
ALIA: AND MY FAMILY WAS JUST TRYING TO KEEP ME ALIVE.
THEY WERE REALLY JUST TRYING TO KEEP ME ALIVE.
AND AT THIS POINT, MY GRANDMA LIKE KNEW WHAT WAS
HAPPENING TO ME, BUT THEY DIDN'T HAVE -
NOBODY WAS TALKING ABOUT TRAFFICKING.
REBECCA: NO, NOT BACK THEN.
NO ONE KNEW WHAT IT WAS.
ALIA: SO SHE DIDN'T KNOW THAT.
THERE WEREN'T SERVICES AVAILABLE.
SHE KNEW THAT LIKE THIS GUY WAS FORCING ME
INTO PROSTITUTION.
THAT'S LIKE WHAT SHE THOUGHT IN HER HEAD,
BUT THEY DIDN'T HAVE LANGUAGE FOR LIKE,
OH, THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS A CHILD
INVOLVED IN PROSTITUTION.
THEY DIDN'T KNOW THAT.
SO SHE WAS JUST TRYING TO KEEP ME ALIVE.
AND SO I TURNED 18 IN THAT PROGRAM.
AND THEY HAD DONE A LOT OF DAMAGE THERE.
AND SO I CAME OUT WORSE THAN I WENT IN.
REBECCA: UGH, OH, NO!
ALIA: LIKE, THEY HAD - I HAD NOT BEEN ALLOWED
TO TALK TO MY FAMILY IN LIKE SIX MONTHS,
EVEN THE SAFE FAMILY THAT CARED ABOUT ME.
MY MOM WAS IN PRISON AT THIS TIME.
LIKE THINGS WERE JUST SO MUCH WORSE WHEN I LEFT
THAT I REALLY BELIEVED LIKE, YOU KNOW WHAT,
MY FAMILY HASN'T BEEN THERE FOR ME,
THEY SENT ME TO THIS PLACE.
BUT GUESS WHO'S GOING TO BE THERE FOR ME?
REBECCA: THE GUY.
ALIA: THE GUY.
AND I LEFT, AND FOUR DAYS AFTER I GOT HOME
FROM THAT PROGRAM, I WAS BACK WITH HIM.
AND HE DROPPED ME OFF AT A STRIP CLUB,
BECAUSE I WAS 18 AT THIS POINT, RIGHT.
HE JUST DROPPED ME OFF AT THE STRIP CLUB AND WAS LIKE,
THIS IS WHERE YOU'RE GOING TO BE TONIGHT,
LIKE GO IN THERE AND MAKE MONEY,
AND COME BACK OUT AND GIVE IT TO ME.
AND SO IT WAS LIKE, PICKED UP RIGHT BACK WHERE HE LEFT OFF,
EXCEPT FOR THIS TIME, I WAS 18.
AND SO THAT MEANS...
REBECCA: SO HE COULD DO MORE.
ALIA: HE COULD DO MORE, AND IT MEANT THAT LIKE
THE POLICE WEREN'T LOOKING FOR ME ANYMORE.
REBECCA: DID HE TAKE ALL THE MONEY?
ALIA: HE TOOK EVERYTHING.
REBECCA: UGH.
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: THIS IS SO BAD.
ALIA: HE DID.
HE WOULD LIKE TAKE ME TO GET MY NAILS DONE
OR LIKE TAKE ME TO GO SHOPPING, AND THAT WAS ENOUGH LIKE,
AS A TEENAGE GIRL, RIGHT.
LIKE, YOU'RE NOT USED TO HAVING MONEY.
IT'S LIKE...
REBECCA: SO THIS IS HOW YOU'RE BEING TRAFFICKED,
BECAUSE IT WAS LIKE YOU WERE WORKING,
HE WAS USING YOU TO MAKE ALL THIS MONEY,
AND IT WAS ALL GOING TO HIM.
ALIA: YEAH, IT WAS ALL GOING TO HIM.
YEAH.
REBECCA: SO WHAT HAPPENED?
SO YOU BROKE OFF WITH HIM AT 18,
WHAT HAPPENED THERE?
ALIA: YEAH.
SO I HEARD ANOTHER SURVIVOR PUT IT THIS WAY,
AND SO I'VE STOLEN THE WAY THAT SHE PUT IT, WAS,
AS I GOT OLDER, MY NEEDS CHANGED,
AND SO MY TRAFFICKERS CHANGED.
REBECCA: OH, WOW.
ALIA: RIGHT.
AND SO LIKE HE WANTED TO DO THINGS IN THIS WAY
OF ME BEING AT THE STRIP CLUB.
AND ONCE I WAS INTRODUCED TO THE STRIP CLUB,
I WAS LIKE, THEY SOLD ME A WHOLE 'NOTHER LIE
OF GLAMOUR, RIGHT.
AND I'D BEEN A MINOR WHO WAS BEING TRAFFICKED IN
LIKE REALLY NASTY HOTEL ROOMS AND REALLY
DIRTY SITUATIONS, AND NOW I WAS IN THIS SCRIP CLUB
WITH THESE GIRLS THAT WERE TELLING ME LIKE,
OH, THEY'RE LIKE, I CAN TEACH YOU SOMETHING BETTER,
LIKE I CAN INTRODUCE YOU TO A BETTER GUY,
LIKE THIS GUY'S LIKE LIVING IN HIS CAR,
LIKE YOU'RE GOING TO LET HIM DO, YOU KNOW.
AND SO I REALLY FELL FOR JUST THAT LIE OF GLAMOUR
AND LIKE, HEY, THIS IS WHERE GIRLS LIKE US
COME TO GET THEIR LIFE TOGETHER.
LIKE, THIS IS WHAT YOU'VE BEEN WORKING FOR,
THIS IS BETTER THAN WHAT'S BEEN HAPPENING TO YOU.
AND SO, BUT YOU PUT YOURSELF IN THOSE SITUATIONS
OR YOU GET PUT IN THOSE SITUATIONS.
AND IT'S NOT SAFE PEOPLE THAT YOU'RE AROUND, RIGHT.
AND SO I MET SOMEBODY IN THE STRIP CLUB
WHO SAID THE SAME THING, LIKE, WHY ARE YOU HERE?
LIKE, YOU'RE TOO PRETTY TO BE WORKING UNTIL
4:00 O'CLOCK IN THE MORNING.
YOU SHOULD COME WORK WITH ME IN LIKE,
HE CALLED IT "MODELING".
COME WORK FOR ME IN "MODELING."
REBECCA: THAT'S WHAT THEY ALWAYS CALL IT.
ALIA: EXACTLY.
REBECCA: WHICH SOUNDS GLAMOROUS.
ALIA: IT DOES!
IT DOES SOUND GLAMOROUS.
AND I, FOR A KID WHO THOSE THINGS HAD BEEN SO OUT OF REACH
AND WHO REALLY LIKE WANTED TO BE TOLD
THAT THEY WERE VALUABLE AND BEAUTIFUL,
THAT WAS - LIKE, THAT SEEMED REALLY ATTRACTIVE.
AND THEN THE MODELING WASN'T MODELING.
IT WAS PORN.
AND IT WAS ANOTHER - LIKE, HE INTRODUCED ME TO
HIS GIRLFRIEND WHO WAS INVOLVED.
AND SHE LIKE MADE IT SEEM LIKE IT WAS ALL JUST ALL THAT
AND A BAG OF CHIPS, RIGHT, LIKE IT WAS,
OH, ALL THOSE THINGS HAPPENED TO ME WHEN I WAS YOUNG.
I WAS LIKE - I HAD A BOYFRIEND WHO DID THAT TO ME.
MY MOM'S BOYFRIEND DID THAT TO ME.
AND NOW LOOK AT ME AND LOOK AT THIS HOUSE
THAT I LIVE IN.
AT THIS POINT, I'M A SINGLE MOM, RIGHT,
LIKE I HAVE A LITTLE BABY AND I'M LIKE LIVING IN
SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA, COULD BARELY PAY RENT
WITHOUT THAT KIND OF STUFF.
AND SO THEY LIKE HAD ME SIGN THIS CONTRACT,
AND I ESSENTIALLY LIKE SIGNED ME WHOLE LIFE OVER.
REBECCA: OH, MY GOSH.
ALIA: MM-HM.
REBECCA: DID YOU REALIZE WHAT YOU WERE DOING
WHEN YOU SIGNED IT?
ALIA: NO.
I LIKE - I HAD -
REBECCA: YOU JUST HAD THE PROMISE OF A BETTER LIFE.
ALIA: I HAD THE PROMISE OF A BETTER LIFE.
AND NO.
LIKE, I HADN'T FINISHED HIGH SCHOOL,
I DIDN'T KNOW LIKE WHAT TO LOOK FOR IN A CONTRACT.
REBECCA: YOU HAD TO MAKE MONEY,
YOU HAD A BABY.
ALIA: AND I FELT LIKE I COULD TRUST THIS GIRL, TOO.
REBECCA: YEAH.
SO HE USED THE GIRL TO SELL...
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: WAS SHE BEING TRAFFICKED TOO,
OR WAS SHE JUST IN A RELATIONSHIP WITH HIM?
ALIA: I DON'T KNOW.
THEY'RE KIND OF ALL - THE HARD THING ABOUT THE PORN INDUSTRY
IS THEY'RE ALL - IT'S ALL MIXED UP TOGETHER, RIGHT.
LIKE, THOSE LINES ARE REALLY BLURRY, YEAH.
AND THAT'S WHAT TRAFFICKERS,
FROM THE HIGHEST, THAT'S WHAT EPSTEIN DID WITH,
GOSH, HOW DO YOU PRONOUNCE THAT LADY'S NAME?
I DON'T KNOW I'VE EVER SAID IT OUT LOUD.
REBECCA: GHISLAINE MAXWELL.
ALIA: THAT'S WHAT - LIKE SHE'S ACCOUNTABLE FOR
THE THINGS THAT SHE DID, BUT HE GROOMED HER, TOO,
AND USED A WOMAN TO DO THAT.
AND THAT'S WHAT WE SEE WITH LIKE TRAFFICKERS,
LIKE THE ONE THAT I HAD WITH VERY YOUNG GIRLS
AND SENDING THEM INTO GROUP HOMES TO RECRUIT OTHER GIRLS.
LIKE, WE SEE THAT TRAFFICKERS USE OTHER PEOPLE
WHO HAVE BEEN VICTIMIZED IN THE SAME WAY
TO GROOM AND TO MAKE IT SEEM NORMAL.
REBECCA: SO THE WORLD REALLY MUCH OPERATES IN
LIKE SECRECY, MANIPULATION,
GOING AFTER BASICALLY VULNERABLE, ABUSED PEOPLE.
AND IT'S LIKE A PERPETUAL CYCLE.
AND SO YOU SIGNED THIS CONTRACT TO DO PORN?
LIKE...
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: HOW LONG WAS THE CONTRACT FOR?
LIKE WHAT WAS LIKE - WERE YOU STUCK?
LIKE, DID YOU HAVE TO PAY OFF A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF MONEY?
HOW DID IT WORK?
ALIA: SO I STILL DON'T REMEMBER A LOT OF THE THINGS
IN THE CONTRACT, BECAUSE I REALLY DIDN'T READ IT.
THE THINGS THAT I DO REMEMBER -
REBECCA: WELL, THOSE THINGS ARE INTENSE, ANYWAY.
ALIA: IT IS!
REBECCA: YOU'RE YOUNG AND YOU'RE JUST DESPERATE
TO MAKE MONEY.
YOU'RE LIKE, SURE, I'LL SIGN IT.
OH, GOSH, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW.
ALIA: A HUNDRED PERCENT.
AND I WAS SO USED TO LIKE...
REBECCA: IT'S NOT LIKE YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A LAWYER
YOU'RE GOING TO CALL UP AND BE LIKE,
HEY, CAN YOU CHECK OUT THIS CONTACT FOR ME?
ALIA: NO.
BUT, OF COURSE, THEY HAD A LAWYER WHO WROTE IT, RIGHT.
REBECCA: MM-HM.
BECAUSE THEY'RE PROFESSIONALS.
ALIA: MM-HM.
AND, OF COURSE, THE LAWYER WHO WROTE IT WORKED FOR THEM.
AND SO IT'S MEANT TO PROTECT THEM, RIGHT?
REBECCA: AND EXPLOIT YOU.
ALIA: AND SO I DON'T REMEMBER THE LENGTH OF TIME
OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT,
BUT IT WAS LIKE THEY HAVE ALL RIGHTS TO EVERYTHING
THAT WAS PRODUCED, AND THERE WERE CERTAIN
EXPECTATIONS ON ME, LIKE MY PHYSICAL BODY,
LIKE PHYSICAL EXPECTATIONS OF WHAT I COULD DO WITH
MY HAIR AND WITH MY BODY AND LIKE WEIGHT-WISE,
AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
REBECCA: DANG.
ALIA: PLASTIC SURGERY.
LIKE NOT ALLOWING LIKE, NOT THAT I WANTED TO,
AT THAT TIME, BUT LIKE THERE WERE THINGS IN THERE ABOUT
LIKE, IF YOU WERE GOING TO HAVE PLASTIC SURGERY,
YOU HAD TO GET IT APPROVED BY YOUR MANAGER.
LIKE SO THIS PERSON REALLY HAD CONTROL
OVER YOUR BODY, RIGHT.
IT ALSO HAD, LIKE, I HAD TO PAY HIM A CERTAIN AMOUNT
OF MONEY FROM EVERY SHOOT.
AND THEN I WOULD GET SOME OF IT.
AND TO ME, THAT FELT LIKE, I'M GOING TO GET
SOME OF THIS MONEY, RIGHT.
LIKE I WAS ALREADY USED TO HAVING SOMEBODY THAT WAS
GOING TO TAKE MY MONEY.
I WAS ALREADY USED TO LIKE EXCHANGING SEX FOR MONEY.
LIKE THESE THINGS SEEMED REALLY NORMAL.
AND IN MY HEAD, IT WAS KINDA SOLD TO ME LIKE -
REBECCA: LIKE A STEP UP.
LIKE, OH, YOU GET SOME OF THE MONEY NOW.
WELL, THIS IS A NICER ENVIRONMENT.
ALIA: YEAH.
FOR LIKE A GIRL LIKE YOU, THIS IS THE BEST
IT'S GOING TO BE.
THIS IS THE BEST THAT'S OUT THERE FOR YOU.
AND LIKE THIS IS THE ONLY ACCESS TO LIKE A CAREER,
LIKE THE WAY THEY SOLD IT.
AND THEY ALSO, JUST LIKE MY ORIGINAL TRAFFICKER,
SOLD IT LIKE THE IDEA OF FAMILY.
REBECCA: OH, REALLY?
SO THEY PULLED THAT ANGLE ON YOU AGAIN?
ALIA: YEAH.
AND WE'RE A FAMILY HERE.
LIKE, LET'S GO GET OUR NAILS DONE TOGETHER
AND LIKE LET'S GO DO ALL OF THESE THINGS.
AND IT WAS THE SAME LIE COMING FROM A DIFFERENT MOUTH.
AND SO THAT CONTRACT THAT I SIGNED WAS STEPPING INTO
THIS ENTIRE INDUSTRY THAT IS REALLY
BUILT ON TRAFFICKING.
LIKE, PEOPLE WANT TO BELIEVE THAT THAT
INDUSTRY HAS A LOT OF CONSENT.
AND I THINK THERE ARE A LOT OF GIRLS WHO THINK
THAT THEY'RE CONSENTING.
I WOULD HAVE TOLD YOU LIKE, NO, THIS IS GREAT.
LIKE, I WOULD HAVE TOLD YOU I WAS THERE
COMPLETELY OF FREE WILL.
IN FACT, WHEN YOU'RE IN A FILM, THEY VIDEOTAPE YOU,
AND YOU HAVE TO DO LIKE THIS CONSENT TAPE,
WHICH SAYS LIKE, HI, THIS IS MY NAME,
I'M HERE LIKE OF MY OWN FREE WILL,
THERE'S NO DRUGS HERE, I'M NOT ON ANY DRUGS,
NOBODY'S FORCING ME TO DO ANY OF THESE THINGS.
AND YOU HAVE TO DO THAT TO GET PAID.
AND, LIKE, THERE CAN BE A TABLE FULL OF COKE,
LIKE JUST OUT OF FRAME, RIGHT.
AND SO ALL OF THOSE THINGS THAT,
THOSE LEGAL THINGS THAT THEY SAY,
PEOPLE ARE THERE FOR CONSENT,
IT'S JUST NOT TRUE.
AND NOBODY IN PORN HAS TAKEN A COURSE
ON WHAT CONSENT IS.
LIKE NO ONE KNOWS.
I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT CONSENT WAS.
LIKE, I THOUGHT AS LONG AS I WASN'T BEING LIKE
PHYSICALLY HELD DOWN OR TIED TO SOMETHING,
THAT I WAS CONSENTING.
I DIDN'T KNOW LIKE WHAT COERCION WAS
OR HOW I COULD BE MANIPULATED.
AND THE ENTIRE PORN INDUSTRY RUNS ON
MANIPULATION AND COERCION.
REBECCA: YEAH.
SO HOW LONG WERE YOU IN THAT WORLD FOR?
ALIA: SO I WAS ALWAYS IN AND OUT OF THAT WORLD.
LIKE I WOULD BE IN FOR A LITTLE WHILE AND THEN MY LIFE
WOULD JUST GET SO, SO MESSY THAT I WOULD BE OUT
FOR A LITTLE WHILE, BUT I WOULD STILL BE LIKE
AT THE STRIP CLUB OR I WOULD HAVE A BOYFRIEND
THAT WAS TRAFFICKING ME.
THE NEXT LIKE, FROM 20 TO 27, I WAS IN AND OUT OF EITHER
A RELATIONSHIP WHERE I WAS BEING TRAFFICKED,
OR A RELATIONSHIP WHERE SOMEBODY TOLD ME LIKE,
YOU DON'T HAVE TO LIVE THAT WAY ANYMORE,
YOU DON'T HAVE TO BE IN PORN ANYMORE,
I'M GOING TO TAKE CARE OF YOU.
AND I WOULD GO INTO THOSE RELATIONSHIPS,
BUT THEY WERE ALWAYS LIKE WITH SOMEBODY WHO WAS
REALLY PHYSICALLY ABUSIVE.
AND IT WAS LIKE A CYCLE.
IT WAS LIKE I WAS DOING THE SAME THING,
OVER AND OVER.
REBECCA: JUST ONE THING OR THE OTHER.
ALIA: MM-HM. OVER AND OVER.
REBECCA: HOW LONG WERE YOU WITH THAT GUY
AND THE GIRLFRIEND WITH THE CONTRACT?
ALIA: SO THEY WERE LIKE MY MANAGER WHEN I WAS IN
AND OUT OF PORN THAT WHOLE TIME.
REBECCA: SO THEY WERE BENEFITING THE WHOLE TIME.
ALIA: YEAH.
WHEN I WOULD DO PORN.
AND THEN I WOULD LIKE GO INTO A DIFFERENT
RELATIONSHIP OR WHATEVER.
BUT I WAS IN AND OUT OF THEIR "MANAGEMENT COMPANY"
FROM 20 TO 27.
REBECCA: SO WHAT WAS THE PORN WORLD LIKE?
SO YOU SAID THERE'S A LOT OF DRUGS.
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: SO A LOT OF PEOPLE THERE ARE BEING MANIPULATIVE,
EVEN IF THEY SAY THAT THEY'RE THERE
OF THEIR FREE WILL, A LOT OF GIRLS AND GUYS?
ALIA: AND MEN.
REBECCA: REALLY?
ALIA: YEAH. I HAVE A MALE,
A FRIEND WHO WAS A MALE PORN PERFORMER,
AND HE'S A PASTOR IN OHIO NOW
WITH LIKE, IT'S BEAUTIFUL.
HIS NAME IS JOSHUA BROOME.
HE'S INCREDIBLE.
AND LIKE, IT'S SO INTERESTING WHEN WE TALK ABOUT
OUR EXPERIENCES TOGETHER THAT LIKE FROM
THE MALE SIDE, HE WAS DEALING WITH SO MUCH
OF THE SAME THINGS.
AND THEY WILL MANIPULATE YOU.
SO YOU WALK INTO PORN AND YOU HAVE THESE CERTAIN THINGS
THAT YOU SAY YOU WON'T DO, RIGHT.
LIKE, I WON'T DO THESE KINDS OF SCENES,
I WON'T DO THESE KINDS OF SEX ACTS,
I WON'T DO THOSE THINGS.
REBECCA: DID YOU STIPULATE THAT
BEFORE YOU DID YOURS?
ALIA: YEAH.
AND THEY TELL YOU, YOU CAN DO THOSE.
LIKE THAT'S FINE, LIKE HAVE YOUR NO LIST,
IS WHAT THEY CALL IT.
AND THEN AS TIME GOES ON, THEY START TO LIKE
MANIPULATE YOUR NO LIST LOWER AND LOWER.
WELL, I CAN'T BOOK YOU THINGS ANYMORE.
LIKE, YOU CAN'T - I CAN'T GET YOU WORK ANYMORE
BECAUSE YOU'RE TOO LIKE YOU'RE TOO GOOD
FOR ALL OF THIS.
YOU'RE TOO GOOD TO DO THIS OR THAT.
AND THEY'LL SAY THOSE THINGS AND BEAT YOU DOWN
TO WHERE YOU FEEL LIKE, OKAY,
WELL, I GUESS I HAVE TO SAY YES
OR ELSE I'M OUT ON MY BUTT.
LIKE, I CAN'T WORK ANYMORE AND I'VE GOT KIDS
AND, LIKE, I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO.
AND SO I GUESS, OKAY, LIKE I GUESS I'LL DO THAT.
I'LL DO THAT THING THAT I SAID I WOULDN'T DO.
AND THAT'S COERCION.
LIKE, THAT'S MANIPULATION.
AND FOR SOMETHING TO BE TRAFFICKING,
IT HAS TO HAVE FORCED FRAUD OR COERCION, RIGHT.
AND SO THE WHOLE PORN INDUSTRY RUNS ON COERCION.
I REMEMBER -
REBECCA: WAS IT A SAFE ENVIRONMENT?
ALIA: NO.
REBECCA: OKAY.
ALIA: THEY'RE NOT A SAFE ENVIRONMENT.
REBECCA: BECAUSE THEY ALWAYS TRY TO SAY THAT, TOO.
THEY SAY IT'S SAFE AND CLEAN, BUT I'M LIKE,
I HIGHLY DOUBT IT.
ALIA: NO. IT'S NOT.
IT'S NOT SAFE.
LIKE, YOU HAVE TO GET TESTED AND THINGS LIKE THAT,
BUT - AND SO I'D SAY IT'S PROBABLY MORE SAFE
IN THAT WAY THAN IN OTHER WAYS.
BUT THERE'S A LOT OF SEXUAL ASSAULT THAT HAPPENS.
AND IT'S NOT THE MEN IN LIKE THAT PEOPLE ARE
WATCHING IN PORN THAT ARE PERPETUATING
THE SEXUAL ASSAULTS.
LIKE, THOSE MEN ARE BEING VICTIMIZED IN SO MANY WAYS.
SO MANY OF THEM ARE TRAFFICKED OFF-SCREEN.
IT'S REALLY AWFUL, THE THINGS THAT HAPPEN TO THE MEN
THAT ARE PERFORMING.
THE PEOPLE THAT ARE PERPETUATING THE SEXUAL ASSAULTS
OFF-CAMERA ARE THE PRODUCERS AND THE MANAGERS.
LIKE, THEY ARE LIKE ASKING LIKE WILL FORCE GIRLS
AND MEN INTO SEX ACTS OFF-CAMERA THAT THEY DON'T
WANT TO PARTICIPATE IN.
AND SO THERE'S A LOT OF VIOLENCE THAT HAPPENS OFF-SCREEN,
AND A LOT OF LIKE, CONTRACT COERCION.
AND SO THEY'LL HOLD THAT CONTRACT THAT YOU DON'T
REALLY REMEMBER, BECAUSE YOU'RE PROBABLY HIGH
WHEN YOU SIGNED IT OR YOU WERE 20 OR YOU WERE 18,
AND HAVE NEVER LOOKED AT A CONTRACT BEFORE IN YOUR LIFE.
AND THEY'LL HOLD THAT CONTRACT AND BE LIKE,
WELL, IF YOU DON'T - YOU SIGNED ON TO DO
X MANY FILMS OR WHATEVER, AND IF YOU DON'T,
WE'RE GOING TO SUE YOU.
AND SO THEY'RE FORCING PEOPLE TO STAY
IN THESE SITUATIONS.
REBECCA: I KNOW PORN IS SUCH A HUGE PROBLEM,
AND IT'S A HUGE PROBLEM IN THE CHURCH.
AND MY HEART GOES OUT TO ANYONE THAT STRUGGLES WITH IT,
BECAUSE SO MANY PEOPLE, ONCE AGAIN,
GET EXPOSED TO IT VERY YOUNG AND THEY GET
ADDICTED TO IT.
BUT I DON'T THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE KNOW WHAT THAT WORLD
IS LIKE AND HOW MOST OF THOSE PEOPLE ARE VICTIMS.
AND WHAT'S SO CRAZY IS THAT LIKE IN TODAY'S AGE,
WHAT YOU ALWAYS HEAR ABOUT IS LIKE ONLYFANS,
YOU HAVE ALL THESE ONLYFAN GIRLS AND GUYS
THAT ARE LIKE, THIS IS GREAT.
I LOVE THIS.
IT ACTUALLY MAKES ME REALLY SAD.
ALIA: IT IS REALLY SAD.
REBECCA: LIKE I LOOK AT THE GENERATION,
GEN Z UNDER US, AND THEN EVEN YOUNGER,
AND I'M SEEING THESE GIRLS WHO ARE LIKE IN GEN Z,
AND THEY'RE BEING, WHAT'S THE WORD,
THEY'RE BEING INFLUENCED TO GO ON ONLYFANS,
BECAUSE THE GIRLS -
ALIA: BEING GROOMED.
REBECCA: YEAH.
THEY'RE BEING LIKE TOLD, THIS IS SO GREAT.
AND SO THE ONLY THING YOU EVER HEAR ABOUT PORN IS
LIKE THE POSITIVE SIDE, WHICH, REALLY,
THERE REALLY IS NO POSITIVE SIDE.
WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO ALL OF THAT?
BECAUSE YOU WERE ACTUALLY IN THAT WORLD,
SO YOU CAN SPEAK TO IT.
ALIA: YEAH.
THEY THRIVE ON DECEPTION, RIGHT.
AND LIKE [ SIGHS ] THEY THRIVE ON THIS IDEA
THAT PEOPLE ARE FOR CONSUMPTION.
AND THAT'S JUST NOT WHAT WE WERE CREATED FOR.
LIKE EVEN IF YOU'RE NOT A BELIEVER,
LIKE NOBODY WAS CREATED TO LIKE BE HURT, RIGHT,
OR TO BE CONSUMED IN THAT WAY.
REBECCA: TO BE USED.
ALIA: TO BE USED.
REBECCA: WE WEREN'T DESIGNED TO BE USED IN ANY FORM.
THERE'S NOTHING EMPOWERING.
ALIA: THERE ISN'T.
REBECCA: THAT'S THE LIE.
ALIA: AND THAT IS THE LIE.
AND I LOVE THAT YOU BROUGHT THAT UP,
BECAUSE THAT IS THE LIE.
AND THAT'S THE THING THAT THEY SAY.
LIKE, THIS IS HOW, AND ESPECIALLY FOR A GIRL,
LIKE TO ME, LIKE ESPECIALLY A GIRL WHO'S,
YOUR POWER HAS BEEN TAKEN FROM YOU,
LIKE YOU'VE EXPERIENCED THIS THING.
THIS IS TIME TO GET YOUR POWER BACK.
THIS IS EMPOWERMENT.
THEN TELL ME WHY, IF THOSE SITUATIONS WERE EMPOWERED,
WHY DID I LEAVE ALMOST EVERY SINGLE SHOE
OR EVERY SINGLE TRAFFICKING EXPERIENCE, OR WHEN I WAS
IN THE STRIP CLUB, TO GO AND SLEEP WITH SOMEBODY
I WAS CHOOSING TO SLEEP WITH?
BECAUSE IT WASN'T EMPOWERING.
BECAUSE IT FELT LIKE MY CHOICE WAS BEING TAKEN AWAY
BECAUSE IT WAS.
LIKE, BECAUSE IT WAS.
AND SO I WOULD GO OFF AND I WOULD LIKE SELF-MEDICATE
BY HAVING SEX WITH SOMEBODY ELSE WHO I FELT
LIKE I WAS CHOOSING THAT BECAUSE I NEEDED
TO FEEL CHOICE AGAIN.
REBECCA: AND CONTROL.
ALIA: AND CONTROL.
BECAUSE I WASN'T IN CONTROL.
YOU'RE NOT IN CONTROL.
YOU DON'T PICK THOSE THINGS.
YOU'RE NOT DOING LIKE WHAT FEELS GOOD IN YOUR BODY.
YOU'RE DOING LIKE WHAT THE CAMERA GUY,
WHAT THE PRODUCER HAS TOLD YOU TO DO.
AND IT'S SO SAD TO THINK LIKE THAT PEOPLE ARE
LOOKING AT LIKE WHAT YOU'RE WATCHING FOR PLEASURE
IS PEOPLE IN THEIR MOST BROKEN MOMENTS.
REBECCA: VULNERABLE STATE.
ALIA: AND LIKE...
REBECCA: AND THEY'RE FAKING IT.
ALIA: AND THEY'RE FAKING IT.
THEY'RE ABSOLUTELY FAKING IT.
REBECCA: IT'S NOT EVEN REAL.
IT'S NOT EVEN REAL LIFE.
ALIA: IT'S NOT REAL LIFE AT ALL.
AND YOU DON'T KNOW WHERE THOSE PEOPLE ARE NOW, EITHER.
AND LIKE PORN IS USED TO LIKE, MY ABUSER
WHEN I WAS 4, SHOWED ME PORN.
LIKE PORN IS USED TO HURT PEOPLE.
IT'S INTRODUCED TO YOUNG KIDS LIKE IT'S JUST
REALLY HEARTBREAKING, AND IT CREATES SO MUCH BONDAGE.
THERE'S SO MANY PORN PERFORMERS
THAT COMMITTED SUICIDE.
LIKE, THERE'S SO MANY GIRLS AND MEN WHO WERE IN PORN
THAT HAVE COMMITTED SUICIDE BECAUSE
IT'S YOUR MOST BROKEN MOMENTS ON DISPLAY
FOR THE ENTIRE WORLD.
REBECCA: AND THERE'S PROBABLY A FEELING
THAT YOU CAN'T RETURN TO THE NORMAL WORKING,
EVEN IF YOU'RE TRYING TO GET OUT OF IT,
WORLD, BECAUSE IT'S LIKE,
WELL, THIS IS OUT THERE.
AND LIKE KIND OF WHAT HAPPENED TO YOUR MOM,
WE'LL USE THIS AGAINST YOU.
ONCE IT'S OUT THERE, IT COULD BE USED AGAINST YOU.
SO THERE'S THIS PRESSURE OF,
I HAVE TO STAY IN THIS INDUSTRY BECAUSE I'VE
ALREADY DONE WORK IN THIS INDUSTRY.
ALIA: YEAH, EXACTLY.
REBECCA: BECAUSE PEOPLE STRUGGLE,
I'VE HEARD DIFFERENT SURVIVORS SAY THEY STRUGGLED
TO GO BACK INTO SOCIETY BECAUSE PEOPLE...
ALIA: DEFINITELY.
REBECCA: ARE JUDGMENTAL OF THEIR PAST.
AND THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT THEY WERE COERCED
OR FORCED OR MANIPULATED INTO IT.
THEY JUST THINK, OH, THEY WILLINGLY WENT INTO IT.
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: SO YOU'RE 27.
SO THAT WAS ALMOST TEN YEARS, ON AND OFF,
THAT YOU WERE IN - WORKING IN THE PORN INDUSTRY.
AND YOU WERE BEING TRAFFICKED.
NOT JUST IN THE PORN INDUSTRY,
BUT OUTSIDE WITH LIKE WHAT YOU HAD DEALT WITH WHEN
YOU WERE LIKE A TEENAGER.
THAT'S CRAZY.
SO HOW DID YOU GET OUT?
ALIA: SO I WAS BEING TRAFFICKED BY THIS GUY.
WELL, I DID SOMETHING THAT HE, LIKE HE WENT THROUGH MY PHONE
AND HE WAS - WASN'T HAPPY WITH THE LACK OF CONTROL
THAT HE FELT BASED ON LIKE MY -
THE THINGS THAT HE SAW ON MY PHONE.
AND SO HE DROPPED ME OFF IN THIS AREA
OF SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA -
REBECCA: HOW OLD WERE YOU RIGHT AT THIS POINT?
ALIA: 27.
I'D JUST TURNED 27.
AND HE DROPPED ME OFF IN THIS LIKE AGRICULTURAL AREA
WHERE THERE WERE THESE - ALL THESE FIELDS.
AND AT THIS POINT, I'D LIKE -
I'D HAD A LOT OF THINGS.
I HAD A LOT OF LIKE DESIGNER SHOES AND BAGS
AND DIAMONDS AND THESE THINGS THAT MADE ME FEEL LIKE,
I'VE MADE IT IN THE WORLD, RIGHT.
AFTER EVERYTHING I'VE GONE THROUGH, LIKE THIS IS THE BEST
THAT LIFE IS FOR ME.
AND SO I HAD THESE THINGS.
AND HE DROPPED ME OFF IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS FIELD.
I DIDN'T HAVE SHOES, LIKE I DIDN'T HAVE A PHONE WITH ME.
REBECCA: HE JUST LEFT YOU THERE?
ALIA: HE JUST LEFT ME THERE.
REBECCA: AT NIGHT?
ALIA: AT NIGHT.
REBECCA: IN THE MIDDLE OF A FIELD?
ALIA: IN THE MIDDLE OF LIKE,
YEAH, IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS AGRICULTURAL AREA
OF SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA.
REBECCA: WHAT? BECAUSE HE WAS MAD AT YOU?
ALIA: BECAUSE HE WAS MAD AT ME.
AND SO I FELT LIKE - I LOOK BACK NOW AND I'M LIKE,
OKAY, THE LORD PRESENTED ME WITH A MIRROR.
LIKE, I HAD BEEN SO DECEIVED, YEAH.
AND IT WAS LIKE, HEY, GIRL,
THIS IS WHAT THIS LIFE HAS LEFT YOU WITH.
NOTHING.
LIKE YOU HAVE NOTHING.
YOU'RE HERE ON YOUR OWN.
REBECCA: BECAUSE YOU WERE THERE COMPLETELY BY YOURSELF
AND YOU DIDN'T HAVE ANYTHING.
ALIA: NO.
I DIDN'T HAVE ANY OF THE STUFF THAT I WAS LIKE,
IF I CAN JUST FILL IT WITH STUFF, RIGHT.
THIS WILL HELP.
AND SO I WAS LIKE, THAT'S IT.
I THOUGHT, I'M GOING TO EITHER KILL MYSELF
AS A WAY OUT OR I'M GOING TO GET OUT -
OR I'M GOING TO GO BACK TO HIM
AND KNOW THAT LIKE THIS GUY WAS VIOLENT,
THIS GUY WAS REALLY VIOLENT.
AND I WAS LIKE, HE'S PROBABLY GOING TO KILL ME
OR I'M GOING TO DO THE ONE THING THAT ONE TIME
I KNEW ONE GIRL WHO HAD GOTTEN OUT,
AND I'M GOING TO DO WHAT SHE DID.
AND SO THAT'S WHAT I DECIDED TO DO,
AND I WALKED.
I WALKED WITH NO SHOES LIKE TO THE ONLY PAY PHONE
THAT WAS LEFT IN MY AREA,
WHICH I HAPPENED TO KNOW WHERE IT WAS.
REBECCA: HOW DID YOU KNOW WHERE TO GO?
ALIA: BECAUSE I KNEW THERE WAS THIS ONE PAY PHONE
BECAUSE IT'S BY THE JAIL IN OUR TOWN,
AND SO IT'S LIKE THE PAY PHONE THAT WHEN THE GUYS
ARE GETTING OUT OF THE JAIL,
THEY WALK OVER AND USE THAT PAY PHONE
TO CALL A RIDE OR WHATEVER.
AND SO THAT'S THE ONLY REASON THERE IS
A PAY PHONE LEFT.
AND SO I WALKED TO THAT PAY PHONE,
AND I CALLED LIKE 911 ON MYSELF.
I'M LIKE I'M GOING TO KILL MYSELF.
LIKE, I NEED HELP.
I NEED HELP FOR THIS.
REBECCA: YOU KNEW THAT YOU WANTED TO GET OUT.
ALIA: I WANTED TO GET OUT.
AND I THOUGHT LIKE...
REBECCA: THERE'S ONLY THREE WAYS.
YOU'RE LIKE, I'M GOING TO GO BACK TO THIS GUY
WHO'S GOING TO KILL ME, I'M GOING TO KILL MYSELF
TO GET OUT OF THIS, OR YOU SAID YOU HAVE THAT EXAMPLE
OF THAT ONE GIRL.
ALIA: YEAH, ONE GIRL.
AND I FELT LIKE, IN THE BACK OF MY MIND LIKE,
WELL, I CAN TRY WHAT SHE DID,
AND IF IT DOESN'T WORK FOR ME,
THE INDUSTRY WILL BE THERE FOR ME,
I CAN GO BACK, OR SUICIDE WILL STILL BE
THERE FOR ME, RIGHT.
IN THAT TIME, LIKE I APPLIED FOR THIS PROGRAM
AND GOT INTO THIS RECOVERY PROGRAM THAT THIS OTHER WOMAN
HAD BEEN THROUGH THAT WAS SPECIFICALLY
FOR WOMEN WHO HAD BEEN TRAFFICKED AND EXPLOITED.
REBECCA: HOW DID YOU FIND OUT ABOUT THIS GIRL
THAT GOT OUT?
ALIA: YEAH.
SO WHEN I WAS ABOUT 22, I THINK,
THERE WAS THIS GUY AND HE OWNED THE LARGEST
PORN DISTRIBUTION COMPANY IN THE COUNTRY.
AND HE TOOK ME TO CHURCH.
REBECCA: WAIT, WHAT?
ALIA: YES.
[ LAUGHING ]
REBECCA: WHY?
ALIA: SO HIS FINANCE HAD LEFT HIM,
AND HIS FIANCE HAD BEEN IN PORN,
AND SHE'D LEFT HIM AND GONE TO THIS PROGRAM IN KENTUCKY
THAT WAS LIKE A PROGRAM FOR WOMEN
WHO HAD BEEN EXPLOITED AND TRAFFICKED.
AND SO SHE'D GONE THERE.
AND IN AN EFFORT TO LIKE WIN HER BACK,
HE STARTED GOING TO CHURCH.
I KNOW.
[ LAUGHING ]
AND SO HE STARTED GOING TO CHURCH.
AND I DO BELIEVE THAT HE GOT SAVED.
HE ENDED UP DYING OF AN OVERDOSE WITHIN ABOUT A YEAR,
AND I REALLY BELIEVE IT'S BECAUSE HE WAS TRYING
TO SELF-MEDICATE CONVICTION.
INSTEAD OF LIKE TURNING AWAY FROM THE PORN INDUSTRY
AND GIVING UP ALL THIS MONEY THAT HE WAS MAKING,
HE WAS SELF-MEDICATING THAT CONVICTION
THAT THE LORD WAS PLACING IN HIS HEART.
AND SO HE SELF-MEDICATED HIMSELF INTO AN OVERDOSE,
AND HE DIED.
BUT HE TOOK ME TO CHURCH.
AND IT WAS THE FIRST TIME THAT THAT I'D EVER BEEN IN LIKE,
I'D GONE TO CATHOLIC MASS
GROWING UP, OCCASIONALLY.
BUT IT WAS THE FIRST TIME I'D EVER BEEN INTO
LIKE A CHRISTIAN, LIKE NON-DENOMINATIONAL CHURCH.
AND SO I WENT INTO THIS CHURCH,
AND THERE WAS A WOMAN PREACHING ON THE STAGE.
AND FOR ONE, THAT WAS LIKE VERY DIFFERENT.
I'D ONLY EVER HEARD LIKE - I REALLY HEARD LIKE -
THE WAY THAT I HEARD JESUS DIED FOR YOUR SINS
AT THE LIKE MASSES THAT I HAD GONE THROUGH IS LIKE,
YOU'RE SO AWFUL, JESUS HAD TO DIE.
LIKE THAT'S WHAT I - THAT'S THE WAY THAT I
HAD HEARD IT.
AND SO SHE WAS - IT WAS AN EASTER SERVICE,
AND SHE WAS EXPLAINING THE GOSPEL,
AND SHE WAS NAILING WORDS TO A CROSS,
AND SHE CAME TO THIS MOMENT WHERE SHE
WAS ACTUALLY TALKING ABOUT THIS GIRL, HIS FIANCE,
THAT HAD LEFT AND THAT HAD GONE ON AND FOUND HEALING,
AND SHE WAS TALKING ABOUT HER.
AND I'M LIKE, OKAY, NOT ONLY IS THERE THIS WOMAN
TALKING ABOUT JESUS, BUT SHE'S SITTING ON THE STAGE
WITH HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE, BECAUSE IT WAS A LARGE CHURCH,
LIKE TALKING ABOUT SOMEONE LIKE ME AND
TALKING ABOUT HOW THAT PERSON IS LOVED
AND THAT THAT PERSON HAS HOPE.
AND SO I DIDN'T GET SAVED THAT DAY AT ALL.
BUT I FELT LIKE, THIS IS A SAFE PLACE AND THIS IS -
I WAS JUST SOBBING AND I'M JUST LIKE,
THIS IS A PLACE I WANT TO BE AT MORE.
AND HE - AND SO THEY ACTUALLY,
THE PASTORS OF THAT CHURCH WHERE HE TOOK ME
KNEW HIS FIANCE, SO THE PASTOR THAT WAS A CHURCH PLANT THERE,
AND THE PASTOR'S MOM HAD WORKED IN KENTUCKY
AT THIS PROGRAM THAT THIS GIRL HAD GONE THROUGH.
AND ACTUALLY WHEN THIS GIRL GRADUATED THAT PROGRAM,
SHE ACTUALLY MOVED IN TO THEIR HOME.
SHE'D LET THEM LIVE WITH THEM.
AND THEN SHE'D GONE ON AND SHE'D GONE
TO SEMINARY, ACTUALLY.
REBECCA: OH, MY GOSH.
ALIA: IT WAS AMAZING.
AND THEY HAD MOVED FROM KENTUCKY OUT HERE
TO BE WITH THEIR CHILDREN WHO HAD PLANTED THIS CHURCH
IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA.
AND SO THEY KNEW ABOUT TRAFFICKING
AND THEY KNEW ABOUT THE PORN INDUSTRY.
AND THE PORN INDUSTRY, LIKE I THINK IS THE PART OF MY STORY
THAT PEOPLE - LIKE ALWAYS SHOCKED PEOPLE
BECAUSE THERE AREN'T A LOT OF US THAT TALK ABOUT IT,
BUT IN MY PERSPECTIVE
LIKE, EVERYTHING THAT WAS HAPPENING OUTSIDE OF PORN
AS FAR AS MY TRAFFICKING WAS LIKE TOOK MORE TIME
OF MY LIFE.
AND SO THEY UNDERSTOOD ALL OF THAT, TOO.
LIKE, THEY UNDERSTOOD ALL OF THE WAYS THAT
I HAD BEEN HURT OUTSIDE OF THAT.
REBECCA: DID THE GIRL FROM KENTUCKY HAVE A SIMILAR,
OR THE GIRL THAT GOT SENT TO KENTUCKY,
WAS HER STORY SIMILAR TO YOURS?
ALIA: IT WAS REALLY SIMILAR TO MINE.
REBECCA: AND YOU WERE ABLE TO TALK TO HER?
ALIA: NOT AT FIRST.
LIKE AT FIRST, I DIDN'T.
AND AT FIRST, IT WAS JUST KNOWING THAT SHE EXISTED.
LIKE TO KNOW THAT THERE WAS SOMEBODY LIKE ME
WHO GOT OUT, LIKE THAT WAS BIG.
AND SO THEY COULD RECOGNIZE ME,
THE PASTORS OF THIS CHURCH AND HER MOM AND DAD,
LIKE THEY RECOGNIZED THE PAIN THAT I WAS IN
AND THE THINGS THAT WERE HAPPENING TO ME.
AND SO FOR FOUR YEARS, AND I'M BEING TRAFFICKED,
I'M IN AND OUT OF STRIP CLUBS, PORN,
ABUSIVE RELATIONSHIPS, DURING FOUR YEARS,
THEY EXPECTED TO SEE ME EVERY SUNDAY MORNING AT CHURCH.
AND EVERY SUNDAY AFTERNOON,
THEY DID THERE FROM KENTUCKY -
YOU KNOW, THEY'RE FROM SOUTH, SO IT'S LIKE SUNDAY SUPPER
EVERY SUNDAY AFTER SERVICE,
AND IT WAS ALL OF THE PASTORS
IN THEIR HOME, AND ME.
REBECCA: SO THEY INVITED YOU IN.
ALIA: MM-HM.
THEY INVITED ME SO DEEP INTO THEIR LIVES.
REBECCA: AW.
ALIA: SO IT WAS LIKE THERE'S MY KIDS AND THEIR KIDS.
REBECCA: AND THEY DIDN'T GIVE UP ON YOU.
ALIA: THEY DIDN'T GIVE UP ON ME
AND IT DIDN'T FEEL WEIRD THAT I WAS THERE.
REBECCA: OH, WOW.
ALIA: LIKE THEY DIDN'T - IT SEEMED LIKE THEIR KIDS
WEREN'T WEIRDED OUT BY THE FACT THAT I WAS THERE
AND LIKE, I'D GROWN UP, LIKE I DIDN'T KNOW HOW
TO DRESS APPROPRIATELY, LIKE I DID NOT -
I LOOKED LIKE I WAS BEING EXPLOITED, RIGHT.
LIKE I DIDN'T LOOK LIKE I FIT.
AND YET THIS FAMILY JUST MADE IT SEEM LIKE
THE MOST NORMAL THING IN THE WORLD,
THAT ESSENTIALLY THEY'RE HAVING SUNDAY SUPPER
WITH THEIR KIDS AND A PROSTITUTE EVERY SUNDAY.
LIKE HOW, IT'S STILL THE MOST CHRIST-LIKE THING
I THINK I'VE EVER SEEN, AND THAT I GOT TO EXPERIENCE.
REBECCA: AND THEY DIDN'T GIVE UP?
BECAUSE THEY COULD HAVE JUST BEEN LIKE,
WELL, SHE'S NOT LEAVING THIS LIFESTYLE.
ALIA: NO, THEY DIDN'T GIVE UP.
REBECCA: BECAUSE DID THEY TRY TO GET YOU OUT?
ALIA: THEY OFFERED ME OPPORTUNITY.
REBECCA: BUT THEY KNEW THEY COULDN'T...
ALIA: THEY COULDN'T.
REBECCA: THEY KNEW YOU HAD TO DO IT YOURSELF.
ALIA: YEAH.
AND SO THEY KEPT OFFERING AND THEY KEPT TELLING ME
ABOUT THIS PROGRAM.
BUT WHAT WAS MORE POWERFUL THAN ANYTHING THEY SAID
WAS THEY HAD PICTURES OF THIS GIRL,
AND THEY HAD PICTURES OF HER LIKE WITH THEIR FAMILY
IN THEIR LIKE, THEY HAVE LIKE A WALL OF FAMILY PHOTOS,
AND THERE WERE PICTURES OF HER IN THAT.
REBECCA: THE GIRL THAT GOT OUT.
ALIA: THE GIRL THAT GOT OUT.
AND THEN LIKE ONE THING, THEY LOVED HER.
SHE BECAME THEIR FAMILY.
AND ONE THING THAT I REMEMBER SO VIVIDLY
WAS HER ENGAGEMENT PHOTO ON THAT,
BECAUSE I COULD SEE THAT THERE WAS SOMETHING SO DIFFERENT
IN THE WAY THAT THEY WERE JUST LIKE
SO NICELY SITTING TOGETHER.
IT LOOKED...
REBECCA: FROM ALL THE RELATIONSHIPS
YOU HAD EXPERIENCED IN THE PAST, IT WAS DIFFERENT.
ALIA: YEAH.
IT WAS SWEET AND THERE WAS AN INNOCENCE ABOUT IT.
REBECCA: AW.
ALIA: THAT I WAS LIKE, HOW DOES A GIRL LIKE ME
HAVE A RELATIONSHIP THAT LOOKS THIS PURE AND SWEET?
AND SO I KNEW LIKE I -
I KNEW THAT IT HAD WORKED FOR HER.
I KNEW THAT WHATEVER IT WAS THAT SHE HAD DONE,
IT WORKED FOR HER.
AND SO I WAS LIKE, IF I'M EVER ABLE TO LEAVE,
IF I EVER WANT TO GET OUT OR READY TO GET OUT,
IF I DO WHAT SHE DID, THEN IT'LL WORK.
BUT FOR ME, MY SITUATION WAS A LITTLE DIFFERENT
BECAUSE I HAD MY KIDS.
AND THERE WAS - I'M LIKE, I'M NOT LEAVING
MY KIDS, RIGHT.
EVEN IF IT MEANS LIKE I -
I HAD HAD THIS LIE AND THE PEOPLE
WHO TRAFFICKED ME AND ABUSED ME HAD HAD THIS LIE
OF LIKE, WELL, YOU CAN'T DO THIS ON YOUR OWN.
WHO'S GOING TO TAKE CARE OF YOUR KIDS?
THEY'RE GOING TO TAKE YOUR KIDS AWAY.
LIKE ALL OF THESE THINGS THAT THEY HAD
MANIPULATED ME THROUGH, MY KIDS, TO BE LIKE,
YOU'RE DOING THIS FOR THEM,
YOU'RE GIVING THEM A BETTER LIFE.
LIKE, WHAT ARE YOU SUPPOSED TO DO?
YOU DON'T HAVE A HIGH SCHOOL EDUCATION.
LIKE, THIS IS THE BEST LIFE FOR YOUR KIDS.
REBECCA: SO THAT'S WHAT - HOW THEY WERE KEEPING YOU
IN THAT WORLD, IS YOU WERE THINKING
YOU WERE GOING TO HAVE TO LOSE THEM.
ALIA: I WAS, YEAH.
REBECCA: AND SO IT TOOK YOU BASICALLY HITTING ROCK BOTTOM,
THAT MOMENT OF BEING LEFT IN A FIELD
AND BEING LIKE, I CAN'T DO THIS ANYMORE
BECAUSE I'M GOING TO GET KILLED BY THIS GUY.
ALIA: EXACTLY.
AND THEN I'M NOT GOING TO BE THERE FOR MY KIDS AT ALL.
REBECCA: YEAH.
MY KIDS AREN'T GOING TO HAVE A MOM.
ALIA: EXACTLY.
REBECCA: SO YOU'RE LIKE,
WELL, I MIGHT AS WELL GIVE THIS A CHANCE.
ALIA: YES.
REBECCA: SO YOU CALL 911.
WHAT DO THEY DO WITH YOU?
BECAUSE ONE OF THE THINGS I'VE HEARD IS THEY'RE NOT
VERY GOOD WITH TRAFFICKING SURVIVORS.
YOU DON'T LIKE ARREST THEM, AND I'M LIKE,
DON'T ARREST THEM.
ARREST THE -
ALIA: WELL, FIRST OF ALL,
THEY DIDN'T IDENTIFY ME AS A TRAFFICKING SURVIVOR,
SO PROBLEM ONE, RIGHT.
I TOLD THEM I LIKE, I'M GOING TO KILL MYSELF,
LIKE MY - LIKE, MY BOYFRIEND IS LOOKING FOR ME,
HE WANTS ME TO DO THIS.
LIKE, IT WOULD HAVE BEEN REALLY EASY FOR THEM
TO IDENTIFY ME, BUT THEY DIDN'T HAVE TRAINING.
AND SO THEY - THIS GUY LOOKED LIKE IT WAS
HIS DAY ONE ON THE JOB.
LIKE, HE LOOKED LIKE 20 YEARS OLD.
REBECCA: OH, NO!
WHAT DID HE DO WITH YOU?
ALIA: THEY HANDCUFFED ME AND PUT ME IN
THE BACK OF THE CAR AND DROVE ME TO LIKE
A BEHAVIORAL HEALTH CENTER, WHICH WAS A BLESSING
BECAUSE IT KEPT ME SAFE
LIKE, FROM MY TRAFFICKER COMING
AND, LIKE, GETTING ME.
BUT IT WAS FROM THERE THAT I WAS ABLE TO, LIKE,
MAKE THE CALL TO MY PASTOR AND BE LIKE, HEY, I'M READY.
AND THIS WAS THE THIRD TIME I'D FILLED OUT
THE APPLICATION TO GO TO THAT PROGRAM.
REBECCA: WOW.
ALIA: LIKE I HAD DONE IT BEFORE WHERE THEY HAD
LIKE TOLD ME THAT I SHOULD GO, AND I WAS LIKE,
WELL, YEAH, THINGS ARE REALLY BAD,
BUT THEN I BACKED OUT BECAUSE I DIDN'T WANT TO
LEAVE MY KIDS, OBVIOUSLY.
AND SHE TELLS ME, SHE'S LIKE,
I KNEW WHEN YOU CALLED THAT YOU WERE READY,
THAT IT WAS TIME.
BECAUSE TO MAKE THAT DECISION,
PEOPLE AREN'T LIKE - I KNOW IT'S HARD FOR PEOPLE
TO UNDERSTAND, LIKE, WELL, WHY DIDN'T YOU LEAVE
IF YOU HAD THIS OPPORTUNITY.
FOR ME, MY MIND AND MY WORLDVIEW WAS SO WARPED
THAT I BELIEVED ALL OF THOSE THINGS THAT PEOPLE
HAD SAID, AND TO SAY LIKE I'M BROKEN
AND THIS IS HURTING ME,
MEANT THAT EVERYONE HAD LIED TO ME
FOR MY WHOLE LIFE.
AND I WOULD HAVE HAD TO CONFRONT
ALL OF THOSE WAYS THAT I HAD BEEN HURT.
REBECCA: AND THAT WOULD BE SO HARD.
THAT'S LIKE EARTHSHATTERING.
ALIA: IT'S LIKE A FIRE HOSE OF TRAUMA IN ONE MOMENT.
REBECCA: AND YOU HAVE TO, LIKE YOU SAID,
YOU HAVE TO BE READY IN YOUR LIFE TO FACE THAT,
BECAUSE THAT'S VERY PAINFUL.
IT'S LIKE RELIVING IT ALL OVER AGAIN TO ADDRESS IT.
IT'S LIKE GOING THROUGH PHYSICAL THERAPY
FOR YOUR SOUL.
SO IT'S PAINFUL.
ALIA: EXACTLY.
THAT'S SUCH A GOOD WAY OF PUTTING IT.
REBECCA: YEAH.
SO YOU HAD TO BE READY TO FACE IT.
ALIA: AND I - AND HAD TO BE READY TO TAKE
THE RISK OF LIKE -
REBECCA: LEAVING?
ALIA: WELL, WHAT IF I LEAVE AND EVERYBODY'S
BEEN RIGHT ABOUT ME?
WHAT IF I LEAVE AND I CAN'T EVER BE NORMAL?
WHAT IF I LEAVE AND NOBODY EVER WILL HIRE ME?
LIKE, WHAT IF I LEAVE AND IT DOESN'T WORK?
THEN THEY WERE REALLY, REALLY RIGHT.
AND LIKE TO LET GO OF LIKE,
AT LEAST THERE'S THIS KIND OF HOPE THAT LIKE MAYBE
IF I DO THAT SOMEDAY,
LIKE TO ACTUALLY DO IT AND TAKE THE RISK
OF IT NOT WORKING
SEEMED LIKE A REALLY BIG DEAL, ALSO.
REBECCA: YEAH.
I FEEL LIKE YOU'RE GIVING SUCH GOOD INSIGHT FOR PEOPLE
WHO MAYBE NEVER EXPERIENCED THIS,
THAT THEY COULD EMPATHIZE WITH PEOPLE WHO ARE
GOING THROUGH THIS.
BECAUSE YOU HAD A WHOLE WORLD,
YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS,
AND SO MANY DIFFERENT INDIVIDUALS DOING THIS TO YOU
AND PUTTING THOSE LIES IN YOUR HEAD.
AND THEN THEY, LIKE YOU SAID,
YOU HAD TO FACE WHAT YOUR WHOLE LIFE,
THE REALITY OF IT, AND THAT'S A HUGE PILL TO SWALLOW.
AND THEN THE FEAR OF, LIKE YOU SAID,
WHAT IF THIS DOESN'T WORK?
I GO THROUGH ALL OF THIS AND PUT MYSELF OUT THERE,
AND IT DOESN'T WORK.
THAT'S SCARY.
BECAUSE IT WAS SUCH A BAD SYSTEM THAT YOU WERE IN,
THEN IN YOUR MIND, IT WAS KIND OF WORKING FOR YOU
IN THE MOMENT.
ALIA: RIGHT.
AND THAT'S THE OTHER LIE THAT'S TOLD.
LIKE, I KNEW THAT IT WASN'T WORKING, RIGHT.
BUT IT WAS LIKE, IT'S NOT WORKING BECAUSE
THERE'S SOMETHING WRONG WITH ME.
LIKE, THAT WAS THE LIE THAT I BELIEVED, TOO.
BECAUSE JUST LIKE IN THE SAME WAY THAT
PEOPLE ARE DECEIVED ABOUT PORN
OR THEY'RE DECEIVED ABOUT STRIP CLUBS,
RIGHT, AND THEY LOOK AT WOMEN
OR WOMEN ON ONLYFANS OR WHATEVER,
AND THEY SEE LIKE ALL OF THIS GLAMOUR.
I WAS SEEING ALL THAT GLAMOUR, TOO,
OF THESE OTHER WOMEN INVOLVED.
AND LIKE I WASN'T SEEING THEM IN THEIR CAR
WHEN THEY'RE SOBBING.
LIKE, I WASN'T SEEING THEM WHEN THEY'RE ALSO BEING
SEXUAL ASSAULTED.
I WASN'T SEEING THOSE PIECES OF THEIR LIFE.
I WAS ONLY SEEING THE GLAMOUR, ALSO.
SO IN MY HEAD, I'M LIKE, WHY IS THIS WORKING
FOR EVERYBODY ELSE?
REBECCA: MM.
BUT THE TRUTH WAS, IT'S REALLY NOT WORKING.
ALIA: IT WASN'T WORKING FOR ANYONE.
FOR NONE OF US.
BUT WE'D ALL BEEN SOLD THE LIE.
WE'D BEEN SOLD THE LIE.
AND SO I FELT LIKE IT JUST MUST BE ME.
AND THAT WAS WHY I'D BE LIKE,
WELL, MAYBE IF I GO BACK TO PORN, IT'LL BE OKAY.
WELL, MAYBE IF I GO BACK TO THE STRIP CLUB,
OR MAYBE IF I DO IT THIS WAY, IT'LL BE OKAY.
BECAUSE IT CAN'T BE THE LIFE, IT CAN'T BE THIS.
IT HAS TO BE - I'M THE PROBLEM IN ALL OF THIS.
REBECCA: SO WHAT WAS IT LIKE?
SO YOU GO OFF TO CHICAGO, RIGHT, FOR THIS PROGRAM.
ALIA: MM-HM, YEAH.
REBECCA: WHAT WAS IT LIKE GOING THERE?
ALIA: I LIKE TO DESCRIBE THAT PROGRAM AS LIKE
WHAT KINDERGARTEN PROBABLY WAS FOR MOST PEOPLE,
WHERE, LIKE, I COULD HAVE JUST DRAWN LIKE
A SCRIBBLE ON A PIECE OF PAPER,
AND THEY WOULD HAVE FRAMED IT AND LIKE...
[ LAUGHING ]
JUST LIKE TRIED TO SELL IT FOR A MILLION DOLLARS
BECAUSE THEY THOUGHT IT WAS SO VALUABLE
JUST BECAUSE I MADE IT, RIGHT.
LIKE, THAT'S THE WAY THAT WE WERE TREATED
IN THIS PROGRAM.
REBECCA: SO THEY TREATED YOU REALLY WELL.
ALIA: SO, WE WERE SO LOVED.
REBECCA: AW.
THAT'S WHAT YOU NEEDED.
ALIA: AND IT IS.
LIKE IT JUST - THEY LOVED US SO MUCH.
REBECCA: THAT'S WHERE YOU CAN ACTUALLY GROW.
ALIA: TOTALLY.
REBECCA: IT IS AN ENVIRONMENT OF LOVE.
YOU'VE NEVER HAD THAT.
YOU NEVER REALLY EXPERIENCED PURE LOVE
IN YOUR LIFE, SO IT MUST - DID IT FEEL WEIRD AT FIRST?
ALIA: OH, YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.
I WAS LIKE, THESE CRAZY LADIES.
LIKE, THEY ARE WAY TOO EXCITED FOR ME TO BE HERE.
REBECCA: IT'S ALMOST LIKE YOU CAN'T TRUST IT AT FIRST
BECAUSE YOU'RE LIKE...
ALIA: ABSOLUTELY.
AND I GET IT, BECAUSE I FEEL THAT WAY NOW
WHEN I MEET LIKE THE GIRLS THAT I WORK WITH,
LIKE I FEEL A LITTLE BIT LIKE I'M ON A FIRST DATE
WHERE I'M LIKE, OKAY, DON'T ACT TOO EXCITED,
LIKE DON'T -
REBECCA: YOU DON'T WANT TO FREAK THEM OUT.
ALIA: LIKE DON'T FREAK OUT,
DON'T LET THEM KNOW LIKE, AND I JUST WANT TO LIKE
SQUEEZE THEM AND JUST BE LIKE,
I LOVE YOU SO MUCH.
AND I KNOW THAT'S HOW
[ LAUGHING ]
THESE WOMEN WERE FEELING WHEN I GOT THERE,
BUT I'M LIKE, WHOA, LADY.
REBECCA: YOU'RE LIKE, WHOA, WHOA, WHOA.
ALIA: AND ESPECIALLY LIKE IN THE LIFE
AND IN BEING TRAFFICKED OR PITTED AGAINST OTHER WOMEN, TOO,
AND LIKE TOLD THAT LIKE YOU'RE DIFFERENT
FROM LIKE JUST THE WOMAN AT THE GROCERY STORE
WITH HER KIDS WHO HAS LIKE THIS LOVING RELATIONSHIP,
THAT SHE HATES YOU AND SHE FINDS YOU DISGUSTING.
LIKE, YOU'RE TOLD THESE THINGS.
AND SO -
REBECCA: TO FURTHER ISOLATE YOU.
ALIA: MM-HM.
AND SO IT WAS REALLY STRANGE TO ME TO HAVE LIKE
THESE NORMAL LADIES LIKE LOVE ME.
BUT LIKE THAT'S WHERE I DID GET SAVED.
I GOT SAVED THE FIRST DAY THAT I WAS THERE
FROM LIKE A SUPERNATURAL EXPERIENCE THAT I HAD,
AND THE WOMEN WERE PRAYING OVER ME,
AND I LIKE FELT THE PHYSICAL SENSATION
OF BAPTISM, LIKE WATER OVER ME, IS WHAT I FELT.
AND I -
REBECCA: WASH YOU CLEAN.
ALIA: YEAH.
AND, LIKE, I'M NOT LIKE A - LIKE, I BELIEVE IN ALL
OF THESE THINGS BECAUSE THE LORD HAS, LIKE,
BROKEN THROUGH MY HARD HEAD.
BUT THAT'S NOT LIKE MY NATURAL INCLINATION,
IT'S NOT TO LIKE BE VERY SPIRITUAL,
LIKE, IT'S COME FROM THE LORD
LIKE OVER AND OVER AGAIN,
PROVING THAT HE'S SO MUCH BIGGER THAN THE BOX
THAT I'VE PUT HIM IN.
AND SO I HAD THAT EXPERIENCE.
AND SO FOR ME, THAT WAS LIKE, OKAY.
[ LAUGHING ]
I GET IT.
I BELIEVE YOU.
AND I JUST REALLY WANTED TO KNOW EVERYTHING ABOUT HIM.
AND THIS PROGRAM THAT I WENT THROUGH WAS, LIKE,
IT WAS VERY JUST DEEPLY LIKE SOAKED IN
THE HOLY SPIRIT AND IN KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THE LORD,
BUT ALSO IN LIKE RE-BREAKING THOSE BROKEN BONES
IN OUR SOUL AND PUTTING THEM BACK TOGETHER,
ESSENTIALLY LIKE THE PHYSICAL THERAPY
FOR YOUR SOUL, YEAH.
REBECCA: DOING THE WORK OF LIKE THE FRAGMENTS
IN YOUR SOUL.
ALIA: YEAH.
AND LEARNING NEW THINGS, LIKE LEARNING NEW...
REBECCA: THE TRUTH OF WHO YOU REALLY ARE.
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: AND LIKE ADDRESSING THE LIES,
TELLING THE TRUTH.
AND THAT TAKES TIME.
YOU WERE THERE FOR A YEAR.
ALIA: I WAS THERE FOR A YEAR.
REBECCA: BECAUSE THAT'S - YOU WERE HAVING TO UNDO,
IT'S LIKE A KNOT OR LIKE A BRAID.
YOU HAD TO UNRAVEL A LOT OF STUFF.
ALIA: I DID.
REBECCA: AND THAT TAKES TIME.
ALIA: IT DOES.
REBECCA: AND EVEN PROBABLY,
I THINK ALL OF US LIKE, WE'RE ALL ON A HEALING JOURNEY,
AND IT TAKES TIME.
BUT YOU PROBABLY MADE MAJOR - HAD MAJOR BREAKTHROUGH
AND MADE LEAPS AND BOUNDS SO LIKE
IN THIS PROGRAM FOR THAT YEAR,
YOU REALLY FEEL LIKE THEY LAID A FOUNDATION
SO THAT WHEN YOU LEFT,
YOU HAD THAT FOUNDATION OF GOD AND HIS WORD.
DID THEY TEACH YOU HOW TO HAVE A RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD?
ALIA: THEY DID.
THEY REALLY, REALLY TAUGHT,
THAT WAS LIKE A BIG PART OF IT.
REBECCA: THAT'S LIKE KEY.
[ LAUGHING ]
ALIA: YEAH. THAT WAS SO MUCH OF IT.
REBECCA: SO YOU CAN LEAVE AND LIKE, OKAY,
YOU'RE LIKE, I KNOW WHO THE HOLY SPIRIT IS,
I KNOW HOW TO LIKE READ THE WORD OF GOD.
BECAUSE LIKE THAT'S HOW, WHEN YOU GET OUT,
HOW YOU KEEP THAT GOING.
ALIA: YEAH.
SO WE DID, IN THAT PROGRAM,
WE DID LIKE DEEP TRAUMA CARE, WE WENT TO THERAPY,
AND ALL OF THESE THINGS, AND WE DID LIKE BOOKS
ON CODEPENDENCY AND TO LIKE CHILDHOOD TRAUMA
AND ALL OF THESE THINGS.
REBECCA: WAS IT LIKE SO EYE-OPENING?
ALIA: IT WAS.
REBECCA: WAS IT WILD?
ALIA: IT WAS.
REBECCA: WOULDN'T THAT BE CRAZY?
ALIA: HOW DO THEY KNOW MY LIFE?
IT WAS CRAZY.
AND THEN AT THE SAME TIME, WE DID BIBLE STUDIES, RIGHT.
AND SO WE - IN ALL OF THAT WAS MIXED LIKE,
WE DID LIKEBATTLEFIELD OF THE MIND AND WE DID
LIKE,UNASHAMED, WHICH IS LIKE A CHRISTINE CAINE.
SO A LOT OF BIBLE STUDIES TOO THAT BROUGHT LIKE
THE LORD INTO THOSE LIKE REALLY BROKEN PLACES
AND NORMALIZED LIKE ALLOWING HIM INTO THOSE SPACES.
AND EVERYTHING WAS, LIKE, SOAKED IN PRAYER.
AND SO THEY REALLY, LIKE, TAUGHT US TO BE
IN THOSE MOMENTS AND LIKE THEY REALLY PUSHED LIKE HAVING
ALONE TIME WITH THE LORD AND DEVOTIONAL TIME
WITH THE LORD.
AND I HAD A LOT OF QUESTIONS.
LIKE, I WASN'T RAISED WITH FAITH.
LIKE I WAS NOT RAISED WITH ANYBODY WHO READ THE BIBLE
OR WHO PRAYED OPENLY, OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
AND SO I HAD A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT LIKE
THINGS THAT I HAD SEEN AS LIKE WHAT I THOUGHT WAS
LIKE, CHRISTIANS BEING HATEFUL TOWARDS PEOPLE.
AND, LIKE, I HAD A LOT THAT I NEEDED TO UNDERSTAND,
AND THEY WERE SO, LIKE, GENTLE AND PATIENT
AND WISE IN THE WAY THAT THEY RESPONDED
AND REALLY PRAYERFUL IN, LIKE, ADDRESSING, LIKE,
I DIDN'T HAVE CHURCH HURT BECAUSE I WASN'T INVOLVED.
BUT I HAD KNOWN A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO HAD BEEN HURT
BY PEOPLE WHO SAID THAT THEY WERE REPRESENTING THE LORD.
AND THEY SPENT SO MUCH TIME UNPACKING
THOSE THINGS TOO AND, LIKE, ANY KIND OF STRONGHOLDS
THAT I STILL HAD, LIKE, LETTING GO OF THOSE FOR ME
AND ENCOURAGING ME IN EVERYTHING THAT
I WAS CAPABLE OF.
REBECCA: AND LIKE THE OTHER THING IS,
WHEN YOU WERE HAVING TO REPROCESS YOUR LIFE
THROUGH THIS NEW LENS, YOU'RE PROBABLY -
DID YOU FEEL LIKE MAYBE GROWING UP,
LIKE, GOD, WHERE WERE YOU,
WHY DID ALL THIS BAD STUFF HAPPEN TO ME?
WERE YOU ABLE TO PROCESS THAT ASPECT?
ALIA: I GUESS I DIDN'T - I KNOW SO MANY PEOPLE
STRUGGLE WITH THAT PIECE.
AND LIKE FOR ME, I DIDN'T EVER REALLY BLAME GOD.
EVEN AS A KID, I HAD FELT LIKE,
EVEN WHEN I FELT LIKE, WELL, GOD'S PROBABLY REAL,
HE'S JUST TOO BUSY.
LIKE, I WAS LIKE, THERE'S CHILD - STARVING CHILDREN
IN AFRICA LIKE I'M JUST - LIKE, THAT'S HOW I ALWAYS
LOOKED AT IT WAS, LIKE, I UNDERSTAND, GOD'S BUSY.
LIKE, THAT'S, IN MY HEAD, THE WAY I PROCESSED IT WAS
LIKE, AS A YOUNG KID EVEN THINKING LIKE THIS ALL
ISN'T REAL, EVEN IF THERE IS A GOD,
WHY WOULD HE CARE ABOUT ME?
LIKE, THERE'S SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE TO CARE ABOUT.
AND SO I THINK I WAS SO MUCH MORE LIKE,
WHAT DO YOU MEAN GOD'S BEEN THERE THE WHOLE TIME?
LIKE, WHAT DO YOU MEAN?
AND IT WAS SO EASY FOR ME TO LOOK BACK AND SEE LIKE,
OKAY, THE LORD DIDN'T CAUSE THESE THINGS TO HAPPEN.
AND MAYBE IT'S BECAUSE IT WAS EXPLAINED TO ME BY
PEOPLE WHO UNDERSTOOD RIGHT AWAY, RIGHT,
THAT, LIKE, THE LORD DIDN'T CAUSE THESE THINGS
TO HAPPEN TO ME.
BUT IF I WAS GOING TO LET HIM INTO MY LIFE,
HE WAS PROMISING TO USE THEM FOR GOOD.
LIKE, HE WAS PROMISING -
REBECCA: IT WASN'T FOR NOTHING.
ALIA: AND THOSE WERE THE VERSES THAT WERE LIKE ALL OVER US
WHEN WE WERE THERE.
AND I BET THAT'S WHY I DIDN'T STRUGGLE WITH THAT
WAS BECAUSE, LIKE, BEAUTY FOR ASHES,
ALL OF THESE VERSES THAT LIKE HOW HE PROMISES
TO RESTORE YOU AND, LIKE, CONVERSATIONS AROUND JOB,
AND ALL OF THESE THINGS WERE PART OF
OUR EVERYDAY LIFE.
AND SO I SAW IN THE BIBLE PEOPLE WHO EXPERIENCED
THINGS LIKE I DID, AND I SAW THE WAY THAT GOD WAS
WEAVING THROUGH THEIR LIVES, EVEN BEFORE.
LIKE, I SAW RAHAB.
THOSE WERE THINGS THAT WERE INTRODUCED VERY EARLY
IN MY FAITH.
AND SO I WAS ABLE TO LOOK BACK AND BE LIKE, WOW,
THE LORD SAVED ME HERE.
LIKE, WHEN I JUST THOUGHT LIKE, WHY DIDN'T THIS,
IN DIFFERENT SITUATIONS WHERE IT WAS LIKE,
I KNEW THAT I WAS LUCKY TO GET OUT OF THAT SITUATION ALIVE.
LIKE, I CAN GO BACK AND BE LIKE, THAT WAS THE LORD.
AND HE CONTINUED TO PUT, EVEN THOUGH I WASN'T A BELIEVER,
HE CONTINUED TO PUT BELIEVERS IN MY LIFE
THROUGHOUT MY LIFE.
REBECCA: TO LIKE PLANT THOSE SEEDS,
TO GET YOU TO THE POINT TO WHERE YOU WOULD ONE DAY
BECOME A BELIEVER YOURSELF.
ALIA: YEAH, YEAH.
REBECCA: SO HE WAS ALWAYS PURSUING YOU.
IT'S LIKE WHEN YOU LOOK BACK ON IT,
AND, LIKE, YOU WERE IN A LOT OF REALLY
SKETCHY SITUATIONS.
YOU EASILY COULD HAVE BEEN KILLED.
ALIA: VERY MUCH SO.
REBECCA: AND YOU WEREN'T.
PRAISE GOD.
ALIA: YEAH.
HE HAD - I JUST THINK HE HAD WORK THAT HE WANTED
TO DO TOGETHER AND THAT HE WAS GOING TO INVITE ME INTO,
AND SO HE KEPT ME SAFE.
AND EVEN THINGS, EVEN IF IT WASN'T LIKE DEATH,
THERE WERE THINGS THAT WERE SO BAD BUT I KNOW
THEY COULD HAVE BEEN EVEN WORSE, RIGHT,
IF HE WASN'T THERE.
SO IT'S EASY FOR ME TO LOOK BACK AND SEE THE WAY
THAT HE WAS PREPARING A TABLE FOR ME.
AND SO I THINK I WAS REALLY JUST BLESSED
TO HAVE MY FIRST INTRODUCTIONS WITH FAITH
BE WITH SUCH CHRISTLIKE PEOPLE THAT I KNEW, LIKE,
THESE PEOPLE LOVE ME AND THESE PEOPLE ARE AN
EXTENSION OF HIS LOVE.
AND SO THAT'S THE WAY THAT GOD CARES FOR ME.
AND I JUST FELT LIKE THE DEEP COMPASSION FROM THE LORD
IN THAT LIKE THEY USED ALL OF THOSE THINGS
THAT TELL US THAT HE'S WITH US IN OUR PAIN
AND THAT HE'S, LIKE, SAVING EVERY TEAR IN A BOTTLE.
LIKE, THEY USED THOSE VERY EARLY ON.
AND SO I KNEW RIGHT AWAY THAT LIKE THE THINGS
THAT HAD HAPPENED TO ME HAD COME FROM PEOPLE
GOING AGAINST HIS WILL FOR MY LIFE AND THEIR LIFE
AND HAD NOT COME FROM THE LORD,
AND NEVER HAD BEEN WHAT HE WANTED FOR ME.
REBECCA: YEAH.
AND THERE'S A WHOLE WORLD OF DARKNESS AT WORK, TOO.
AND THAT EXPLAINS SO MUCH EVIL IN THE WORLD, TOO.
AND THEN PEOPLE'S OWN FREE WILL.
THAT WHOLE THING.
AND, LIKE, MONEY.
MONEY IS THE ROOT OF ALL KINDS OF EVIL
IT SAYS IN TIMOTHY, AND THAT WAS WHAT FUELS SO MUCH
OF THAT INDUSTRY IS THE LOVE OF MONEY.
AND THEY'RE WILLING TO DO TERRIBLE THINGS
TO GET THAT MONEY.
ALIA: ABSOLUTELY.
REBECCA: SO YOU GO TO THIS PROGRAM,
YOU'RE THERE FOR A YEAR.
SO WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU GET OUT?
ALIA: YEAH.
SO I WAS LUCKY ENOUGH TO GO INTO - I GOT A JOB AT A
CHRISTIAN CAMP RUNNING THEIR HORSE PROGRAM,
WHICH WAS REALLY SWEET.
REBECCA: OH, FUN!
ALIA: IT WAS SO FUN.
REBECCA: I LOVE HORSES.
ALIA: AND SO DO I.
AND THEY -
REBECCA: SO IT SOUNDS KINDA HEALING.
ALIA: IT WAS HEALING.
REBECCA: AW.
ALIA: AND IT WAS LIKE IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE.
REBECCA: AW.
THAT'S HEALING, TOO, BEING OUT IN NATURE.
ALIA: IT WAS LIKE A TRANSITIONAL STEP FOR ME.
REBECCA: THAT'S PERFECT.
ALIA: YEAH.
SO IT WAS LIKE, I REALLY WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN READY
TO JUST LIKE...
REBECCA: GO BACK OUT INTO THE FULL-BLOWN WORLD.
ALIA: NO. I WASN'T.
AND LIKE I - SO THIS LIKE FAMILY THAT RAN THE CAMP
TOOK ME IN AS LIKE THEIR DAUGHTER.
AND JUST REALLY POURED INTO ME AND TAUGHT ME ALL
OF THESE THINGS ABOUT LIFE AND OF BEING IN MINISTRY.
AND I KNEW THAT THE LORD WAS GOING TO CALL ME INTO
ANTI-TRAFFICKING MINISTRY.
I DID NOT WANT TO DO IT AT ALL, BUT I WAS LIKE,
LORD, I'LL DO WHATEVER YOU TELL ME, EXCEPT THAT.
LIKE, I'LL GO ANYWHERE, JUST NOT THERE.
AND I DIDN'T WANT TO BE IN MINISTRY - OR I DIDN'T
WANT TO WORK IN LIKE ANTI-TRAFFICKING MINISTRY
BECAUSE IT WAS JUST PAINFUL TO THINK ABOUT.
AND I JUST, LIKE, I'D BEEN GIVEN THIS NEW LIFE,
RIGHT, LIKE, I JUST WANTED TO LIVE THAT NEW LIFE.
REBECCA: THAT'S UNDERSTANDABLE.
ALIA: YEAH, IT IS.
AND THERE'S SO MANY SURVIVORS THAT DO THAT,
AND I JUST THINK LIKE I'M SO HAPPY FOR THEM
THAT THEY GET TO WALK AWAY FOREVER,
AND THEY DESERVE THAT.
BUT THAT WASN'T WHAT THE LORD WAS CALLING ME INTO.
AND I WAS STILL LIVING IN THE PROGRAM.
ACTUALLY, IT WAS MY FIRST CHRISTMAS.
AND I WENT HOME AND I WENT TO LIKE A CHRISTMAS EVE DINNER
AT THE HOME OF THE WOMAN WHO HAD BEEN
MENTORING ME, LIKE THE PASTOR'S MOM
AT THAT CHURCH, AND WE DID CHRISTMAS EVE THERE.
AND SHE HAD THIS YOUNG GIRL THAT SHE WAS MENTORING.
I THINK SHE WAS ABOUT 14 OR 15.
AND SHE WANTED ME TO TALK TO THIS GIRL AND THIS GIRL
HAD EXPERIENCED EVERYTHING THAT I HAD EXPERIENCED.
AND SHE WANTED ME TO TALK TO HER.
AND I WAS LIKE, I HAVE NOTHING TO OFFER THIS GIRL.
[ LAUGHING ]
I AM BARELY EVEN OKAY MYSELF.
I'VE BEEN OUT LESS THAN A YEAR.
LIKE, I HAVE NOTHING TO OFFER HER.
AND YET, THE LORD WORKED THROUGH ME TO,
I DON'T EVEN REMEMBER WHAT I SAID TO THIS SWEET GIRL,
I DON'T REMEMBER, BUT I DO REMEMBER LIKE THE LOOK
ON HER FACE AND THAT SHE WAS -
SHE FELT SO SEEN,
AND THAT THE LORD WAS LIKE ALLOWING ME TO BE USED
AND HIM HAVING A MOMENT WITH HER.
IT WAS LIKE HIS MOMENT WITH HER,
AND HE WAS CHOOSING TO LIKE USE ME AS THE VESSEL
TO HAVE THAT MOMENT WITH HER.
AND I WAS JUST, LIKE, IN AWE OF THAT
AND ALSO OF HER.
LIKE, HOW VIVACIOUS SHE WAS AND HOW SMART SHE WAS,
AND LIKE THIS LITTLE GIRL WHO HAD GONE THROUGH SO MUCH
AND LIKE, I FULLY BELIEVE THAT SHE WAS CAPABLE OF
TAKING OVER THE WORLD.
LIKE SHE WAS - AND SHE IS.
SHE'S SO AMAZING, STILL.
AND I WAS LIKE, OKAY.
I GET IT.
IT'S NOT ABOUT ME.
LIKE, IT'S NOT ABOUT LIKE ME DOING THIS FOR ME
BECAUSE I AM A SURVIVOR.
IT'S ABOUT THEM.
LIKE, IT'S ABOUT WHAT SHE NEEDS,
AND YOU'RE GOING TO - LIKE I'M PRIVILEGED TO, LIKE,
GET TO BE APART OF WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO DO FOR HER,
AND I DON'T WANT TO MISS OUT ON IT.
LIKE, I WANT TO WATCH.
LIKE, I WANT TO SEE THESE GIRLS AND WHAT
YOU'RE GOING TO DO AND LIKE HOWEVER YOU WANT TO DO IT.
BUT I DID FEEL LIKE THE LORD WAS LIKE, COOL.
NOW WAIT.
RIGHT.
LIKE, GREAT.
SO GLAD THAT YOU'RE ON BOARD.
NOW, SIT WITH THAT FOR A WHILE.
AND I KNEW, LIKE, WHEN IT'S TIME, LIKE, HE'S GOING TO
CALL ME INTO WORKING IN THAT FIELD.
REBECCA: HE OPENED THAT DOOR.
ALIA: AND SO THIS COUPLE THAT TAUGHT ME,
THAT LIKE BROUGHT ME IN TO WORK AT THIS CAMP,
LIKE, THEY TAUGHT ME ALL ABOUT BEING IN MINISTRY.
THEY'VE BEEN IN MINISTRY LIKE FORTY YEARS.
THEY'RE AN OLDER COUPLE.
AND LIKE MINISTRY IS CLEANING TOILETS
AND MINISTRY IS LIKE ALL OF SERVING.
AND SO I GOT TO HAVE THAT FOUNDATION, TOO.
AND THEN THEY ENCOURAGED ME TO GO TO BIBLE COLLEGE.
AND GOING TO COLLEGE WAS SOMETHING I HAD
ALWAYS WANTED TO DO.
AND SO THEY HELPED ME LIKE FILL OUT ALL
OF MY PAPERWORK TO DO THAT.
AND THEY DROVE ME THERE.
LIKE, THEY DROVE ME AND DROPPED ME OFF
AT SCHOOL IN CHICAGO.
REBECCA: AND YOU WENT TO A BIBLE COLLEGE, RIGHT?
ALIA: I DID. I WENT TO MOODY.
I WENT TO MOODY BIBLE COLLEGE.
REBECCA: WHICH IS LIKE EXTRAORDINARY BECAUSE
YOU HADN'T EVEN FINISHED HIGH SCHOOL.
SO YOU'RE ABLE TO GET YOUR GED AND GO TO COLLEGE.
ALIA: I WAS ABLE TO GET MY GED.
I GOT MY GED WHILE I WAS IN THE PROGRAM.
REBECCA: THAT'S AMAZING.
ALIA: YEAH.
AND I TOOK MY SATS WHILE I WAS THERE.
LIKE, ALL OF THESE THINGS, ALL OF THESE
SELF-DISCOVERY AND LIKE ACHIEVEMENT THINGS
THAT MOST PEOPLE WERE EXPERIENCING IN HIGH SCHOOL,
BUT I WAS BEING TRAFFICKED, RIGHT.
AND SO I, LIKE, YEAH, I WAS ABLE TO DO ALL OF THAT
AND GO TO SCHOOL.
AND MOODY IS A GREAT SCHOOL FOR LIKE
NON-CONVENTIONAL, LIKE STUDENTS LIKE THERE'S
A LOT OF 18-YEAR-OLDS AND THEN THERE'S A LOT OF
30-YEAR-OLDS AT THAT SCHOOL, TOO.
AND SO THAT WAS REALLY JUST A GOOD FIT FOR ME.
AND IT WAS A SWEET TIME, LIKE, WHERE I GOT TO LEARN
SO MUCH MORE.
AND SO MUCH MORE ABOUT LIKE THAT I HAD SO MUCH
MORE TO SAY AND SO MUCH MORE TO SHARE
THAN JUST MY STORY, TOO.
LIKE, THAT WAS SOMETHING THAT I HAD TO LEARN THERE,
THAT THERE WAS LIKE SO MUCH MORE TO THE LORD AND
WHO HE IS AND WHAT HE'S INVITING ME INTO
THAN JUST MY TESTIMONY.
AND SO THAT WAS, LIKE, REALLY SPECIAL.
AND, YEAH, I WENT TO MOODY, AND I DID A PASTORAL RESIDENCY
AT A CHURCH IN CHICAGO THAT WAS INCREDIBLE.
REBECCA: OH, MY GOSH.
THAT'S SO COOL.
ALIA: IT WAS.
IT WAS LIKE A REALLY - I GOT TO, YEAH,
LIKE MUSIC'S ALWAYS BEEN A REALLY BIG PART OF MY LIFE,
AND I WAS INVOLVED WITH LIKE A GROUP OF FRIENDS
WHERE WE WERE, LIKE, RECORDING MUSIC.
IT WAS ALL OF THESE REDEEMING TIMES FOR ME
OF THE LORD GIVING ME BACK ALL OF THESE, LIKE,
CHILDHOOD DREAMS THAT HAD BEEN STOLEN.
AND LIKE JUST USING THEM TO PREPARE ME FOR WHEN HE
WOULD EVENTUALLY CALL ME INTO MINISTRY FULL TIME.
REBECCA: SO ONE OF THE THINGS YOU TALK ABOUT
THAT'S IMPORTANT TO YOUR STORY IS FORGIVENESS.
AND YOU WERE ABLE TO HAVE LIKE A RECONCILIATION
WITH YOUR MOM.
CAN YOU TALK ABOUT THAT?
ALIA: YEAH.
AND IT WAS TWO-SIDED.
LIKE, I WAS ABLE TO, AND I THINK IT REALLY HAPPENED
BEFORE I GOT SAVED, TO BE HONEST.
LIKE, AS I BECAME A MOM AND I STARTED TO UNDERSTAND.
REBECCA: IT DOES SHIFT YOUR PERSPECTIVE.
ALIA: IT DOES.
AND STARTED TO UNDERSTAND LIKE MY OWN FAILINGS
AND JUST HOW HARD THINGS WERE.
AND THEN ALSO LIKE WHEN YOU'RE GROWING UP,
YOU DON'T THINK LIKE OF HOW OLD YOUR PARENTS ARE,
EITHER, RIGHT.
LIKE THEY'RE THE ADULT.
BUT LIKE, AS I STARTED TO HIT THE AGE THAT SHE WAS,
AT CERTAIN MILESTONES WHERE SHE'D FAILED ME
IN MY LIFE, I STARTED TO REALIZE LIKE
HOW YOUNG THAT WAS, RIGHT.
AND I'M LIKE, MY GOSH, LIKE, SHE DIDN'T KNOW.
AND WAS SHE DOING HER BEST.
AND SO EVEN BEFORE I GOT SAVED,
I STARTED TO ACCEPT HER FOR WHO SHE WAS
AND FORGIVE HER FOR THINGS.
AND THEN WHEN I GOT SAVED, SHE REALLY STEPPED IN
IN A REALLY BIG WAY WITH LIKE MY YOUNGEST
AND TAKING CUSTODY OF HIM AND WATCHING HER LIKE BECAUSE
SHE HAD ALREADY EXPERIENCED A LOT OF HEALING HERSELF.
AND SO WATCHING HER DO THAT AND LIKE REALLY BE THERE
FOR ME IN THAT WAY.
AND THEN WE'VE HAD SOME CONVERSATIONS WHERE, LIKE,
HAVE ALLOWED ME TO FORGIVE HER EVEN MORE BECAUSE
SHE'S TAKEN ACCOUNTABILITY, RIGHT.
AND, LIKE, A LOT OF THE THINGS THAT I'VE HAD
TO FORGIVE WITH PEOPLE OUTSIDE OF MY MOM,
LIKE PEOPLE WHO HURT ME, I'VE HAD TO ONLY JUST
DO THE ONE SIDE, RIGHT.
LIKE, I CAN FORGIVE THEM, I CAN KNOW THAT, LIKE,
BECAUSE THEY'RE A CHILD OF GOD.
BUT TO HAVE SOMEBODY WHO WAS A PART OF WHY I WAS HURT
ACTUALLY APOLOGIZE, LIKE IT DID ALLOW FOR
AN EXTRA LEVEL OF HEALING.
AND MORE THAN JUST FORGIVENESS,
RECONCILIATION, RIGHT.
FOR HER TO TAKE ACCOUNTABILITY FOR -
SHE KNOWS THE THINGS THAT SHE WISHES
SHE'D DONE DIFFERENTLY, AND I BELIEVE LIKE, YEAH,
HER BEST WASN'T GOOD ENOUGH,
BUT IT WAS HER BEST THAT SHE HAD AT THE TIME.
AND NOW HER BEST IS DIFFERENT.
REBECCA: YEAH.
ALIA: NOW HER BEST IS BETTER THAN THAT.
AND IT'S ALSO JUST AMAZING TO ME LIKE I,
IN SO MANY WAYS, I NEED MY MOM JUST AS MUCH NOW AS I DID.
REBECCA: IT'S TRUE.
IT'S WEIRD.
[ LAUGHING ]
ALIA: I'M LIKE, HELP!
REBECCA: A FULL-GROWN WOMAN.
LIKE, YOU STILL WANT A RELATIONSHIP WITH YOUR MOM.
THEY'RE STILL YOUR MOM.
ALIA: TOTALLY.
REBECCA: AND YOU NEED HELP IN DIFFERENT WAYS.
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: YOU NEED SOMEONE,
IF YOU CAN HAVE THAT, YOU STILL WANT THAT.
ALIA: YEAH.
AND SO SHE'S THERE NOW.
AND WE'RE LIKE, AND MY MOM'S NOT A BELIEVER,
SHE HAS A LOT OF CHURCH HURT,
LIKE THERE'S STILL A LOT THAT SHE'S UNPACKING.
BUT, LIKE, SHE BELIEVES IN MY FAITH FOR ME,
AND SHE'S WILLING TO HAVE MORE CONVERSATIONS NOW
AND BE VULNERABLE ABOUT THINGS.
AND SO WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO HAVE LIKE
REALLY OPEN COMMUNICATION.
AND SHE DOESN'T TRY AND -
ONE THING THAT'S REALLY HELPED OUR RECONCILIATION
IS SHE DOESN'T TRY AND DOWNPLAY ANYTHING.
REBECCA: THAT'S BIG.
BECAUSE THAT'S PRETTY COMMON.
ALIA: IT IS.
AND SHE DOESN'T DO THAT.
LIKE SHE - I KNOW IT'S NOT EASY FOR HER,
LIKE IT'S NOT FUN TO HEAR ABOUT THE THINGS,
AND TO HEAR ABOUT LIKE YOUR CHILD'S EXPERIENCE
AND KNOW THAT, LIKE, YOU'RE RESPONSIBLE FOR
A LOT OF THOSE THINGS.
BUT SHE'S LIKE MY BIGGEST CHEERLEADER,
SHE THINKS I'M AMAZING.
SHE, LIKE, BRAGS ABOUT ME TO EVERYONE.
AND SO DOES THE REST OF MY FAMILY, HONESTLY.
BUT IT REALLY TOOK HER LIKE BEING CONSCIOUS OF
THE THINGS THAT SHE DOES THAT STILL AREN'T PERFECT
AND LIKE MAKING AMENDS FOR THOSE THINGS.
THEY COUNTED.
THEY MATTERED.
REBECCA: SO YOU DID A RESIDENCY.
AND THEN WHERE DID YOU GO FROM THERE?
ALIA: YEAH.
SO I WAS LIKE LIVING THIS LIFE IN CHICAGO
THAT WAS SO BEAUTIFUL AND LIKE BUILDING THIS MINISTRY FIELD,
AND THE LORD CALLED ME BACK TO MY HOMETOWN.
REBECCA: THAT MUST HAVE BEEN WILD.
ALIA: IT WAS AWFUL.
AND LIKE AT FIRST -
REBECCA: BACK WHERE IT ALL HAPPENED.
ALIA: I WAS LIKE, WHY?
I DON'T WANT TO GO BACK THERE.
NOTHING GOOD HAPPENS THERE.
REBECCA: NOT GO BACK.
ALIA: YEAH.
AND I FELT LIKE, I FEEL LIKE THE LORD LIKE
SHOWED ME JONAH AND, LIKE, THAT THIS WAS LIKE MY FIG TREE;
THAT MY LIFE IN CHICAGO WAS LIKE MY FIG TREE.
AND HE'S LIKE, I MADE THIS AND I CAN TAKE THIS AWAY.
LIKE, ARE YOU - BECAUSE I WAS VERY MUCH LIKE,
NOTHING GOOD HAPPENS THERE.
LIKE, THAT WAS HOW I FELT.
REBECCA: BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT YOU EXPERIENCED.
ALIA: YEAH.
LIKE, NOTHING GOOD HAPPENS THERE.
THAT'S LIKE AN UNREDEEMABLE PLACE FOR ME.
BUT HE WAS CALLING ME BACK.
AND SO I'M LIKE, WELL, I HAVE TO BE OBEDIENT.
BECAUSE I HAD ALWAYS KNOWN LIKE THAT HE WAS GOING TO.
I'VE ALWAYS FELT LIKE THE LORD'S GOING TO CALL ME BACK,
BUT I NEED HIM TO BE CLEAR.
AND HE DID THAT.
AND IT WAS, I WAS LIKE,
FELT LIKE I WAS THROWING A TANTRUM,
LIKE, I DON'T WANT TO GO.
BUT AS THAT HAPPENED, LIKE AS SOON AS I STEPPED
INTO HIS WILL IN THAT, AND I WAS LIKE, OKAY, LIKE, I'LL GO,
EVERYTHING - IT WAS LIKE A MOMENT OF HARVEST FOR ME
WHERE HE STARTED FULFILLING A LOT OF PROMISES
IN MY LIFE THAT I HAD FELT LIKE HE'D SPOKEN
FROM A VERY - FROM EARLIER ON,
LIKE THINGS WITH MY KIDS.
AND IT WAS AT THAT TIME, AS WELL,
THAT I GOT OFFERED THIS JOB WITH SAFE HOUSE PROJECT
THAT I'M IN NOW.
I HAD ALREADY WORKED WITH THEM LIKE IN A CONSULTING SPACE
AND BEEN CONNECTED WITH THEM.
BUT I CALLED THEM, ACTUALLY, AND WAS LIKE,
HEY, I'M MAKING THIS MOVE, DO YOU HAPPEN TO KNOW
ANYBODY IN THE AREA THAT MIGHT BE A GOOD FIT
THAT I SHOULD LOOK AT FOR LIKE A MINISTRY POSITION?
AND THEY'RE LIKE, WE WERE JUST PRAYING OVER THIS.
WE JUST OPENED THIS POSITION.
WE WANT YOU FOR THIS POSITION.
AND SO IT WAS JUST LIKE, IT WAS VERY MUCH THE LORD
WAS LIKE, AND NOW IT'S GO TIME.
NOW I'M CALLING YOU INTO LIKE ANTI-TRAFFICKING FULL TIME.
AND SO -
REBECCA: AND YOU FELT READY FOR IT NOW?
ALIA: I DID.
YEAH, IT WAS ALSO TRIAL BY FIRE.
IT WAS LIKE DRINKING OUT OF A FIRE HOSE, FOR SURE.
MY FIRST FEW MONTHS, I WAS LIKE,
WHAT THE HECK AM I DOING HERE?
BUT OUR LEADERSHIP, WE WERE SUCH A SMALL TEAM
AT THAT POINT.
WE'VE GROWN LIKE -
REBECCA: IS THAT WHO YOU DID THE PROGRAM WITH?
WAS IT WITH SAFE HOUSE?
ALIA: NO.
REBECCA: OKAY.
ALIA: NO. ONE OF THEIR PARTNER PROGRAMS.
SO I WENT THROUGH REFUGE FOR WOMEN,
WHICH IS A PARTNER OF SAFE HOUSE PROGRAM.
REBECCA: SO SAFE HOUSE LIKE HELPS OTHER -
THEY HELP MULTIPLE PROGRAMS ACROSS THE NATION
WITH RESOURCING AND ALL THAT KIND OF STUFF LIKE THAT.
ALIA: EXACTLY.
REBECCA: SO THAT'S WHAT'S SO COOL ABOUT THEM.
SO IT WASN'T TECHNICALLY THE PROGRAM,
BUT THEY'RE PARTNERS.
SO IT'S LIKE YOU WERE WORKING FOR THE PEOPLE
WHO HELPED -
ALIA: AND THE GUY WHO STARTED REFUGE FOR WOMEN
IS THE ONE WHO HAD INTRODUCED ME TO
SAFE HOUSE PROJECT, AND LIKE -
SO IT WAS VERY INTERCONNECTED.
REBECCA: THAT'S SO COOL.
IT'S LIKE IN THE FAMILY.
ALIA: IT WAS, YEAH.
IT WAS, DEFINITELY LIKE IN THE FAMILY.
AND SO THESE WOMEN, THESE TWO WOMEN THAT FOUNDED
SAFE HOUSE PROJECT, THEY JUST - I HAD NO IDEA
WHAT I WAS DOING.
I KNEW VERY LITTLE ABOUT THIS INDUSTRY
AND THE FIELD.
AND THEY BROUGHT ME INTO ALL OF THESE MEETINGS.
THEY JUST LET ME LIKE DRINK FROM THE FIRE HOSE
AND GAVE ME A PLATFORM THAT I THINK THE LORD
HAD BEEN PREPARING ME FOR,
THAT ALLOWED ME TO SPEAK ON THIS
AT A NATIONAL LEVEL AND TO ADVOCATE FOR PEOPLE
ON A NATIONAL LEVEL.
AND THE ROOMS THAT I'VE BEEN ABLE TO BE IN IN THAT TIME,
LIKE I'VE SPOKEN AT THE CAPITOL BUILDING,
LIKE SPOKEN TO U.K. PARLIAMENT TWICE.
LIKE, ALL OF THESE THINGS.
REBECCA: THAT'S PRETTY NERVE-WRACKING.
ALIA: IT IS.
BUT AT THE SAME TIME, AND I HAD THIS CONVERSATION
WITH A FRIEND OF MINE THAT I HAD DINNER WITH LAST NIGHT
WHILE I WAS HERE, IT'S LIKE,
WHEN YOU'RE UNQUALIFIED FOR SOMETHING,
YOU CAN REST ASSURED THAT THE LORD HAS
PLACED YOU THERE, RIGHT.
LIKE IF YOU'RE UNQUALIFIED,
IT'S ALMOST LIKE THE PRESSURE'S OFF.
I'D BE LIKE -
REBECCA: BECAUSE YOU'RE LIKE,
I'M NOT DOING THIS IN MY STRENGTH.
I'M DOING THIS IN THE LORD.
LIKE HE OPENED THIS DOOR.
ALIA: EXACTLY.
CLEARLY, THE LORD HAS SOMETHING TO SAY.
CLEARLY THE LORD HAS SOMETHING TO DO HERE.
BECAUSE, LOOK, HE KNOWS I HAVE NO IDEA
WHAT I'M DOING.
SO THAT JUST ALLOWS ME TO BE LIKE,
WELL, I DON'T HAVE TO DO IT IN MY OWN STRENGTH, RIGHT.
REBECCA: AND YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO.
ALIA: NO.
REBECCA: AND THAT KEEPS YOU HUMBLE BECAUSE
THAT'S THE KEY.
ALIA: EXACTLY.
REBECCA: BECAUSE IT'S LIKE GETTING INTO
THESE PLACES OF INFLUENCE, IT COULD EASILY
GET TO YOUR HEAD.
AND THAT'S WHAT I WAS THINKING IS WHEN THE LORD
WAS LIKE, WHEN HE GAVE YOU THAT TASTE WITH THAT GIRL,
TALKING TO HER FOR THE FIRST TIME
AT THE CHRISTMAS EVE DINNER, YOU WERE LIKE,
OH, I THINK I DO WANT TO DO THIS.
HE'S LIKE, OKAY, GREAT.
BUT WAIT.
BECAUSE HE WAS PREPARING YOU THAT WHEN HE
OPENED THOSE DOORS, YOU WERE GROUNDED IN HIM.
SO IT WOULDN'T AFFECT YOU.
YOU COULD STAY IN THIS PLACE OF LIKE, OKAY, LORD.
WHATEVER YOU WANT ME TO DO, LIKE YOU'RE
MY SUFFICIENCY.
I DON'T HAVE TO DO THIS IN MY OWN STRENGTH.
IT'S ALL THE THINGS HE PREPARES.
THAT PERIOD OF TESTING AND TRIAL AND EDUCATION
AND BUILDING IS SO IMPORTANT.
AND IT'S LIKE, FOR ANYONE WHO'S LISTENING IS LIKE,
DON'T SKIP THAT STEP.
FOLLOW THE LORD.
AND YOU CAN SPEAK TO THAT.
ALIA: YES.
AND I TELL - BECAUSE I MENTOR WOMEN AND GIRLS NOW,
AND THAT'S WHAT I TELL - BECAUSE I THINK
SO MANY ARE LIKE, I JUST WANT TO GIVE BACK.
REBECCA: I'M READY.
ALIA: I'M READY, AND I'M LIKE, YOU'RE - WAIT, WAIT!
JUST WAIT!
LIKE, AND CHERISH THOSE TIMES,
LIKE, CHERISH THAT TIME.
REBECCA: IT IS A REALLY SWEET TIME.
ALIA: LIKE HOW MUCH - LIKE WHEN I TELL WOMEN
AS I'M TELLING THEM TO LIKE GO INTO A PROGRAM OF GIRLS,
LIKE, HOW OFTEN ARE YOU GOING TO HAVE A YEAR
OF YOUR LIFE WHERE YOU DON'T HAVE TO PAY BILLS,
AND YOU CAN JUST FOCUS ON GROWING AND BEING HEALED
AND -
REBECCA: EXPERIENCING TIME WITH THE LORD.
ALIA: YEAH.
YOU KNOW HOW HARD IT IS, LIKE TO SPEND ENOUGH TIME
WITH THE LORD, LIKE HOW INTENTIONAL I HAVE TO BE NOW
AND HOW MANY OTHER VOICES THERE ARE TO HAVE THAT.
REBECCA: YOU HAVE SO MUCH GOING ON NOW.
NOW YOU HAVE TO TRY TO MAKE TIME TO KEEP THAT.
THAT'S A WHOLE OTHER THING.
ALIA: IT IS.
REBECCA: AND I WENT THROUGH - I COMPLETELY
CAN RELATE TO THAT.
I WENT THROUGH LIKE MY TIME OF WHEN I WAS SINGLE
AND I WAS GOING TO BIBLE SCHOOL AND I HAD ALL MY TIME
TO DO THAT, AND IT WAS SUCH A SWEET SEASON.
AND NOW THAT WHEN YOU'RE A MOM AND YOU'RE WORKING,
AND THIS AND YOUR MINISTRY, IT'S LIKE ALL THESE PLAYS,
AND YOU'RE LIKE, AH!
ALIA: EVERYTHING.
THERE'S EVERYTHING THAT WANTS YOUR ATTENTION, YEAH.
AND IT'S ALL GOOD THINGS, RIGHT.
REBECCA: IT'S GOOD THINGS, YEAH.
ALIA: IT'S SUCH GOOD THINGS.
BUT LIKE TO HAVE THAT TIME, LIKE YOU CAN'T,
IF YOU DON'T HAVE THAT, YOU CAN'T POUR IT OUT
ON OTHER PEOPLE.
REBECCA: NO.
ALIA: RIGHT.
I'M LIKE, I HAD INCREDIBLE EXAMPLES.
LIKE THE PEOPLE THAT MENTORED ME,
THE PEOPLE THAT TAUGHT ME WHAT IT WAS LIKE TO BE
A LEADER WERE LIKE - HAD WORKED IN MEGA CHURCHES,
HAD BEEN MEGA CHURCH PASTORS WHERE OTHER PASTORS
HAD LIKE FALLEN FROM GRACE AND, LIKE, BEEN EXPOSED,
HAD EXPERIENCED ALL OF THOSE THINGS.
AND SO WE'RE COMING FROM A PLACE OF LIKE BEING
REALLY INTENTIONAL IN THEIR OWN INTEGRITY
AND THEIR OWN PREPARATION.
AND SO THAT WAS LIKE THE LEADERSHIP THAT I HAD
THE INCREDIBLE BLESSING TO LEARN FROM.
AND SO I ALWAYS TRY AND TEACH THAT TO
THE WOMEN THAT I MENTOR.
AND THE WOMEN THAT I WORK WITH AT SAFE HOUSE PROJECT
AND OUR CO-FOUNDERS, ARE INCREDIBLE, LIKE,
EXAMPLES OF LEADERSHIP.
SO I'VE REALLY BEEN SPOILED, HONESTLY.
REBECCA: YEAH.
I REALLY FEEL LIKE GOD REALLY PUT YOU INTO FAMILY,
LIKE INTO HIS FAMILY.
ALIA: OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
REBECCA: THAT'S WHAT I LOVE ABOUT YOUR STORY,
LIKE ONE OF THE ASPECTS THAT I LOVE IS HE WAS LIKE,
I'M GOING TO PUT YOU WITH THESE SAFE PEOPLE
WHO ARE GOING TO LOVE YOU AND TEACH YOU,
AND HE GAVE THAT.
IT'S LIKE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, BEAUTY FOR ASHES.
IT'S LIKE, WHAT WE LACK, WHAT THE ENEMY TRIES
TO TAKE FROM US, IT'S LIKE HE RESTORES TO US.
LIKE THIS STORY OF JOB,
IT'S LIKE HE RESTORES, LIKE, SEVEN-FOLD.
ALIA: AND SO LIKE I GOT BACK HOME, RIGHT,
TO THIS AREA THAT I'M FROM WHERE ALL THIS TERRIBLE
THING WAS, AND I GOT THE CHANCE TO BE INVOLVED WITH
ANOTHER ORGANIZATION THAT'S LIKE A
BOOTS-ON-THE-GROUND ORGANIZATION THERE.
AND THAT'S WHO LIKE THIS GIRL THAT I HAD MET,
THAT'S WHO SHE HAD BEEN RECEIVING SERVICES FROM
AND GETTING HELPED BY.
SO THERE WAS LIKE A MINISTRY IN THE AREA
THAT WORKS WITH YOUNG GIRLS LIKE WHERE I'M FROM.
AND THAT'S BEEN THIS WHOLE OTHER THING, TO BE LIKE,
OKAY, IT'S ONE THING TO HAVE LIKE THIS LIKE
NATIONAL PLATFORM WHERE WE'RE WORKING
TO SERVE PEOPLE ON THIS GRAND SCALE,
AND IT'S ANOTHER THING TO BE ABLE TO BE LIKE,
THIS IS A GIRL FROM MY NEIGHBORHOOD.
LIKE, THIS IS A GIRL WHO LOOKS LIKE ME,
WHO TALKS LIKE ME, WHO'S LIKE BEEN ON THE SAME LIKE
STREET THAT I'VE BEEN ON, LIKE WENT TO THE SAME SCHOOLS
THAT I WENT TO, AND TO LIKE WE'RE HELPING -
AND THERE SHE IS.
REBECCA: YEAH.
IT'S LIKE LOOKING AT A YOUNGER VERSION OF YOU
AND YOU'RE LIKE, I'VE BEEN THERE.
ALIA: EXACTLY.
REBECCA: DID IT FEEL LIKE FULL CIRCLE,
GETTING TO HELP GIRLS THAT WERE FROM THE SAME AREA AS YOU
GOING THROUGH THE SAME THINGS YOU WENT THROUGH
AND HELP BRING THEM OUT?
ALIA: ABSOLUTELY.
IT FEELS LIKE - SO THIS PROGRAM THAT THIS MINISTRY
THAT I WORK WITH AT HOME, FOREVER FOUND,
THEY ALSO HAVE A HOME IN INDIA, RIGHT.
AND SO THERE'S A WOMAN -
REBECCA: OH, WOW.
ALIA: YEAH.
AND SO THERE'S A WOMAN ON THE TEAM WHO IS FROM INDIA,
AND SHE WAS TALKING LIKE A COUPLE OF WEEKS AGO
ABOUT HOW SHE HAD BEEN TO THE HOME IN INDIA
AND HOW IT WAS LIKE ALL OF THE GIRLS WERE LIKE, JUST LIKE,
OH, MY GOSH, YOU LOOK LIKE ME, MADAM, MADAM.
AND JUST LIKE, ALL OF THOSE THINGS,
AND HOW THEY HAD FELT MORE CONNECTED WITH HER
BECAUSE SHE LOOKED LIKE THEM
AND SHE WAS FROM WHERE THEY'RE FROM.
AND I WAS JUST THINKING ABOUT HER SAYING THAT,
AND I'M LIKE, THAT'S HOW I FEEL ABOUT -
REBECCA: WHERE YOU'RE AT NOW.
ALIA: THESE GIRLS.
LIKE, I DON'T -
THAT'S WHAT THEY SEE WHEN THEY LOOK AT ME,
IS LIKE THIS ISN'T JUST LIKE SOME WOMAN WHO HASN'T
BEEN HERE AND HASN'T LIKE, THEY KNOW THAT LIKE -
THEY FEEL THE SAME THING TOWARDS ME THAT
THOSE LITTLE GIRLS FELT TOWARDS HER.
AND I FEEL THE SAME WAY TOWARDS THEM.
LIKE THESE ARE MY, LIKE THESE ARE MY GIRLS.
LIKE, THESE ARE MY PEOPLE.
THESE ARE MY, LIKE, THESE ARE MY KIDS.
LIKE, THESE ARE LIKE, THESE ARE HIS KIDS,
LIKE, THESE ARE THE LORD'S CHILDREN.
AND GETTING TO WATCH THEM LIKE STRUGGLE AND OVERCOME,
IT FEELS LIKE AN INCREDIBLE PRIVILEGE
TO KNOW THEM AND TO BE LIKE A SAFE PERSON
IN THEIR LIFE.
LIKE, THERE'S THAT LIKE, BE THE PERSON THAT YOU
WISH YOU HAD, RIGHT.
LIKE, I'M JUST LIKE WHAT AN INCREDIBLE HONOR IT IS
TO GET TO BE THAT PERSON, LIKE TO BE IN A POSITION
WHERE I GET TO HAVE THAT LEVEL OF INFLUENCE
OVER THEM AND OVER THESE YOUNG GIRLS.
AND LIKE THAT IS - I FEEL THE WEIGHT OF THAT PRIVILEGE
AND I'M LIKE, AND IN THAT LIKE
KEEPING US HUMBLE, LIKE I HOPE THAT I ALWAYS FEEL
THE WEIGHT OF THAT PRIVILEGE.
AND KNOWING THEM I THINK ALSO HELPS ME KEEP IT
LIKE, ON THE NATIONAL PLATFORM, AS WELL,
BECAUSE IT BRINGS IT BACK, RIGHT.
REBECCA: THIS IS STILL HAPPENING.
ALIA: YEAH.
AND SO I WAS TAUGHT BY PASTORS LIKE THAT BROUGHT ME UP
LIKE, WELL, THE LORD GAVE ME - THE LORD ALLOWS ME
TO TEACH ON THE STAGE BECAUSE HE KNOWS I'D BE
DOING THE SAME THING LIKE ON THE STREET, RIGHT.
LIKE, THAT'S THE WAY THAT I WAS TAUGHT.
AND SO FOR ME, LIKE BEING INVOLVED WITH THOSE GIRLS
FEELS LIKE THE SAME WAY, LIKE THE LORD ALLOWS ME
TO CONTINUE TO BE IN SPACES THAT I FEEL LIKE
I HAVE NO BUSINESS BEING IN OR TO BE ON PLATFORMS.
REBECCA: TO ADVOCATE FOR THEM.
ALIA: TO ADVOCATE FOR THEM.
AND BECAUSE HE KNOWS THAT I'M WILLING TO DO IT
LIKE, IN PRIVATE, AS WELL.
YOU KNOW.
REBECCA: IT'S TRUE. EXACTLY.
IT SAYS, THE VERSE SAYS,
IF YOU'RE FAITHFUL IN THE SMALL THINGS, HE'LL -
IF YOU PROVE YOU'RE FAITHFUL,
THEN YOU CAN BE FAITHFUL IN THE BIGGER THINGS.
AND IT'S TRUE.
IT'S THAT - IT'S WHO YOU ARE WHEN NO ONE'S WATCHING,
BUT HE'S WATCHING.
THAT'S WHAT MATTERS.
AND HE SEES YOUR HEART AND HE'S KEEPING YOU
IN THIS WORLD.
AND LIKE YOU SAID, BECAUSE YOU GET THIS FRESH PERSPECTIVE,
YOU'RE ABLE TO GO OUT AND CONTINUE TO
ADVOCATE FOR THOSE WOMEN WHO NEED AN ADVOCATE
WHO CAN BE A SPOKESPERSON.
AND NOT MANY PEOPLE NOT ONLY GET OUT OF THE WORLD,
BUT THEN COME TO A PLACE WHERE THEY'RE ABLE TO GET
SO MUCH HEALING AND FREEDOM THAT THEY'RE ABLE
TO THEN SPEAK OUT.
ALIA: WELL, AND NOT EVERY PERSON WANTS TO, EITHER.
LIKE, THERE'S A LACK OF PRIVACY.
LIKE, I DON'T HAVE SOCIAL MEDIA ANYMORE BECAUSE -
REBECCA: GIRL, I DON'T BLAME YOU FOR THAT.
YOU AIN'T MISSING ANYTHING.
ALIA: NO, I'M NOT.
REBECCA: SOCIAL MEDIA STINKS.
[ LAUGHING ]
ALIA: I'M NOT.
BUT PEOPLE ARE LIKE, PEOPLE HAVE WEIRD WAYS
OF SHOWING THINGS.
AND, LIKE, I THINK THEIR LIKE, INTENTION IS OFTEN GOOD,
BUT I WOULD DO LIKE THINGS LIKE THIS,
LIKE PODCASTS OR WHATEVER,
AND GET LIKE REALLY WEIRD MESSAGES AFTER
AND LIKE REALLY INAPPROPRIATE THINGS
THAT PEOPLE THINK ARE LIKE OKAY TO SAY.
AND LIKE NOT EVERY PERSON WANTS TO STEP INTO THOSE SPACES
AND HAVE THOSE DOORS OPEN AND, LIKE,
HAVE PEOPLE KNOW.
REBECCA: THAT KIND OF EXPOSURE.
ALIA: NO.
AND THAT'S OKAY.
LIKE, THAT'S FINE.
LIKE, NOT - GOD'S NOT GOING TO CALL EVERY SINGLE PERSON.
NO.
AND HE DOESN'T NEED TO.
AND LIKE - AND SO I ALSO FEEL LIKE REALLY GRATEFUL
TO THE LORD THAT HE LIKE ALLOWS ME TO SHARE MY STORY
BECAUSE I KNOW IT'S NOT JUST MY STORY.
LIKE, MY STORY IS SO TYPICAL,
LIKE IT'S NOT LIKE THE THINGS THAT HAPPENED TO ME
ARE THE THINGS THAT HAPPEN TO SO MANY WOMEN
WHO ARE TRAFFICKED OR EXPLOITED.
AND BOYS.
AND SO LIKE WHEN I TELL MY STORY,
I FEEL LIKE I GET TO TAKE THE HIT FOR OTHER GIRLS
TO NOT HAVE TO DO IT.
BECAUSE IT IS A BURDEN.
LIKE, I'M LUCKY ENOUGH THAT I HAVE GREAT MENTORS
OF OTHER WOMEN WHO HAVE LEFT THE LIFE AND GONE ON
TO HAVE PLATFORMS AND THEY'VE TAUGHT ME A LOT OF, LIKE,
HOW TO PROTECT MYSELF AND THINGS.
BUT IT'S LIKE, IT'S NOT ALWAYS THE MOST
FUN THING TO DO.
REBECCA: YEAH.
ALIA: SO LIKE REALLY BEING SURE THAT LIKE THE LORD
IS CALLING SOMEONE INTO IT.
REBECCA: EXACTLY.
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: IT WOULDN'T BE WORKING IF HE HAD NOT
GIVEN YOU THE GRACE TO DO IT.
AND THAT IS KEY.
ALIA: YEAH.
REBECCA: AND THAT'S - BUT YOU KEEP GOING BECAUSE
YOU WANT TO KEEP HELPING -
BECAUSE THE LORD'S CALLED YOU TO IT,
HE'S GRACED YOU FOR IT, AND LIKE YOU SAID,
YOU HAVE THOSE PEOPLE THAT YOU'RE STILL MEETING
AND HEARING THOSE STORIES, YOU'RE STILL ADVOCATING FOR.
I JUST WANTED TO SAY, THANK YOU SO MUCH
FOR BEING SO OPEN.
THANK YOU FOR SHARING YOUR STORY.
IT'S A REALLY GOOD POINT.
YOU ARE REPRESENTING SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE.
AND IT'S IMPORTANT THAT NOT ONLY ARE YOU
SHEDDING LIGHT ON THESE INDUSTRIES IN THIS WORLD
THAT SO MANY PEOPLE DON'T SEE,
BUT YET IT'S SO PREVALENT.
BUT ALSO IT'S IMPORTANT THAT YOU'RE SPEAKING FOR
SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE AND THAT YOU'RE SAYING,
THIS IS VERY COMMON AND THAT MY STORY IS
SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE'S STORIES.
BECAUSE PEOPLE COULD THINK, OH, WOW.
BUT IT'S JUST HER.
BUT YOU'RE LIKE, NO, IT'S COMMON.
AND NOT ONLY YOU MET PEOPLE LIKE THAT IN THAT INDUSTRY,
YOU MET PEOPLE LIKE THAT NOW
THAT YOU'RE WORKING TO HELP BRING OUT OF IT,
YOU KNOW, BEING TRAFFICKED.
AND SO IT IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE THERE AREN'T MANY PEOPLE
WHO ARE SHARING THEIR STORIES BECAUSE IT'S,
LIKE YOU SAID, IT'S DIFFICULT.
SO I WANT TO SAY THANK YOU FOR SHARING
YOUR STORY WITH US.
AND I'M SO PROUD OF YOU.
I'M SO HAPPY TO SEE HOW GOD'S LIKE FULL-CIRCLED
YOUR LIFE AND EVERYTHING THAT YOU'RE DOING,
AND YOUR FAMILY AND JUST, IT'S SO BEAUTIFUL.
FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE LISTENING WHO ARE
DEALING WITH SHAME, PEOPLE MAY HAVE BEEN ABUSED,
PEOPLE WHO MIGHT BE IN THE INDUSTRY
WHO ARE LISTENING TO THIS,
WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO THEM?
ALIA: YEAH.
I THINK, FOR ONE, I KNOW THAT I FELT TOO FAR GONE
AND I KNOW THAT THAT'S A LIE THAT THE ENEMY
AND THAT PEOPLE WHO WANT TO HURT US CONTINUE TO USE.
AND SO THERE'S NO SUCH THING.
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS TOO FAR GONE.
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS SOMEONE WHO HAS GONE TOO DEEP
OR TOO DARK TO EXPERIENCE REDEMPTION,
BUT ALSO FREEDOM AND A NEW LIFE.
LIKE THE LORD HAS A LIFE PREPARED FOR US.
HE HAD SOMETHING WRITTEN FOR US BEFORE
ALL OF THIS BROKENNESS CAME INTO YOUR LIFE, INTO MY LIFE.
AND THAT HASN'T BEEN DESTROYED.
LIKE UNTIL THE DAY THAT WE DIE,
LIKE HE'S HOLDING THAT PLACE FOR US.
AND HE'S CAPABLE OF THINGS LIKE, LIKE WHO I AM NOW,
PEOPLE LOOK AT ME AND SAY LIKE,
I NEVER COULD HAVE SEEN THAT HAPPENING,
LIKE YOU'RE SO, LIKE I SEEM LIKE I FIT.
THAT WASN'T THE CASE.
LIKE THAT, I WAS NOT THIS PERSON WHEN I EXITED.
IT WASN'T LIKE I HAD A LEG UP OR I HAD SOMETHING
ABOUT ME THAT MADE THIS TRUE FOR ME.
LIKE, IT'S BECAUSE OF THE RESTORING WORK THAT THE LORD
DOES AND THAT HE INVITES US INTO AND THAT
HE'S OFFERING FOR ALL OF US.
AND THERE'S SO MUCH PAIN.
PAIN IS RELATIVE TO A PERSON, RIGHT.
AND LIKE JUST BECAUSE LIKE I WAS TRAFFICKED,
LIKE, I WAS ALSO SEXUALLY ABUSED.
I WAS ALSO ABANDONED, LIKE I ALSO EXPERIENCED
THESE OTHER KINDS OF PAIN THAT I UNDERSTAND LIKE CAUSE
REALLY DEEP HURT, EVEN IF YOU HAVEN'T,
EVEN IF IT DOESN'T EVER GET TO THE POINT
WHERE YOU WERE TRAFFICKED OR EXPLOITED
IN THAT TYPE OF A WAY.
AND LIKE THERE'S THE PROMISE OF HEALING
FOR ALL OF THOSE THINGS.
AND I THINK THAT LIKE SOMETIMES THE GOSPEL
GETS PUT TO US IN A WAY
THAT'S LIKE, TURN FROM YOUR SINS,
LIKE, THE LORD HAS THAT FOR YOUR SINS.
BUT WHAT ABOUT THE TIMES WHEN LIKE YOU'RE A PERSON
WHO YOUR FIRST EXPERIENCE WITH SIN
OR UNDERSTANDING SIN WAS SOMEBODY SINNING AGAINST YOU?
RIGHT?
LIKE, SOMETIMES IT'S REALLY HARD, LIKE YOU SAID,
TO UNDERSTAND LIKE HOW DOES, LIKE, HOW IS THE LORD
THERE FOR ME WHEN I WAS JUST A KID,
LIKE, WHEN SOMEBODY HURT ME?
I WASN'T HURTING OTHER PEOPLE.
AND, LIKE, I JUST WANT TO SAY THAT TO THAT PERSON
BECAUSE I KNOW THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE THINKING LIKE
THE PROMISE OF LIKE A RELATIONSHIP WITH THE LORD
IS SO GREATER THAN LIKE TURNING AWAY FROM SIN, RIGHT.
THE PROMISE OF A RELATIONSHIP WITH THE LORD
IS A PROMISE FOR COMFORT.
IT'S A PROMISE FOR CARE.
IT'S A PROMISE OF FAMILY AND OF HOME.
AND LIKE THOSE ARE THINGS THAT HE HAS WAITING FOR YOU
AND THAT HE WANTS FOR EACH OF US.
AND THERE ARE SO MANY FAMILIES THAT THE LORD
CAN AND WILL PLACE YOU INTO.
I'VE PROBABLY HAD LIKE SEVEN FAMILIES AT THIS POINT.
AND THAT HE RESTORES THOSE THINGS.
AND THERE'S A PROMISE OF HOPE JUST AS MUCH AS
THERE'S A PROMISE OF FREEDOM.
REBECCA: I LOVE THAT.
FOR PEOPLE WHO WANT TO KNOW MORE ABOUT WHO
YOU'RE WORKING FOR, SAFE HOUSE PROJECT,
OR WHO WANT TO GET CONNECTED, HOW DO THEY DO THAT?
ALIA: YEAH.
SO FIRST OFF, IT'S SAFEHOUSEPROJECT.ORG.
VERY EASY.
SAFEHOUSEPROJECT.ORG.
AND YOU CAN LEARN MORE ABOUT WHAT WE DO THERE.
AND THEN WE ALSO LIKE, WE PARTNER WITH
OVER 250 PROGRAMS.
SO IF YOU'RE WANTING TO GET INVOLVED WITH SOMEONE
THAT'S SERVING SURVIVORS IN YOUR AREA,
THE PEOPLE WHO ARE BEING EXPLOITED IN YOUR AREA,
BECAUSE I PROMISE, THIS TOUCHES EVERY SINGLE COMMUNITY,
THERE ARE JUST AS TERRIBLE AS IT IS
THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE BEING TRAFFICKED IN EVERY COMMUNITY,
THERE ARE ALSO PEOPLE DOING GOOD WORK
IN EVERY COMMUNITY.
AND BECAUSE WE ARE PARTNERING WITH THEM,
WE CAN TELL YOU LIKE WHO ARE THOSE PEOPLE IN YOUR AREA
THAT ARE DOING INCREDIBLE WORK.
WE'RE HERE IN DALLAS,
I JUST HAD DINNER WITH A WOMAN
THAT RUNS A PROGRAM HERE IN DALLAS YESTERDAY.
THERE IS PEOPLE DOING WONDERFUL WORK EVERYWHERE,
AND THERE IS NO GIFT THAT IS TOO BIG OR TOO SMALL.
EVERY HAND IS CALLED INTO THIS BECAUSE IT IS
IN THE END, THE LORD'S WORK.
AND SO REACH OUT TO US, AND WE CAN GET CONNECTED -
CONNECT YOU TO YOUR LOCAL AREA PROVIDER, AS WELL.
REBECCA: THAT'S AWESOME.
WELL, THANK YOU SO MUCH.
ALIA: YEAH, THANKS FOR HAVING ME.